Rebuilt motor, dumb mechanic

[ryanx99GS]

Ok, so my dad wouldn't trust me to rebuild the motor myself and had to have a warranty so he took it to one of his mechanic buddies and I am fearing that this is just going to turn out awful. My worries:

1) Mechanic is using Federal Mogul Speed-Pro Pistons . I know of their rings and bearings being good but their pistons? You can buy them individually off of summit racing for 30$ a piece. I'm a little scared here......

2) He is using Rotella 15w-40 to break in the motor, once again, never heard of the oil brand before. Any good?

Now, the motor is being rebuilt by a guy that builds and rebuilds motors for dirt track and bracket cars that race at Pevely Raceway and Gateway Raceway here in MO....it is bored out to .040 over, shaved head/block, 3 angle valve job, etc...

Anyone have any experience with the two questions I posted? Thanks

Btw, here is a copy of the reciept for everything. I feel like im getting jipped here. What I could have done with $4,000 instead of this guy.......

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[pj91gsx]

Rottela oil is sold at walmart. Its pretty inexpensive. also the prices are rediculously high for the parts but looks like they must have got them from the dealer.

 

[mindset]

I would do everything besides machine work to the block and piston install, tolerances can be a pain to deal with if you don't know what you're doing. If you plan on putting some power to the wheels I highly recommend ARP head studs instead of the "head bolts" he's using. Any clue on what type of head gasket? I also recommend deleting the balance shafts. Cost's less and easy to do. And the platinum spark plugs you can just throw in the trash, get NGK's and nothing else.

About the pistons, I would ask him about them and where he's seen them and what kind of power he has personally seen them put down. I wouldn't put them in though, I'd go with OEM if your still on a budget.

 

[Sp1kE]

I am interested in what a turbo gasket kit consists of for 70$
Tell him to pull out those shitty platinum plugs and put in some NGK bpr6es or 7's
And a Topline Oilpump kit is only 150$
Should have spent extra 20$ and got ARP head studs

But looks pretty typical for someone who doesn't know whats going on

 

[whiteboyz]

1) Mechanic is using Federal Mogul Speed-Pro Pistons . I know of their rings and bearings being good but their pistons? You can buy them individually off of summit racing for 30$ a piece. I'm a little scared here......

Federal Mogul speed pro pistons are the same as TRW/Speed pro. they joined. they make great oem replacements plus aftermarket parts. they have been around for awhile making parts for the muscle cars. they also make forged products aswell, they are actually ok. But i have only used them for basic rebuilds before so thats all i can give on them.

2) He is using Rotella 15w-40 to break in the motor, once again, never heard of the oil brand before. Any good?


Rotella, Is made by SHELL, they make oil for fleets, diesel, agriculture machines as well as everyday cars and trucks. shell products are very good. I run rottella diesel oil in my talon as it has zinc wich some of oils no longer have, zink and boron are great for break ins as it protects the metal better. but shell makes Good oil and gas.
or you can go with valvoline race oil, wich has more zink and boron then rotella does. or some penn oil

 

[ryanx99GS]

Thanks for the quick responses. I can honestly tell you this guy is nuts. I confronted him about the platinum plugs and he re-corrected himself saying "O, it was a mistype, I meant titanium plugs" I was like....their is no such thing as titanium spark plugs. When my dad towed the car in, I also had all emissions removed. He insists on putting them back in. He also insists on leaving the balance shafts in because "the motor was suppose to be made that way." I just stopped arguing with him after awhile because it got ridiculous.

What I can say about him that is good though is that he has worked on some pretty badass cars while I have been down there time to time. Pulling out a 450hp stingray one time and a WS6 that had about 400hp in it. It seems like he is a domestic freak and really has no idea what he is doing with imports. I have also tried to talk him and his engine builder into getting OEM pistons or Wisecos and they swear by these pistons. I really don't know why.

 

[whiteboyz]

Ryan, As i stated above that federal mogul/trw/speed pro, has been making pistons etc.. for awhile now and have been around the muscle scene aswell as oem parts. they are good quality, they ###### have a great amount of experiance with them that might be there reason why they swear by them.

But the whole lien about the plugs is something i would not stand for.

 

[ryanx99GS]

Okay, thanks whiteboyz. I only plan on putting about 350-400whp max on my GSX when I get it back in return. That is my goal. The mechanic says this motor will be able to handle the 700hp range which sounds a bit far fetched to me, but hey, maybe he knows something we dont about these pistons. And, as far as spark plug wise, there will be NGK's going in this motor. I won't settle for anything less. Thanks for the responses everyone, I appreciate it.

 

[gstryyder]

those pistons are fine. i would have gone a different route. you could have gotten a full rotating assembly for under 1500... and a timing belts kit for 300. his prices are retarded. you should be running bg synchroshift... not chrysler tranny fluid. blahablah blah.. i can go on for days. guys doesn't have a clue wtf to do with your motor...and 700hp my a$$. that guy is stupid. plain n simple. what i would have done is jumped on here from the get go. it is simple. buy a cherry picker... buy new motor mounts... and then go to this site... and pick out a longblock already built.. your choice.. then put it all in yerself.

