Tell me why I shouldn't go AEM

[blade970]

.....the cost of the AEM standalone is the brain and the harness for a 1g correct? Well, the prices I am looking at right now seem to be up there anyways.
ECMLINK
eprom ecu - (either about $150 for one or have mine done by ecm for $165) $150-165
ECMlink V3 full - $495
if I wanted to go SD, another $100 for all those parts, so
ECMLink total = $700-750

Jackal
Eprom ECU (same as above) $150-165
Ostrich - $175
Logging cable - $35
Map/IAT sensors - $90
Jackal total = $450-500

or......this dude is selling an AEM for 1g with the cable for $700...
1G Parts AEM/Tial/HKS/BC - DSM Classifieds

so.......why shouldn't I go standalone?

 

[mike96]

with what you are looking to spend why wouldn't you... if you aren't afraid of doing a little wiring yourself you could get a megasquirt 2...

diy = you assemble the megasquirt 2 = $295

ready built = just wire it o your car = $415

 

[KazooGS-T]

My AEM is amazing... You'll love how extremely in depth everything is, while still staying relatively simple.

Here's just a quick print screen of what it looks like...

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[blade970]

Now how exactly does the AEM work. My buddy is running a standalone on his subie (autronic I think it is called) and for him to tune his sites he just hops on a dyno and when he matches the load x rpm or something the sites tune themselves when he sits in them long enough.
Is AEM similar or is it more user-based tuning (either way is fine with me btw, just wondering)

 

[blade970]

So is the price pretty much the only reason everyone isn't running a standalone? or what?

 

[DSM_PWR]

People sell ECMLink with Eprom ECUs for $400-$500 shipped all the time in the classifieds...

AEM is a great ECU, but depending on your goals... the question is DO YOU REALLY NEED IT?

ECMLink has proven time and time again to make plenty of power and run fast times...

EDIT:
Nuff said
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/vendor-announcements/377581-ecmtuning-1000-whp-1g-ecu-you-bet.html

 

[Tanro]

ECMlink is constantly being developed. They have added so much stuff to V3 since it was released and will be continueing to push the button until it no longer becomes profitable, and it is devolped with DSMers in mind. While AEM EMS is just AEM EMS. I would take Link over AEM in a dsm anyday. But if your deadset on AEM then go for it. Its not a huge price jump.

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

ECMLINK
eprom ecu - (either about $150 for one or have mine done by ecm for $165) $150-165
ECMlink V3 full - $495
if I wanted to go SD, another $100 for all those parts, so
ECMLink total = $700-750

Do you really need the full V3 version? If you get V3Lite (which would work perfect for about 90% of DSMers) it's $375. Plus if you are getting a 1G EPROM conversion at the same time you order its only $95.
V3Lite total = $470

Plus if you decide later on to upgrade to the full V3 version some time in the future then it's only $125 more.

V3Lite is my next mod and I can't wait until I get it!

 

[slowgsr]

aem is just plain awesome, plug and play, and works great. I recommend it over megasquirt, which I also have a lot of experience with, since my good friend uses it on his turbo neon. We made 500whp on the stock srt4 block and straight pump gas, DAILY driven. It works, but aem has more options. I don't know about dsmlink.

With the aem I recommend going to speed density, the wiring is simple.

If you have questions on how to tune the basics of any system, you should hire a reputable tuner at first, then you can play around with it and do a ton of reading until you feel comfortable tuning it yourself.

 

[snowborder714]

Now how exactly does the AEM work.

One reason not to get it.


If you go any other way, you'll have internet-based help, whether it's on the Jackal forums, link forums, or the like. I can guarantee that most people on here have no idea what to look for in an AEM log, myself included. However, if you threw up a link log, you'll have a ton of people who know how to read it, how to adjust necessary values, and how to suggest what you do next with the tune - include the owners of the company.

I don't know how user friendly AEM is since I've never sat down in front of it, but it's rare you hear of people tuning it themselves. The other solutions you listed I hear of owners tuning their own cars a lot.

 

[ramsack]

Maximum power gives no insight on how capable an ECU is, only how big their fuel system is. With DSMLink you still have fuel injecting the stock way, and ignition firing the stock way, both of those mainly batch fire. Not good for tuning big injectors for drivability. Me, I'll take an AEM over the DSMLink, because there are things that will never happen with DSMLink that AEM can and has been doing forever. It will take more setup, but I don't mind. People also mainly post logs up for stupid crap, and not to just get their car running right, only when there is a problem, like a sensor failure. If you don't know how to tune then hiring someone to tune on ANY platform is a good idea. You can still mess your car up if you don't know what you're doing on DSMLink.

