1G 14b to 16g Upgrade

[Billy Ciano]

I am planning on replacing a cracked exhaust manifold, and figured I'd upgrade my turbo in the process.

EBay has "kits" which include manifolds and turbos for around 400 bucks.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DSM-1G-2G-4...ash=item27d1221f5b:g:jMUAAMXQvJVRTOBu&vxp=mtr

I am wondering, in anyones experience, are there parts available that I should be considering that are either higher in quality or cheaper in price? If you have done this upgrade, whats the total cost end up being?

 

[2G@wD]

Feed it from the head, not the oil filter housing.

Feeding it from the head is better?

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

A lot lower oil pressure at that port. If you think you are getting oil past the journals, try feeding from there. Normally a dipstick popping out is excess crankcase pressure under boost so some of it is getting into the crankcase from somewhere.

 

[19gsx91]

The way it was explained to me by our resident turbo builder was this.

Stock MHI tdo5 turbo? feed it from the head.
FPs own design turbos or anything BB/Holset related. Feed it from OFH.

If you are running a stock ish turbo (tdo5 14b/16g variant) There is nothing wrong feeding it from the head.

 

[GPLaserRS]

Is their any physical difference between a stock 1g manifold vs 2g I have another ceramic coated manifold that was given to me by my buddy, he had a bunch of spare parts since he upgraded his turbo and manifold. Just want to know which he gave me, not sense in putting a 1g manifold on my 2g..i would think..

The easiest way to tell the difference between a 1g manifold and a 2g manifold is that a 2g has what looks like webbing between the exhaust runners, see the pic below.

1G manifold on top, 2G on the bottom

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The way it was explained to me by our resident turbo builder was this.
Stock MHI tdo5 turbo? feed it from the head.
FPs own design turbos or anything BB/Holset related. Feed it from OFH.
If you are running a stock ish turbo (tdo5 14b/16g variant) There is nothing wrong feeding it from the head.

19gsx91, I've read as long as you have the right restrictor in the feed line that you can run an MHI turbo from the OFH, what are your thoughts?

 

[19gsx91]

19gsx91, I've read as long as you have the right restrictor in the feed line that you can run an MHI turbo from the OFH, what are your thoughts?

I would just continue to quote other people.. so @JusMX141 I would need to ask you your opinion. I'm not a fan of the idea of using restrictors.. it just seems like something that could very easily go wrong and cost you a lot of money. but several people have used restrictors with no issues for years. That is one area you don't want to cheap out on though.

 

[Steve93Talon]

Check the outmost bolt holes. If they are larger than the holes on the inside, its a good chance its a 2G manifold. If they are all the same size, its a 1G. There are a few threads on here describing folks who used washers to compensate for the larger holes to add the 2G manifold to their 1G DSM.

1G 7 bolt manifolds also have the larger holes on the ends. Correct way to differentiate is to look for the raised section on the driver's side by the heat shield thread.

http://turbomirage.com/starion/04_25_04/evo3manifold.jpg

 

[2G@wD]

Do I need a fmic to run my 16g? Or am i able to still use my side mount without any issues?

 

[SouthIndy_Talon]

You can run the side mount if absolutely needed. It will not be completely ideal as it will probably heat soak pretty badly if you do several "pulls" back to back. IATs will be higher too when compared to a FMIC, so it will leave some power on the table due to that as well. It may limit how aggressive you can get with the timing maps too. It will work, but it won't be 100% ideal. It really comes down to how you will use the car a majority of the time.

 

[2G@wD]

I just want to get to point a A point B since I sold my dd maxima I'm forced to drive DSM unfinished, I'm getting alot of crankcase pressure, to the point oil is shooting out of my dipstick, I already order my catch can.. But looking for help on where to start attacking this problem

 

[2G@wD]

"IAT's" ?

 

[Vegas Smith]

You can still use a sidemount. Are you upgrading from a t-25 or a 14b? The t-25 and 16g have slightly different fitment and you would need a few extra parts.

 

[Vegas Smith]

"IAT's" ?

Intake air temperatures

 

[GPLaserRS]

Do I need a fmic to run my 16g? Or am i able to still use my side mount without any issues?