DSM Graveyard - Your #1 Source for DSM Parts!

stage 1,2 2.0L longblock and a 2.3L longblock... under 4000$ from a very reputable shop. that guy is smoking crack.

 

[ryanx99GS]

those pistons are fine. i would have gone a different route. you could have gotten a full rotating assembly for under 1500... and a timing belts kit for 300. his prices are retarded. you should be running bg synchroshift... not chrysler tranny fluid. blahablah blah.. i can go on for days. guys doesn't have a clue wtf to do with your motor...and 700hp my a$$. that guy is stupid. plain n simple. what i would have done is jumped on here from the get go. it is simple. buy a cherry picker... buy new motor mounts... and then go to this site... and pick out a longblock already built.. your choice.. then put it all in yerself.

DSM Graveyard - Your #1 Source for DSM Parts!

stage 1,2 2.0L longblock and a 2.3L longblock... under 4000$ from a very reputable shop. that guy is smoking crack.

Yes I know. I tried telling my father that. My friend (graduated from ranken technical college here in MO, and custom built his 350hp civic si) and I planned on doing the rebuild ourselves but my dad wanted a warranty which is why it is at his friend mechanics place and not in my hands. Like I said, if my friend and I had that 4k to fix my GSX, we would be in heaven.

I have been on/browsing this site for a long time. I am very capable of building a motor which is why I make this mechanic look stupid when I ask him questions sometimes. It just bothers me how big of a retard this guy is and how my dad dosent understand that this $4,000 he is forking out is a waste.

 

[gstryyder]

Yeah, that blows. 3 grand and some elbow grease would have had you a great reliable motor. A motor pull and install is a single day project. Hopefully that guys gets your shyt right. But, when the motor goes he will have to warranty it. Oh, and as far as rotella goes, it is great oil. Not the best, but a hell of a good oil! Too bad you didn't live around here. I would just tell you to bring that shyt into my shop. We guaruntee all of our work. Plus myself and the owner know how to do it up with these dsm things... Hopefully it all works out for you man!

See what HG he is using. You need some ARP headstuds. Especially for that 700HP motor... .. his prices are really too high but whatever... a balance shaft delete will not hurt your motor... but if he is gonna be putting a BS belt and timing belt on.. Make sure it is a GATES belt. make sure all of the pulley are OEM stuff. 260$ for an oil pump.... wtf??? 30$ for antifreeze is frieking ridiculous. That turbo gasket kit is frieking expensive. geeze.

tell this guy he needs to listen to the customer.. and get with the muther###kin program.

 

[ryanx99GS]

Well my buddy and I plan on basically tearing it apart when I get it back because I do not trust this guy one bit. I have owned eclipses all my life, so I know what parts need to complete a reliable motor. Since he is keeping the balance shafts, I just figured to get a kevlar balance shaft belt to protect me. I read that people have good experience with those. I will keep you peeps posted that are interested with how this build works out.

 

[2slow4now]

Your dad trying to get a warranty is why the guy is going with the balance shafts and putting the emissions stuff back on ie to restrict the hp thus keeping you from breaking stuff. He's trying to keep you as stock as possible. The good thing is dads flipping the bill?? If so free motor! Not a bad deal and stock internals should be fine for your hp goals. Take the good with the bad and slap a big honkin turbo on that thing with the fuel upgrades required and run her till she blows. By then you could have some cash stacked up and get a shortblock and head for 3-4 grand yourself. Good luck and happy boosting with your free motor.

 

[Jimmer307]

Ok, so I am a good friend of Ryan's and know first hand that this mother f**king mechanic is retarted. I have talked to him on countless occasions and listened to him lie out his a$$. I feel so bad because Ryan has been out a DSM for 2 years now, 1 year sitting at the mechanics shop waiting for him to put it together. This guy is a joke. I have bought and sold 3 DSM's in the time it has taken this guy to rebuild one motor. Sure he is going to get a warranty, but it will take another 2 years to get the car back. Just to give you an idea of how retarted this guy is, he initially bought N/A pistons and rods to put into the turbo motor.

BTW: When I first saw the parts list, I at the rediculous prices. What kind of "friend" charges Dealership prices on a rebuild.

If it were my car sitting outside his shop, I would have burned the place down by now.

 

[gstryyder]

Ok, so I am a good friend of Ryan's and know first hand that this mother f**king mechanic is retarted. I have talked to him on countless occasions and listened to him lie out his a$$. I feel so bad because Ryan has been out a DSM for 2 years now, 1 year sitting at the mechanics shop waiting for him to put it together. This guy is a joke. I have bought and sold 3 DSM's in the time it has taken this guy to rebuild one motor. Sure he is going to get a warranty, but it will take another 2 years to get the car back. Just to give you an idea of how retarted this guy is, he initially bought N/A pistons and rods to put into the turbo motor.

BTW: When I first saw the parts list, I at the rediculous prices. What kind of "friend" charges Dealership prices on a rebuild.

WOw

 

[TFFC]

Wow! Thats just wrong!!! For those prices you should have forged internals, and arp everything, I don't care what kind of warrenty the guy is giving you. Tell your dad, for $4000, you could build your own, blow up and build again if need be.