 

[housegsx]

Wouldn't you still have to buy a MAP and IAT sensor with AEM, or does that come with it? That is one drawback.

The other is tuning. I don't know about AEM, but when I hooked up DSMlink all I had to do was swap my plug wires and the car was completely drivable. Just like stock. I guess it depends how much you want to mess with tuning or how much you're willing to pay someone else to.

 

[LiquidX]

People also mainly post logs up for stupid crap, and not to just get their car running right, only when there is a problem, like a sensor failure. If you don't know how to tune then hiring someone to tune on ANY platform is a good idea. You can still mess your car up if you don't know what you're doing on DSMLink.

If you don't know how to tune then what's the point in getting something that does not seem as user friendly as ECMLink. As Brian said, there is no community to fall back onto for help when trying to do something yourself.

So with a sensor failure, that's "stupid crap"? If you had an issue after installing AEM and it wasn't running right (sensor) and you had no idea what it was wouldn't you want multiple people to see the issue?

As far as I know from what I've seen, people are posting up logs to see where things should be adjusted and how they should be adjusted. It would be great if you could just drive and the system would alter paramaters to meet set requirements of say baseline 11.2 WOT AFR but alter if knock occurs etc. But I don't see that coming around (AFAIK) and of course you'll have members posting to again, see what should be changed.

There is a Wiki on ECMTuning's page to help you out and say what to do and multiple sites can help you out as well. Hence it's more user friendly.


OP
If you want to get AEM then get it if you feel it's right for you but don't be expecting to find too much help around the boards unlike Link.

What's the cost of a tuning session now-a-days?


The AEM screen shot, the window to the far right, ECMLink v3 has all of that minus 10 injector slots and engine load. Can alter individual injector pulse width on v3. Not sure if on the window you can change your desired idle AFR (instead of preset 14.7) or not and honestly I'm not sure if you can do that with Link

 

[snowborder714]

Maximum power gives no insight on how capable an ECU is, only how big their fuel system is. With DSMLink you still have fuel injecting the stock way, and ignition firing the stock way, both of those mainly batch fire. Not good for tuning big injectors for drivability. Me, I'll take an AEM over the DSMLink, because there are things that will never happen with DSMLink that AEM can and has been doing forever. It will take more setup, but I don't mind.

There are two sets of injectors that are huge for a DSM (FIC 2150 and ID 2000) that can both be used with ECMlink and be made to idle like stock. Tom Dorris actually was playing around with a set of the FIC's and changed deadtime with huge jumps and the car still idled and drove like it was on 450's.

I agree than the AEM system has much more control - but honestly, how many people really need the extra features, tables to tune, and minute adjustment points? I'd like to see some logs from people who run an AEM unit and see what all tables are actually adjusted vs. sitting there in stock form. Yes, it'd be great if link was able to get down into it more and give users more adjustment points. But it's been working great how it is and people are putting down a lot of hp and some fast times with link. Heck, I think Kevin Jewer even switched back to link from an AEM system.

It's all a matter of how far you really want to go into tuning a car (or paying someone to) to get the bit of extra hp that AEM will probably net you.

 

[Gamble97]

The aem forums are crap.
The good thing about dsmlink is access to their forums, the support is second to none. The tuning ability is so easy a monkey can do it. Plus there are a LOT cool features in the works.
You will get more support there than anywhere else.
Aem has a steep learning curve and needs work just to get the car to start and idle. The base maps are junk.

 

[ramsack]

Everybody acts like a stock car is the most optimal form of the car you can get with fuel and ignition, and tuning. Put a standalone on a stock car and go with sequential injection and ignition and be amazed. HP gain would be minimal but throttle response and other stuff change drastically. That and the ADC resolution of the ECU vs. standalones make a little difference. But then that can start an argument of why not just go to the EVO ECUs since they have higher-bitrate ADCs.

 

[-red97rum-]

Here's a working socketed ecu and a brand new Ostrich for sale for $375 or the Ostrich for $125 by itself.

Ostrich and Socketed ECU for sale

It's up to you in the end man and it sounds like all three solutions would get you what you want. Just do your research about each one and choose the one that you want and will be happy with.