When you bought your 16g did you get the install kit with it? To continue to use your SMIC you will need a J-pipe that bolts to the 16g to direct the flow downwards coupled to another hard pipe that will run to the intercooler, you will also have to play around with the coolant lines and oil drain to make them work on 16g in a 2G. There are kits you can buy that will have everything you need, just check the sites of some of the vendors... Then the question becomes what are your goals and weight out the cost of a FMIC compared to the install kit. If you want to get the car going with the 16G just get the install kit, if you wanna make more power in the not too distant future with a better turbo I'd go FMIC.

 

[2G@wD]

Yes I've been running it with the j pipe with my smic i a have a 6 bolt bottom end.. Just wondering if upgrading the ic will help lower blow by and reduce some of the crankcase pressure??

 

[2G@wD]

You can still use a sidemount. Are you upgrading from a t-25 or a 14b? The t-25 and 16g have slightly different fitment and you would need a few extra parts.

I have a 6 bolt block , but not sure which one was on the car before it was blow, so that turbo came right off when I bought the car, we long since rebuilt the motor but my 16g bolted right up to my 1g manifold... I want to say it was 14b previously

 

[GPLaserRS]

Yes I've been running it with the j pipe with my smic i a have a 6 bolt bottom end.. Just wondering if upgrading the ic will help lower blow by and reduce some of the crankcase pressure??

Changing to a FMIC won't have any effect on relieving the crankcase pressure issue you're having.

This is pulled from the VFAQ -

Dipstick popping out - happens due to crankcase pressure pushing the dipstick up:

• A good running motor will blow out a dip stick with a shriveled hard rubber seal
• A dead motor (lots of blow by, busted pistons) will blow out a good dipstick
• A 1/2 dead motor will blow out a 1/2 dead dip stick

Depending on the actual cause and the severity, the fixes can be:

• A spring/wire to hold the dipstick down
• Pinch the tube at the top a bit
• Get a new dipstick
• A full engine rebuild or new pistons

If it blows out under boost with a glowing red turbo and manifold, it makes a nice engine fire. If it happens even once, figure out the cause and fix it.

 

[2G@wD]

Changing to a FMIC won't have any effect on relieving the crankcase pressure issue you're having.

This is pulled from the VFAQ -

Dipstick popping out - happens due to crankcase pressure pushing the dipstick up:

• A good running motor will blow out a dip stick with a shriveled hard rubber seal
• A dead motor (lots of blow by, busted pistons) will blow out a good dipstick
• A 1/2 dead motor will blow out a 1/2 dead dip stick

Depending on the actual cause and the severity, the fixes can be:

• A spring/wire to hold the dipstick down
• Pinch the tube at the top a bit
• Get a new dipstick
• A full engine rebuild or new pistons

If it blows out under boost with a glowing red turbo and manifold, it makes a nice engine fire. If it happens even once, figure out the cause and fix it.

It shoots oil out too

 

[2G@wD]

Just replaced all new gaskets and seals, piston rings so nothing is old and worn out..i have to investigate some more...

 

[GPLaserRS]

Have you replaced your PCV? When you opened the motor up did you replace the valve stem seals while you were in there?

 

[19gsx91]

I'm not entirely sure how much I trust that vfaq bit about the dipstick. that may be the case for low/moderate boost. but when I was running my 16g spiking to 30psi and settling at 26 my dipstick was not a fan at all. welded catch can setup and a gamble garage -10an can solved that pretty quick.

 

[2G@wD]

Have you replaced your PCV? When you opened the motor up did you replace the valve stem seals while you were in there?

Crap..... I know didn't replace the pcv .... Not sure about the valve stem seals

 

[Vegas Smith]

Better yet, for big boost some have recommended putting a check valve in between the pcv and the manifold. Do a search on that one. The pcv leaks even brand new.

 

[2G@wD]

Thanks for all the helpful info fellas! ... Appreciate all of it!!!

 

[2G@wD]

Have you replaced your PCV? When you opened the motor up did you replace the valve stem seals while you were in there?

What do you recommend for good stems seals and good valve cover gaskets

 

[2G@wD]

The easiest way to tell the difference between a 1g manifold and a 2g manifold is that a 2g has what looks like webbing between the exhaust runners, see the pic below.

1G manifold on top, 2G on the bottom

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

19gsx91, I've read as long as you have the right restrictor in the feed line that you can run an MHI turbo from the OFH, what are your thoughts?

I have a ceramic coated 1g manifold is that even worth replacing the regular 1g manifold with surface cracks that I have now? Or should I get a $100 eBay or should I just keep it the way it is until I save up for like a FP or something??