Best engine Managment for turbo

[beyond-redline]

I work with a shop that is doing a complete build up of a 420A eclipse. Engine is being gone through with good internals, cams, etc. Turbo will be sized for between 400 and 500 WHP.

Only problem is that I can't seem to figure out what engine management to use. It seems the 420 eclipse is very limited as far as options. I need more reliable that a mega-squirt, this is for a customer, and I've read that an S-afc can't pull enough pulse width to run larger injectors.

So my question, whats the best option? Portfueler? Does anyone know what just a portfueler sells for alone without their kit? Like I said, I'm looking for the best option to reliably run this car.

thanks for any help anyone can provide.

Tim

 

[VelocitàPaola]

What do you mean "without their kit"? If you don't buy the PortFueler kit, what do you intend to buy?

Most versions of Megasquirt are actually really reliable and stable, however, I can understand that you wouldn't want to use something labeled "experimental" if you'll be giving it to a customer.

Other than MS, you're basically stuck with PortFueler, unless you want to spend big money on an AEM EMS or Haltech ECU (both of which actually offer less supported than Megasquirt).


And the problem with the S-AFC isn't just that it can't "pull enough" injector pulse width... I've posted why the S-AFC isn't a good choice for turbocharged 420As numerous times, you'll just have to search through my posts for the term "S-AFC."

 

[beyond-redline]

"What do you mean "without their kit"? If you don't buy the PortFueler kit, what do you intend to buy?"



I meant without buying thier complete turbo kit.

I will research the AFC issue and become better informed

Thanks

 

[VelocitàPaola]

I don't think they even sell their PortFueler system as apart of their turbo kit.

http://www.hahnracecraft.com/auto/engine/Portfueler.htm

 

[BigRand]

yeah for the customer, the porterfuler is the best option. a simple 8 injector setup, and get it tuned and dialed in correctly, and send them on their way. Your not taking anything away from the stock fuel system, just adding to the boosted part.

 

[drivemusicnow]

Well, the BEST option would probably be something like autronic. I am not familiar with the NTs enough to comment on the best value option.

 

[4UH8ERS]

+1 for portfueler

 

[cs82685]

+1 for portfueler

+2, for a customer it's definetly your best bet. You don't have to worry about them coming back to you saying "I can't pass emissions/inspection" and if they're paying for it, then I'd much rather just use that then waste my time learning all about MS, installing, and tuning. Yes you're gonna have to install and tune w/portfueler, but I think it will take much less time.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

You don't even really have to tune with PortFueler as long as you tell Hahn exactly the sizes of your injectors. They're able to program the control unit to accurately control whatever you specify.

 

[Blitzeclips]

Well, you could always go the other route, which surprisingly enough has not been mentioned...

SFMU, xxx injectors, FPR, SAFC (maybe)...

Although it may not hold past 20 psi, it's still an option if your customer is on a budget..

 

[VelocitàPaola]

That probably won't even go past 16psi. I'd be surprised to see that setup produce more than 350WHP.

 

[Blitzeclips]

I'd be surprised to see that setup produce more than 350WHP.

So would I.

 

[4UH8ERS]

Does anyone know what just a portfueler sells for alone without their kit?
thanks for any help anyone can provide.
Tim

** FYI **

Complete Portfueler System for Talon\Eclipse\Neon Stage V (20G Turbo) $1045.40.

CALL 630-553-6830 to place an order

 

[DSM-ZERO]

you could go full standalone........and get an Electromotive Tec 3R

 

[ez@2gnt]

If you are getting a turbo to support that much HP, you have high expectations for your final setup. The AFC will not take you there. You either want the portfueler or a standalone. MS is actually the best (and very reliable) option, but sounds like you are building this for someone else and do not want to go that route.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Nice to see you on DSMTuners Ez...

 

[cs82685]

Nice to see you on DSMTuners Ez...

He left 2gnt because of all the bullshit over there over the last few days He and Terry aren't speaking

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Ha... their little April fool's day prank will lead to the rise of the DSMTuners 420A section!

 

[bullettdsm]

He left 2gnt because of all the bullshit over there over the last few days He and Terry aren't speaking

Heh, heh, heh!
MB

 

[Slippi84]

for how easy it is to pick up 450's off a stock 1g 4g63 guy(hell i gave mine away when I went 950's) is there any way that you can run something that size without some crazy stand a lone ecu system or 4 more injectors? And I know the ill effects of the safc on timing curve but is it that badf that it makes it not a good choice for 420a cars when it's the cheap mans EMS for 4g63s?

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Here we go again...

The 420A MAP sensor only reads from full vacuum to 0psi boost. It can't read anything beyond that because we use missing links/FCDs to prevent fuel cut (which happens when the stock ECU reads 1psi or more of boost). Since the S-AFCII alters the MAP signal, it's only really modifying a small portion of the entire vacuum/boost range. Once the car enters boost, any settings you've programmed into the S-AFC become null as a different device (FMU, S-FMU, etc.) are now taking control.

The stock 450s would work well, but we'd need a resistor pack, and a S-FMU to control them.

 

[Slippi84]

Here we go again...

The 420A MAP sensor only reads from full vacuum to 0psi boost. It can't read anything beyond that because we use missing links/FCDs to prevent fuel cut (which happens when the stock ECU reads 1psi or more of boost). Since the S-AFCII alters the MAP signal, it's only really modifying a small portion of the entire vacuum/boost range. Once the car enters boost, any settings you've programmed into the S-AFC become null as a different device (FMU, S-FMU, etc.) are now taking control.

The stock 450s would work well, but we'd need a resistor pack, and a S-FMU to control them.

SOrry paul I forgot to tell you I had already read about that in your other post in a nother thread I forgot about this one. Yeah that would explain why the safc wouldn't work really. shame would be a easy way to tune a car that isn't really a crazy setup without dropping tons of cash or going standalone like mega

 

[BigRand]

If your going to pay for a SAFC and have the ability to wire it up, then you might as well go megasquirt and just run fuel with a 12x12 table instead of an 8point table...its really not that much more if you think about it

 

[Slippi84]

If your going to pay for a SAFC and have the ability to wire it up, then you might as well go megasquirt and just run fuel with a 12x12 table instead of an 8point table...its really not that much more if you think about it

Have you ever tuned with a safc or megasquirt they are night and day diffrent in ease forget price. One you twist a knob at the points your running rich or lean the other is a elaborate full standalone lap top tuned setup.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

I don't think he was comparing the user compatibility of the two, but rather the ease of install and cost. MS is more difficult to tune, but it has many more parameters to define. However, MS can cost less than the S-AFCII and wiring it up isn't much more difficult than the S-AFCII (maybe just more time consuming).