I run Jackal on my car, works great for me and I don't anticipate changing tuning solutions anytime soon. I have friends that use EcmLink and it works great for them. AEM is on another level compared to EcmLink and Jackal. It's like comparing a major league baseball team to a college or double A amateur team. I never really plan on making my car a "full on" race car that would warrant a stand alone system.

 

[kawgomoo]

i would take link over aem any day? ok you are stupid and disqualified. if you cant tune, dont blame the hardware!!!

First off, processing power. do you want to compare the aem vs the stock computer on its hardware merits alone? processor speed, ram etc? or are you comparing its user interface for how friendly it is?

Driver hardware...the mitsu computer has ONLY what it needs. period. nothing more, nothing less.
AEM has all kinds of neat bells and whistles...but YOU have to supply the brain power to make them work.

Tuning. who will do your tuning? if the answer is YOU! then get aem. Its everything you need in one package, it will do everything you need, has unlimited capabilty for expansion into the future. AEM is a very nice unit...but again it only does what you tell it. Owning an AEM will teach you more than you ever wanted to know..but if oyu expect to plug it in, then drive your car to the store..oh my. you are sadly mistaken.

If you are going to pay someone to "tune" your car...well then get whatever, it wont make a difference. Because you are at the mercy of some other ####stick who ONLY has to know more than you to seem sufficiently knowledgeable.

if you dont know the intricacies of tuning a car, how are you expected to make an educated decision choosing a tuner?

Anyways..lets not get too far off track here.

For all those who dont know, AEM was not designed by and is not built by AEM. It is an older generation GEMS board stuffed into case with an AEM sticker.

Now lets talk dollars. To get a chip tuning setup for 500 bucks...man thats alot of money and very little return on your investment. You can tune fueling, and spark. thats about it. You may or may not be stuck running a MAF instead of going to speed density. That right there is hold back enough to totally avoid chip tuning.

MAF'S ####ING SUCK!

Speed density is the only way to roll as far as im concerned.

So full standalone here is obviously the best choice, IF you are willing to put in the time.. User configurable outputs such as nitrous, staged injection, meth, fans, lights, line locks anything you can imagine...all kinds of goodies!!!!

Also user config inputs..data logging the engine, various extra sensors, pretty much anything you want. Put a pressure sensor in your seat and measure how right your ass puckers when u launch it. hell it dont matter. We run travel sensors on each corner so datalogging suspension movement is possible and practical. makes setup a breeze.

So what is the 900lbs gorilla in the room?

Megasquirt. Why no one ever mentions it? i dont know.

its a REAL 100% no bullshit tune on the fly from your laptop standalone. It does NLTS, 2step, antilag, nitrous, fans, boost control...whatever you want.

it has the ability to run a wideband o2 instead of a narrow band allowing you to actually specify your complete 02 target, instead of only giving the 02 authority in conditions where you want to tune for 14.7 {stoich}

I would say feature for feature the MS does almost everything a AEM does, all be it in a bit simpler fashion for about 1/3 the cost.

I have built a n52 diypnp kit for my gvr4, and a n76 kit for my 2g. Also have an AEM in the 5spd 1g thats been in there for nearly 10 years now.

Software and Support.

Aem support pretty much blows. They arent terribly cool people when you call and have a question, the answer is generally short and based around "damn ## dumb, why are you asking this" AEM documention is also very poor.

DIYPNP has awesome support not only from the large megasquirt community, but also directly from diyautotune, the folks that whipped up the diypnp kits.

if you are wondering the diypnp kit is basically a driver board that the mgasquirt sits on. The megasquirt was designed by bowling and grippo, and is the actual computer.

The other pcb's used in the assembly are what adapt the squirts standardized outputs into car specific output...like pwm for the iac, or sequential injection, or listening to the signal from cam and crank sensors.


Drawbacks..so far the only draw back is knock detection. The ms knock circuit is kind of a joke. But then again i have never actually got my knock sensor on the AEM to work.

My aem was one of the first 100 units built, and as such was originally plagued with troubles. the 02 gain was way wrong {had to be sent back to aem for hardware repalcement} and ever since that fateful day the knock detection has not worked at all. Of course they also "converted" my box to the newer firmware, and converted my map to run on it.

