Project Superman: '90 Talon - building my first drag race car

[Superman]

Good start man You going to be keeping the carpet or no?

Thanks. Yes I am keeping the carpet. I am going to shampoo it. That will be the only luxury left.

 

[Superman]

Good luck with the build my friend. Sad to see though that a car with a/c and clean interior will be stripped, but if it's what you really want to do then by all means i wish you the best of luck.
Just be patient, search around a lot for good deals, and most of all i wish you lots of patience.
What are your hp goals with the car ? What are some mods you will be doing first to it ?

Thanks. Yeah, this car is super clean, and the AC is Ice cold. The things people are willing to do to go racing. My goals are high. I want to make 800hp; but everybody says that, so that means nothing. I just want to make as much power as I can. We'll see what happens. After stripping the car, I will send the car out to have the cage (10pt) installed. I also have to install a race seat. (They can't build the cage without the race seats installed.) I don't want to get ahead of myself. After fighting with that dash, I am having second thoughts about this build. Just joking! I have a long way to go. I am going to try my best and see how things end up. The one thing I do know is that I want to do a lot of the work myself. If it blows up at least I know I did it. I am really having a lot of fun. With all the advice I have been getting, I do have to rethink some things (more on that later). I hope to finish stripping the car and getting the motor out this weekend. I will keep you guys posted.

 

[leepen]

Good luck Supeman and good job with the picture posting, it will only one of the many hurdles you will have. Remember this quote from some movie I saw "every lie is 80% truth". Do your research and make your own conclusions. GL
Lee

 

[Gooberlog]

Before you install a race seat "or two, which will add more weight and $" i would recomend removing the carpet to clean it, then flip it over and strip all of the heavy padding off of it and remove the wood on the sides. This stuff adds up to a decent bit, once the cars stripped you will be wishing for things this easy to remove that much weight. While the carpet is out, get some dry ice "from what i've seen it works best" and a chisel or putty knife and get up all of the sound detoner off of the floor for another 12-15 pounds of permanently removed weight. These two things will add up to about 20-30 pounds and once you reinstall the carpet no one will notice.
For the heat and a/c take it out and never look back. Actually take a picture while your at it and put it for sale in the classifieds. If you sell your good unused parts that's more money towards your build. Keep in mind if your planning to make a 10 or even 9 second car the safety requirements are pretty strict. For good reason, those cars blow through the traps around 150+ mph. If you plan on competing with the car in the future you will have to follow certain NHRA or similar rules so look into those. Also keep in mind of what class your think your car will run in for those type of races. For example, i know some classes at the annual shoot out require full glass no lexan. So just consider what type of drag racing the car will be doing as well as you sort out your build. On a side note, the lexan style windows are known to save tons of weight. As well as a carbon or fiberglass hood. And don't forget your light weight battery for another 26 pounds weight savings.
Good luck, isn't the tear down part fun?!

 

[91turbodsm]

Also, take a look into borg warner turbos. They are soposed to be really nice as well.

Andrew

 

[DirtyBirdRacing]

Why does it look like your manual boost controler is hooked up to your BOV? It sould go compressor outlet or fitting on compressor housing to manual boost controller and then to wastegate.

Have you figured out who you will be having build your engine? I am thinking of having FFWD build the first engine for me, I'm looking to get 400 hp out of it.

Bill

 

[Gooberlog]

Why does it look like your manual boost controler is hooked up to your BOV? It sould go compressor outlet or fitting on compressor housing to manual boost controller and then to wastegate.

Have you figured out who you will be having build your engine? I am thinking of having FFWD build the first engine for me, I'm looking to get 400 hp out of it.

Bill

With a decent tune your stock motor in good shape should make 400 fine with a decent turbo. If your engine is healthy you won't need a BUILT engine for 400 hp goals especially with 1g big rods.

 

[Superman]

Why does it look like your manual boost controler is hooked up to your BOV? It sould go compressor outlet or fitting on compressor housing to manual boost controller and then to wastegate.

Have you figured out who you will be having build your engine? I am thinking of having FFWD build the first engine for me, I'm looking to get 400 hp out of it.

Bill

I will be building the engine myself. I am not sure why it is hooked up like that. Doesn't matter now.

 

[Rob10_99]

Self building the engine, good for you Super! thats a good amount of savings right there.
Isn't guttin a 1g fun? =)

 

[DougR]

Dont ruin all of that interior, you can reclaime quite abit of cash selling that stuff. From what I can see its all in really good shape.

Basicly anything you pull off that car, try and sell it. Even if its only a couple bucks. It will add up fast.

 

[Superman]

Ok guys, some more updates. I had the day off today, but I didn't get too much done. I got tied up help some of my friends with their cars. But I did come up with a halfway decent game plan. I read what everyone wrote and this is what I came up with. I already had some of the parts before starting the build (I had to jump on those holiday deals). This helped and hurt me a little.

Block:

I am going with the R&R Aluminum Rods. These rods are simply amazing. I just got them yesterday. I got these through a group buy. These should hold 22mm wrist pins (I have to measure them to make sure).

