1. Join the Community!

    DSMtuners is a massive archive of DSM information - but more importantly, it's a COMMUNITY! Join in and participate with other DSMers, and invite all of your DSM friends to make this place their home. Chat with others, create a build thread, post questions and answers. Get involved! Logging in will also remove many of the advertisements, along with this notice. ;)

Vband vs T4 twin scroll manifolds/turbine housings

Posted by turbotalon1g, Nov 6, 2019

Please Support VR Speed Factory
Please Support STM Tuned
  1. turbotalon1g

    turbotalon1g Proven Member

    830
    36
    Joined Oct 19, 2005
    Blaine, Minnesota
    Just want to read some technical information and this would be a good help to me as I look to get away from stock frame turbos.

    I'm looking to start with a 62mm but who knows where I'll go from there.

    Anywho, I'm curious on the performance of vband turbine housings and manifolds vs T4 twin scroll.

    Pros and cons of each.

    Thanks, hope this produces some good discussion.

    Aaron
     

    Drag Race Build 1K  1

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    11.333 @ 119.94 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  2. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

    1,762
    558
    Joined Dec 9, 2010
    wampum, Pennsylvania
    You can have a twin scroll V-band.
     

    Drag Race Build 3K  16

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  3. turbotalon1g

    turbotalon1g Proven Member

    830
    36
    Joined Oct 19, 2005
    Blaine, Minnesota
    Let's not include that as it seems to not be a popular option/turbo offering **edit**

    I should say it is an option that I hav not seen used as much as the open v band.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019

    Drag Race Build 1K  1

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    11.333 @ 119.94 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  4. ceedawg

    ceedawg Supporting Member

    1,366
    219
    Joined Jun 2, 2004
    laurelton, New York
    That's not true it is becoming very popular!
     
    ceedawg

    2K  0

    1995 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    turbotalon1g likes this.
  5. OH91awd

    OH91awd Proven Member

    624
    273
    Joined Sep 22, 2011
    chillicothe, Ohio
    im pretty sure the big benefit to the vband stuff was to make it a compact package while getting the best potential of the appropriate size housing for the turbo while dropping a little weight as well. the perks of twin scroll housings are the better spool rate while being able to still make good power up top. theres more to them but thats kind of a simplified answer. basically the housing/ manifold you go with will ultimately depend on your end goals. i feel the best advice will probably come from the morrisons @MorrisonFab. theyre both very knowledgeable on both housings i believe and can help you figure out what combo is going to best suit your needs.
     

    Drag Race Build 2K  17

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    10.89 @ 125.67 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    ceedawg and turbotalon1g like this.
  6. EVLGSX

    EVLGSX Proven Member

    404
    153
    Joined Dec 7, 2017
    Wallingford, Connecticut
    I havent seen a twin scroll Vband manifold or turbine housing anywhere???

    How could one have that??
     

    Street Build 2K  15

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  7. OH91awd

    OH91awd Proven Member

    624
    273
    Joined Sep 22, 2011
    chillicothe, Ohio

    Drag Race Build 2K  17

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    10.89 @ 125.67 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    turbotalon1g likes this.
  8. EVLGSX

    EVLGSX Proven Member

    404
    153
    Joined Dec 7, 2017
    Wallingford, Connecticut
    well thats a first for me............doesnt seem like that would flow as well as the standard twin scroll T3 flange.........gotta wonder

    thx for the link
     

    Street Build 2K  15

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  9. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,691
    1,275
    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    The eyes can be deceiving.
     

    Street Build 3K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  10. turbotalon1g

    turbotalon1g Proven Member

    830
    36
    Joined Oct 19, 2005
    Blaine, Minnesota
    Has anyone seen logs or Dyno charts aka data showing performance or spool of vband vs T4 twin scroll?
     

    Drag Race Build 1K  1

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    11.333 @ 119.94 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  11. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,691
    1,275
    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    From what I understand, the v-band was created for convenience because you don't have a gasket to blow out or bolts to seize-up or strip. I'm not aware of any performance gains. I could be wrong, though.
     