What i sent them was a fully tuned box with an o2 issue, what i got back was a completely blank box with no hopes of ever loading my old tune back onto it.

of course, tuning has come along ways and most people understand with the MBT method and a load bearing dyno you can tune your spark curve without ever really getting into knock. not to mention tuning till knock then backing off a few degrees is less than an ideal method.


Hope this helps you choose.

If i had 1k or more to spend it would be without a doubt the AEM. Boost comp tuning makes it all worth it.

If i didnt i would choose the diypnp/megasquirt kit. it has nearly every feature of aem, its totally open source so if you want to make it do something it doesnt. the only thing stopping you is YOU. also there support is awesome, so many people doing so much with these little boxes. Mostly in domestic land...cheap and awesome!

link costs WAY too much and does to little.

Chip tuning cost is comparable, but it again is limited much like the link {which really is just chip tuning through an emulator}

Lastly. chip tuning is SLOW any money you save on this setup will be quickly eaten up in dyno time. Unless you run an emulator, burning a prom for every change is retardedly retarded. sooo slow.

id just like to add that AEM advertises there software has autotune features... which it does, but dont work. call aem and they will tell you not to use it, and they dont know how to set it up. yet the company still uses this as one of there top claims in advertising propganda.

Megatune {private tuning software for megasquirt users} does in fact have a functioning autotune feature. It does the same thing i do, it watches the O2 feedback % and adjusts teh fuel table to get you as close to 0 percent feedback as possible. this is basically how i street tune my aem, just using the +/- keys while watching o2 target feedback. quick, simple and effective



ok ok before eveyone jumps my butt, id like to say i know ms is NOT sequential injection. It CAN BE but by default is not.

Does this matter? eh. Most of your import d-bags will insist its terribly super critical. yet in fact it is not. Batch fire injetion has worked fine for years and its only real drawback is super slow speed tuning...

i run fic 1050's on the 2 squirts per cycle. works fine, idles great. with the stockinjectors the ms base map idled better than stock maf and injectors. without a doubt.

In the end, it doesnt really matter WHAT you choose as long as you learn HOW to operate it. Tuning your own ride, being the master of your own destiny. there is no replacement for it. Best feeling in the world. Why buy the fish, when you can buy the rod and learn to catch the fish yourself.

 

[ramsack]

Most people can't even socket an ECU on their own without messing it up, do you really expect them to have the skills to assemble a MegaSquirt? Also you were saying about the WB o2 tracking, does the AEM force you to stick to 14.7? I don't see why a computer can't do some nice WOT stuff with a WB and be able to just shoot for a ratio when they go off track slightly from the tune, or to be able to just learn the whole fuel tune, and then you just do timing manually.

The ND 52-pin ECU costs $425 and optionally the sequential injection upgrade is only $38.

The stock ECU utilizes sequential at some points, but is mainly not. It's not batch either. They spray some weird-ass injection timing patterns. So I'd say going to a standalone that does only batch is a bit of a downgrade over stock, but not by much.

 

[LiquidX]

Kwagoomo

You seem knowledgeable enough with AEM now compare and learn ECMLink. Do you think the average person needs all of that? Most likely not.

To even hook it up you enedto have it set up and tuned for your own car which a lot of people just gettin into this cant even do. Link is plug and play right out of the box and is very user friendly. Also v3 can do speed density which I happen to run as well.

As stated before with AEM you are stuck with what you buy. Link is upgradeable and adding new features usually for free pending on which version you have.

For what I need, I'm much happier with Link as I wouldn't need AEM at all no matter how much it can do. If there are features you need and Link doesn't provide then obvious choice there but a lot are for experienced tuners looking to completely maximize the output to tenths of a horsepower which again, he average person won't need.

 

[ramsack]

Just like every advice thread it comes down to what you want as a product (features) and what you want to spend, and if you are going to be doing all the work yourself (ease of use.)

 

[johnmarines]

my postion...link all the way... not because I have it but because the help you will get from other users. Link hasnt been around for as long as aem but has better support..PERIOD! If you truely want to know how to tune and not have to have the added expense of taking it to a tuning person and pay every time the car runs weird then the link is what you want. But in the end its all up to you.

 

[kawgomoo]

I will try and address the concerns..let me know if i miss anything.