Regarding pistons, I like the Weisco HDs. (Not sure of a good compression ratio.) I will be staying with the stock crank. Has anyone tried Jays racing billet main caps? I think I might go with kiggly racings girdle

Head:

I am not sure who I will use to port the head, however; I will be using kiggly springs and FP cams (not sure of the grind).

Drive train:

Regarding the drive train; I will be staying 5spd. I will be using either the Shep stage 4 trans or the dog box transmission (the New Jersey shop). I will be using the Shep or DSS upgraded transfer case, DSS driveshaft and axles. I already purchased my clutch. I have the QM twin disk clutch (also got this on sale).

Tires/rims:

I will take twicks69 advice and stay away from drag radials. Hoosiers it is.

Brakes:

Stock brakes with upgraded pads and rotors.

Ignition:

COP. Either the AEM of MSD ignition box

Suspension:

GC combo.

Intake manifold:

I ordered it already (another one of those group buys). I am getting the JMF dual rail Drag Manifold, flanged for Q45 TB, with nitrous bungs. I got the dual rails because I want to run E85. Even if I change my mind I should be ok.


Exhaust manifold:

JMF T4 top mount. I got this manifold while it was on sale (it is more beautiful in person). Welds look good too (not that I could tell the difference, but they look good.) Jim at JMF is the man. While making the manifold, Jim gave me a good price on the down pipes, so I bought them. My only mistake was when he asked me what turbo I was running I told him GT42 (I was sure this was going to be my turbo). Then when you guys mentioned the BW Turbos I started to second guess my decision. All is not lost, Jim said he can modify it if need be.

These are 4inch down pipes

Also got the Waste gate dump tubes.

I mocked it up on an old engine I had on the stand. (Looks good)

Turbo options:

Ok this is simple. I want big. I want bad. I Like the BW S374, and my favorite Garret slug, the GT42. (I know she's old, but I still like her.)

Shell:

JMF 10 point cage with parachute. I'm not sure about the race seat and the fuel cell.

Fuel:

E85.

 

[twicks69]

Damn! Looks AWESOME! Good purchases! I really like that 4" downpipe as well! I am assuming that you will be running a remote mounted alternator on the back of the block to make that downpipe fit. If so, look at Jay Racing for the alternator relocation kit. As well, you might want to look at running a Scirocco-style radiator with single or twin puller fans to clear the turbo manfold assembly. As well, you will likely need to run a different main water line. You can run a 16-AN or 20-AN fitting from the water pump to the radiator, and a matching-sized upper radiator line from the thermostat assembly to the radiator.

Great purchases!

As well, if you are going stroker, I would stick away from running Evo3 gears (shep stage 4) as they are a bit short for the mph's that you are going to be seeing with either a GT42-sized turbo or the BW S400SX series turbos. If you stick 2.0L and rev to 10K rpm, then they will be decent, but use a gear calculator to see if they will work for your setup.

Great purchase on the clutch -- you will like it! I would also recommend running a Fluidampr crank pulley to help reduce the drivetrain harmonics that you will see when using a multi-disk clutch, as it will take its toll on your transmission and your main bearings. The harmonics are greatly reduced when running the Fluidampr and you will have substantially less chatter from 5000rpm-2000rpm on decelleration.

Also, if you are using 22mm wrist pins, be sure to use upgraded thick-wall tool steel pins, as the standard 0.110"-thick ones will be the weak point in the rotating assembly otherwise. As well, I would recommend using wire locks instead of spiraloks for ease of installation.

Great start!

 

[Slippi84]

Yeah I have to say I didn't think you had your stuff together this good but you are really on the right track with this thing so far. Not going with a top mount is one of my only regrets with my turbo setup but my IC setup works with a bottom mount and I went with a very good unit so it doesn't looks as sexy as that but it gets the job done.

Also twick is right about the fluidampr is a big help with a twin disk. It's on my list of things to pick up after I heard about premature trans and bearing failure from twin disk and stock balancers.

Tim this is the first I'm hearing about the rings though. Is this not standard on 1400's ?

 

[dsm-onster]

Let me add my BS [/boom sh!t] . . .Since I've not built a 9 second car, I must know nothing like tha adversary to the above gentlemen in this thread, . . . (can I roll eyes here) never the less, . . .

"GT turbos"??????

"GT turbos" work, but your cost for thier service is utterly ridiculous. Please be open minded. There's no need to pay Garrett GT prices for a 9second turbo. The fastest dsm in the entire universe doesn't run a garrett. . . And, with such a handsome t4 twinscroll setup as you're displaying, I suggest FAR from a "garrett yurrbo", as they don't even have the manpower to describle the advantages of true divided runner tech (call them and ask what a twinscroll setup offers. . .)

 

[TSimage]

Nice to see a guy who asked for advice and follows through with it. I'll almost feel guilty if the damn thing doesn't run 9s now hahaha!

But that s374 is more than enough, you gotta remember that the s374 is quite a bit larger than the 42r, so comparing them to each other is a bit unfair. Test so far suggest that the s374 will spool sooner and make more power however and at about HALF the price.. The GT42 is a dog without spray, period. You will have your hand full especially running a dual rail setup with a fogger setup. I didn't even know they would build a manifold with that, I have no idea where they'd put it all in relation but either way if its possible I'm sure the JMF guys can get it done.