    Street Build 3K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  12. OH91awd

    OH91awd Proven Member

    624
    273
    Joined Sep 22, 2011
    chillicothe, Ohio
    i could be wrong but from what i gathered on the vband it should spool about the same as an open t3 just in a smaller package. its kind of comparing apples to oranges. depends on the application on what route to go with.
     

    Drag Race Build 2K  17

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    10.89 @ 125.67 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  13. ceedawg

    ceedawg Supporting Member

    1,366
    219
    Joined Jun 2, 2004
    laurelton, New York
    V band TS Very popular in the Euro Car performance world the GTRs and Supra!
     
    ceedawg

    2K  0

    1995 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  14. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

    1,762
    558
    Joined Dec 9, 2010
    wampum, Pennsylvania
    I run a T-4 twin scroll, I haven't tried running an open one due to wanting the quicker spool of the twin scroll, so nothing to compare it to from me just from what I'm running.
     

    Drag Race Build 3K  16

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  15. 90tsiawd

    90tsiawd Proven Member

    402
    12
    Joined Sep 27, 2002
    Sarasota, Florida
    On a 62mm I would definitely run a V band housing, The Tial v band is an amazing housing. Very compact, light and stainless steal, not iron. I only see 1.2:1 back pressure on a maxed out 62mm with a Tial v band .82 and have no problem putting the car on the converter with out nitrous. On a much larger framed turbo I would consider the much heavier and bulky twin scroll if spool mattered.
     
    OH91awd, delta448 and turbotalon1g like this.
  16. turbotalon1g

    turbotalon1g Proven Member

    830
    36
    Joined Oct 19, 2005
    Blaine, Minnesota
    ^Thanks for your feedback. I appreciate it.
     

    Drag Race Build 1K  1

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    11.333 @ 119.94 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  17. MorrisonFab

    MorrisonFab Supporting Vendor

    117
    371
    Joined May 28, 2017
    Johnson Creek, Wisconsin
    We agree with all of this and appreciate the kind words!

    Like @OH91awd said, it can be expected to act like any open turbine housing, but with more compact dimensions. We really like being able to take advantage of those dimensions with a better placement which can lead to a better overall working system (such as opening up the downpipe bend, for example). Not needing a gasket can be very beneficial in a road race environment where the turbine housing inlet gasket becomes a failure point. Having some leeway in clocking and orientation can be handy as well. This applies to v-band housings in general.

    Although things get muddy when trying to compare open vs divided directly, such as a required A/R change etc, an open turbine housing will generally make a higher peak power number, and a divided setup will be more responsive and generally have more area under the power curve on a 4 or 6 cylinder application where the divided/paired runners can keep the cylinders during overlap separate. Divided and open setups each have their strengths in different applications.

    This is a perfect example where the setup matches the intended use. The combination is well thought out- being able to get under power quickly enough to easily straddle the line of traction and the rpm range stays right where it shines while going down the track.
    We really love working with the TiAL housings and the engineering that goes into them. As fabricators because each dimensional aspect is refined and pushed as far as it can, making them more compact (giving more room for everything else fighting for space in a DSM engine bay) than any other comparable v-band housing we've come across. Being investment cast gives an exceptional surface finish and accuracy not only on the outside, but in the volute where exhaust velocity is extremely high, and stainless steel that has a lower thermal conductivity to deliver more heat to the turbine wheel. We've always been a little sad that their housing choices lack divided options, but they truly have the v-band stuff nailed down!

    Cheers,
    Matt and Samantha
     

    Street Build 1K  20

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM

    Street Build 2K  18

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    868 whp · 546 lb/ft · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    OH91awd likes this.

Share This Page

Support Vendors who Support the DSM Community
Archer Fabrication ECM Tuning ExtremePSI Feal Suspension Fuel Injector Clinic Jacks Transmissions JNZ Tuning Kiggly Racing Morrison Fabrications OHM Racing RockAuto SouthBay Fuel Injectors STM Tuned Track Decals Track Sculptures VR Speed Factory WheelWell.com