Megasquirt. Building the damn thing, yes it is a hurdle. Is it hard? absolutely not. Socketing a stock ecu i believe is more difficult than building the DIYPNP squirt.

on the ms2 you are doing ALOT of soldering, esp of little teeny tiny pins. SMD type stuff. {surface mount} that takes real skill. the kind of skill i dont have.

the diypnp uses a preassembled [by machine] smd circuit board. This board has the cpu, memory all the basic low current drivers etc. this is in essence the brain of the system.

what diyautotune supplies you with is a pcb that adapts the signals coming from the OEM sensors and makes them compatible with the hardware inside the "Brain". this is what makes the squirt so versatile, and is exactly how the ms2 works...but the ms2 is all one pcb and you assemble every last bit on your own.

How the aem comes to work is much like the DIYPNP stuff. As where they take your standard GEMS ems board, and adapt it to be compatible with a variety of OEM sensors.

The hardware inside the box between AEM and MS is similar, but there are differences. The general rule of thumb is everything you save in $$ must be replaced with brain power when trying to set up more advanced features in the squirt. There is nothing it cant do...but you might have to write your own code or build your own circuit. Most of the differences between aem and ms are found in the software/GUI.

Link. dsmlink ecmlink..whatever it is. Ive met the OG developers {or so claimed} about a decade or so back at MIR. one of the first 10sec autos that id ever seen.

Is the system BAD? i would say no. its not terrible. But what the system IS. Well, thats not really a system at all. Link is nothing more than an Emulator chip tuning the stock ecu. They have some added functionality, outputs and whatever else. But in the end, you are still running on the OEM hardware. Processing speed, memory etc. All this is whatever CPU was readily and cheaply available some 20+ years ago when our cars were designed.

Think about what desktop PC you had in 1991. Now think of the desktop you use today. Same form factory, drastically more hp under the hood.

Does speed matter? well. The more sensors you have, the more outputs you have the more shit going on. thats is all information being handled by the stock processor. If you have an 8bit machine you can only process 8bits per cycle. That means its deciding what information to process and in what order. Who knows how long knock really has to occur before you see a count through the computer. There IS a delay. Nothing is instant. No free lunches

Industry Support.

Aem. Worst support ever. God they suck. I truly hate everyone at aem with the exception of ed liu.

Megasquirt. Well, its open source. yup you are free to hack and tweak on it as you may. Support....endless. not only are there REAL people who will answer any and every absurd question over at DIYAUTOTUNE, but the internet support is second to none.

megasquirt is used by all sort of people. a large cross section is younger geek types, these nerds make all sorts of progress in the coding and feature set available with ms. and there work is generally free for the taking.

Tuning software. one drawback to ms is that you have to seperately purchase a GUI solution. its only 40 bucks, and is about 300x more user friendly than the AEM software. [aem software = tragic]

link. Great support. well they should have it, cause thats what you are paying for. the overall power of the system is limited. what you can and cannot change...its kind of like an ems with baby locks on it.

to say that link is "easier to tune" because it has less access to the variables does not make it anyway superior. tuning link is in no way different than tuning anything else. The way most people tune is solely off afr anyhow so whats the big deal? You look at the afr feedback if its lower than you want you pull full if its higher you add fuel. basically riding around pushing the +/- keys. not too hard.

Aem hatred...dont get this one. people get mad at aem users who have undefined tables. Or tables that have no been altered from the base map. BFD? There are lots of tables you will never use, since the software is written to encompass so many vehicles. Not every feature is used for every car. Does this lead to clutter and confusion? Absolutely.

Aem elites. most aem tuners are total dicks. maybe they have a right to be. aem is a frustrating system to learn and master. theres no real knowledge out there except for the school of hard knocks. yet again, if you know how to tune already then its just a matter of adapting to aem GUI. not actually a problem with the hardware itself.

since the link is a real basic system with real basic capabilities people think its "easier" or better somehow. These are the same people that know jsut enough to get themselves into trouble. They really shouldnt be tuning on there car...but hey. thats what makes this fun. its all about what you learn. with the link you are not required to do much so you arent required to know much. But when a problem pops up i guarantee your average link user will have a harder time isolating it than your average standalone user.

Why? familiarity. Full standalone can be a real nightmare. But its become so common these days, like windows pc's. With startup maps out there its almost guaranteed no matter what car with what setup...there is a basemap out there somewhere that will allow you to plug in the computer, twist the key and fire it up.

This being said most people that have fought through the toils of EMS know there car inside and out. They know what every little change of the ems will do {in time} a little more fuel here, little spark there. its as much an art as it is a science. Just getting a car to start off a raw universal EMS will teach you more about your car than tuning 100 link's.