Its amazing how much those QMs look like the PTT but I guess it makes sense since they are all made originally by the same guys from Devo. I loved mine, night and day from owning a single disc, but they will most certainly get the job done, best part is rebuilds are cheap. I'm not sure if QM offers the same service as PTT but I was able to send them my clutch and they went through the complete thing and had it operating like new when I got it back.

Again great decision on the JMF products as I stated before, for the price they really can't be beat. WessHess was on his way but its a misfortune to what happened to him, RIP. I'm not to keen on the various versions of their manifold that they offer but is this one capable of being used with the stock water pipe, oil filter housing, and radiator?

As far as the ignition box goes, I'm a fan of not mixing brands if need be. I run an AEM EMS so I opted for an AEM ignition unit. Just a thought.

You definitely move fast, so I'll be keeping a close eye on this build in anticipation. I wish I could be as focused as you are on your build but my plate is much too full. Keep up the good work.

 

[Gooberlog]

Yeah you have a fan base now so keep us updated and stay out in the garage. We want see that thing run now. Nice parts so far! Keep your eyes on the classifieds for guys parting out quick cars, they usually take a big hit on pricey parts.

 

[Superman]

Did some more work today (not much). I was hoping to get the engine out today, but that didn't happen (I was working slow today). I had a strange problem with the car today. I tried to move the car back so I can make space for the engine crane, however; it would not move. It has been parked so long the brake pads rusted to the rotors. This thing was really stuck. I had to use my truck to get it to move. I hooked a tow strap to the front of the car (there are no hooks in the back), ran the tow line under the car and to my truck (this is my tow horse). The big 5.3 liter V8 made quick work of talon. Once I got her to move, I jacked her up and put her on jack stands. Now I can get underneath the car to remove the exhaust, axles, etc. Oh by the way I disconnected the AC line (what a surprise). I forgot that it is a high pressure system. I learned very quickly. I also drained the oil and the coolant. I also sprayed all the bolts with liquid wrench to prepare for the tear down.

 

[Superman]

Damn! Looks AWESOME! Good purchases! I really like that 4" downpipe as well! I am assuming that you will be running a remote mounted alternator on the back of the block to make that downpipe fit. If so, look at Jay Racing for the alternator relocation kit. As well, you might want to look at running a Scirocco-style radiator with single or twin puller fans to clear the turbo manfold assembly. As well, you will likely need to run a different main water line. You can run a 16-AN or 20-AN fitting from the water pump to the radiator, and a matching-sized upper radiator line from the thermostat assembly to the radiator.

Great purchases!

As well, if you are going stroker, I would stick away from running Evo3 gears (shep stage 4) as they are a bit short for themph's that you are going to be seeing with either a GT42-sized turbo or the BW S400SX series turbos.

Great purchase on the clutch -- you will like it! I would also recommend running a Fluidampr crank pulley to help reduce the drivetrain harmonics that you will see when using a multi-disk clutch, as it will take its toll on your transmission and your main bearings. The harmonics are greatly reduced when running the Fluidampr and you will have substantially less chatter from 5000rpm-2000rpm on decelleration.

Also, if you are using 22mm wrist pins, be sure to use upgraded thick-wall tool steel pins, as the standard 0.110"-thick ones will be the weak point in the rotating assembly otherwise. As well, I would recommend using wire locks instead of spiraloks for ease of installation.

Great start!

Thanks for the feedback guys. I will look into getting the fluidampr. I thought the stock damper would be fine. Yes, I will be mounting the alt on the other side. I bought Jays kit. I also got the toe eliminator kit.

 

[Superman]

I forgot to mention I got this AEM on sale a while back. I just need the other sensors. I agree with TSimage, I will stay with the AEM ignition.

 

[Slippi84]

How much stuff do you already have. I feel like when you started this we were giving you advice on what to get or which direction would be a good way to go when you already had your stuff together and were already on a great path. Stop teasing and show us the goods

 

[Rob10_99]

20k build INC...
Nice setup, basically what I would do save for the T4 mani, still very nice setup =D
wow that things high on those jackstands!

 

[TSimage]

I bet this car's already built and he's just effing with us hahaha.

 

[jholmes]

Looks like you have a well constructed plan to work off of so I don't forsee any reason for you not to reach your goals. Keep up the quality work and I'm looking forward to seeing this project completed.

 

[yangtech]

This is going to be an awesome build with quality parts. Can't wait to see it run.

 

[Gooberlog]

Not sure what your $ situation is but all of those parts seem to be top of the line! Your moving quickly on this project which is awesome. Just keep in mind how much the other major stuff will run you or this project will come to a quick stop if you run out of parts cash. I know if this were me my piggy bank would be bone dry by now after looking at some those sweet parts. You got plenty of support on your build as you can see though, any time your not sure of something feel free to ask if you can't figure it out. These guys have probably been where your at. Keep it up your doing great!