 

[mindset]

700hp? Bahaha

 

[LiquidX]

DANG!!! I spent 500 on my machine shop bill with all of that work, boring, honing, surfacing, hot tanking and painting.

For $280, the oil pump better be a new OEM one with new gears. Turbo gasket kit, WTF is that other than a SS gasket you can get for $5. Should but in ARP head studs and what HG is being used? Sparkplugs are only to be NGK BPR6,7,ES. Timing belt better be OEM, Gates or Power Enterprise.

What's with the "cam caps 3" on the top of the list? If new caps are put on, the assembly will need to be line honed. What kind of surfacing machine are they using? As for 700hp, you better find out what rods are being used and what rod bolts and main studs are being used as the stock bolts WILL NOT LAST. New bolts/studs will need the main and rod caps line honed as well to ensure perfect roundness.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/cylinder-head-short-block/360679-what-ask-machine-shop.html
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-engine-fuel/303225-engine-machine-work-explained.html

 

[ryanx99GS]

DANG!!! I spent 500 on my machine shop bill with all of that work, boring, honing, surfacing, hot tanking and painting.

For $280, the oil pump better be a new OEM one with new gears. Turbo gasket kit, WTF is that other than a SS gasket you can get for $5. Should but in ARP head studs and what HG is being used? Sparkplugs are only to be NGK BPR6,7,ES. Timing belt better be OEM, Gates or Power Enterprise.

What's with the "cam caps 3" on the top of the list? If new caps are put on, the assembly will need to be line honed. What kind of surfacing machine are they using? As for 700hp, you better find out what rods are being used and what rod bolts and main studs are being used as the stock bolts WILL NOT LAST. New bolts/studs will need the main and rod caps line honed as well to ensure perfect roundness.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/cylinder-head-short-block/360679-what-ask-machine-shop.html
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-engine-fuel/303225-engine-machine-work-explained.html

Stock Rods. And ya, I 'd at the 700hp thing when he said that to me. Surfacing machine I do not know. All I know is the guy that is building the motor makes his living by building race motors for dirt and bracket racing cars. I don't ask him questions anymore because I get a ridiculous answer

 

[FLASH1970]

Yeah, it sucks. But at least you are not paying for it. If he says it's good for 700hp, push it and make use of the warranty.

 

[rare1]

Ask for all the old parts back,bearings and all.

 

[LiquidX]

Yeah, it sucks. But at least you are not paying for it. If he says it's good for 700hp, push it and make use of the warranty.

Ask for all the old parts back,bearings and all.

+1 on both responses. Stock 2g rods are only good for around 350-400hp I believe. Eagle rods are rated at a MAX of 700 which are much much stronger than stock 1g big rods.

Use the information I provided through the 2 links and start getting technical on his ass with your dad there so he can see how much of a dumb ass he actually is and shouldn't touch your motor. Even though it's not your money, it's still your familys money and someone is still getting robbed by the obscene cost.

I started to also wonder why he said he is going to bore it out 40 over. If it's still stock bore and not too far out of spec., a good hone is all that's needed. Going 40 over right away is going to make it much harder to rebuild the motor again as the new pistons will need to be custom made or you'll need to get sleeves.

 

[gringo72884]

make sure that oil pump is OEM...even OEM should be around 200-$215 maximum....make sure to get arp head studs instead of those "head bolts", ask him what headgasket he is using...hopefully it's atleast a OEM stock gasket. If it is a stock OEM HG atleast tell him to spray all the mating surfaces with copper spray so it seals properly. Even with the OEM HG you will be safe running up to 23-25 psi as long as you have the proper A/F ratio and no knock. ALso, make sure the waterpump he is using isn't some generic store brand wp, these tend to fail consistently and should be returned to the store. The only way I would go with the wp is OEM. Same thing for the timing belt and timing belt components....everything should be ATLEAST OEM, if not better for the timing belt and Balance shaft belts (...Gates, Greddy, HKS, etc.). Lastly, as mentioned several times already....definitely do not allow platinum plugs to go in the engine, go with NGK copper's....minimum of the 6 series....i'd go with the BRP7ES's. Goodluck

 

[VETTE_50_TH]

I would ask for half that money back. He use shitty parts and over charged on everything. He used chysler oil? I know for a fact a OEM oil pump is $130 He literally raped you! RIDICULOUS!

 

[94TalonTSI1]

WOW! I hope that your mechanic is providing the free lube, because you are getting RAPED!

4K for a stock rebuild? Does that include installation into the car? Your car better be factory new under the hood!

The worst part is, you are still on the 7 bolt! For the price you are paying, you could have built a 6 bolt long block able to handle 700WHP, and include the parts to do so!

Your mechanic is an idiot. Live and learn I guess. Your car, your dad shouldn't be telling you what you can and cannot do with it, unless he pays for it all. Giving a domestic engine builder a japanese motor is the same as getting a doctor to do surgery on a dog. Sure the methods are the same, but it's a completely different platform, one which he knows nothing about!

Good luck is all I have to say. We're here for ya.