I for one am all about knowledge. learn what you can. depend on no one.

with the squirt. its all on you. you built it. literally. if a part fails, you can isolate and replace it. You know which pieces of hardware comprise what circuit. Do something stupid and fry a mosfet? no big deal. hit up digikey order a replacement and you are back in business

If something fails with link or aem. at least you got someone to turn to Though my personal warranty experience with AEM made me want to kill myself. i sent in a tuned working box, they sent me back a box with "upgraded" firmware and a "converted" map. the end result was a calibration file i couldnt load and a car that was once again completely raw and untuned.


I like all the systems. Any of the options will probably do what you need it to.

As far as simple tuning points.

all the systems {i assume link can but im guessing here} can read and utilize wideband o2 feedback. This allows you to build a map of target air fuel, watch o2 correction and tune until you are close to 0% all the time. easy peasy. there is a stock O2 target map, but you can customize it however you like if you wish. mine is basically stoich during most vac conditions, tapering to 11.5 by the time you are in boost...


Autotune. Oddly enough the megasquirt autotune works, and fairly well. The aem one...not so much. im not real sure why but the aem autotune feature is to be considered undeveloped and not actually useable.

if you buy the 40 dollar megatune software you get this feature, if you use the free version its locked out.

not sure if link has autotune. and no autotune shouldnt be used under boost. but its a nice feature to just turn it on, cruise around the neighborhood and get all the part throttle stuff swept in for ya real quick.


in the end i favor MS and AEM. if the MS knock detection was better {usefull at least} i would rank it about even with aem.

Boost comp Tuning in the AEM. this is the shit. All your vertical columns are the same during boost. So tune one cell per colum and you are done. copy that number to each column and now your entire boost comp tuning is done. Want to raise the boost to a new limit? go fo it!! no retune needed. You just up the boost, and watch the duty cycle in your log. once you get back up to about 90% you are tapped out. No more boost for you until bigger injector! or bump up the fuel pressure and go for broke...

to me, link is like hondata. which i also hate. if you want to chip tune, then chip tune. use a moates ostrich like everyone else!

upgrades...there are no upgrades that the AEM needs persay. it does it all. any upgrades are usually of the GUI and all you have to do is download the software.

i think your FIRST upgrade should be some sort of ems. once the car runs as well as it did with all the stock parts you are sufficiently tuner educated enough to move forward with any real modifications.

in my world, i take cars from start to finish in basically one step. i often forget the upgrade path for alot of users, and that these cars are transportation for alot of people.

the beauty of ANY plug and play system is that you can plug it in, play with it, then swap it back out for the stock ecu if you need to get around to work and school but have no yet mastered it.

with most the cars i work on, the upgrade path is out the window because so much is modified they would never ever run on the stock ecu. ever.

man this could go on FOR ####ING EVER.

batch fire is not a performance downgrade from sequential injection. it is a slight emissions compliance downgrade however.

for those that DO run sequential injection and claim how vastly superior it is. Do they spend ANY time tuning the sequential portion of the injection even? do they spend any time tuning WHEN the injectors fire in relation to the valve opening and closing? at high RPM the valve open time is shorter than the injection spray event, so how would sequential benefit you under this situation?

my 2g with with the untuned ms basemap ran and idled far better with fic1050's in it than it did with the stock ecu. i mean, no big deal there. but fact is with the supplied basemap i could run and drive my 2g with 1050's, and also started and ran my GVR4 flawlessly. the gvr4 is all stock, and ran just like stock with the MS. so i would say its user friendlyness is pretty high!

Heres me building a DIYPNP. in my pj's took about 3 nights that i could sneak away from the kid. Bought a soldering station for 50 bucks from MPJA...Never looked back.


YouTube - N52 DIYPNP BUILD

 

[beachbum2185]

to the OP, link will be all you need. it's been proven time and time again to gain big hp. unless you're building an all out race car and are making your living at the track, then stick with link. AEM im sure is good for squeezing out the last .01 hp, and really, why would someone need to squeeze out that last bit unless they are building a dyno queen and want bragging rights. i am by no means a tuner, and i am anxious to get my hands on v3lite (thats all i'll need). it sounds like AEM is way more than most people need.

 

[92AWDHX40]

Dsm link all the way, easy decision for me, im not paying someone to tune my car, i learn more if i do it myself. Lots of upgrades on the link, flexibility.