Prep work for chasing 16G records

[Nate Crisman]

I started on the wiring harnesses today. IMHO the worst part of any build! Basically, Im planning to cull down the engine harness a bit more and completely eliminate all of the oem chassis/body wiring harnesses. I want to clean up the engine harness, de-pin the wires that aren't used at all, and replace some "hacked" wires that were tapped into previously when the car had AFC and other crap years ago.

I'm going to put a simple 8 circuit switch/fuse panel in to turn on the basic stuff:

• push button for starter solenoid
• Ignition switch to power on the MPI relay, ECU, coil, Igniter (mpi will kick on the fuel pump relay)
• Radiator Fan
• Intercooler pump
• Nitrous arming switch putting power to the relay (DSMlink give relay ground for gated engagement)
• Tail Lights/gauge illumination
• Nitrous bottle heater

Im also planning to incorporate the wiring for switching the auto trans, boost control solenoid,oil pressure gauge, and alternator into the engine harness loom so there's less misc clutter under the hood. Last year these were added as "afterthoughts" with wiring zip tied all over the place.

Another thing is trying to keep the oem gauge cluster so that the ECU gets a proper vehicle speed signal from the oem cable speedometer, which is needed for DSMlink to run boost control by gear as well as engage the nitrous system via speed. I was looking into using a 2g electric speed sensor, but I haven't got that sorted out yet.

I'll also have to re-wire the alternator and brake lights, but those are honestly the only "chassis" items that were even hooked up in 2010...everything else was just unplugged and zip tied out of the way (dead weight)

 

[turbo4awd]

Congrats with the progress on the car thus far looks like its really coming together well.
On a side note Whats the 16g record for a full weight street car if anyone knows.

 

[Nate Crisman]

Congrats with the progress on the car thus far looks like its really coming together well.
On a side note Whats the 16g record for a full weight street car if anyone knows.

There is no record for "full weight". What consistutes "full weight" to you? There is likely not a single car that is strictly not a single lb removed, and if your going to allow some arbitrary amount of weight loss then it's a completely slippery slope between what you think is a street car and what someone else thinks is a street car. Pretty much any modified car, someone can point to something modified that is lighter and it's now not "full weight" by definition of it being a modified car.

For example: FMIC being heavier than SMIC, but alum pipes being lighter than rubber stock pipes. 3" exhaust being lighter than stock. 16G being lighter than 14b, and sheetmetal intake being lighter than a cast stock intake


If you wanted to say "what's the quickest 3000+lb 16G car"?...then my answer is: any of the low 10 second cars with 400lb of ballast. Take the current record and subtract .100 for every 100lb of weight and you can have a rough guestimate of the performance possible if the car had absolutely no effort put into weight and the only weight changes were due to performance mods

It's a pointless arguement IMHO

 

[turbo4awd]

Maybe i should rephase that and say full interior car not hacked or butchered- fullly gutted etc.

 

[turbotalon1g]

I'd say no-one knows or start a new thread and hope u get an answer from someone.

 

[Yamaharyder600]

Looks like your off to a great start. Cool project. Appearing to take the Curt Brown effect with the car. It has a stock appearance but nowhere even close. Lol Nice Job Tho

 

[cantgo2fast]

Doing this on a stock IM??? Mad props

 

[Nate Crisman]

Doing this on a stock IM??? Mad props

It's an Evo3 intake manifold. It has significantly shorter runners than a 1G/2G intake manifold, and the runners have a nice taper to them. At the plenum the runners are huge and they taper down to match a 2G cyl head at the flange. The plenum is an open tube style. It's basically a mirror image of an Evo8 intake manifold (which is proven in the evo community to be a nearly perfect match for a stock 16G turbo size)

Last season I ran a ported 1G head with a JMF sheetmetal intake (a "race" model from 2006) which likely put the peak power rpm of the head/intake up past 7000rpm where the turbo is already dropping down boost and tapped for flow. I really needed an intake/head combo that would make more power in the 4000-7000rpm range, and the Evo3 intake seemed like the ideal comprimise between the high rpm SMIM and the stock usdm intake manifolds that all make great midrange torque but are dead past 6000. The 2G head is also said to be a significant improvement over a 1g head, and should be especially helpful in my situation with a low rpm/small turbo setup driving an automatic that needs 4000-5000rpm power to pull off the starting line in first gear. Unlike a stick car, I don't have the option of choosing what RPM to launch at.


Certainly, a SMIM would have made the nitrous instal easier and had better access to the fittings, but I was more concerned with putting together an engine combo that would make the best power off nitrous.

 

[pantherballhp]

awesome progress and awesome goals. can't wait to see what it does

 

[SBstar]

Keep at it Nate! Looks like you're making progress. I'm scared to death of trying to do all that wiring jazz, maybe someday.

 

[Nate Crisman]

Here's a photo update on the progress with the build:

Shortblock is together. Eagle rods and a set of Manley 9:1 pistons. Oem bearings and main bolts. Next two nights I'll work on finishing up the engine build now that my gaskets have arrived.

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On the wiring front, I cut the engine harness down and de-pinned all the plugs to remove all unused wires. simple and basic.

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The ignition transittor, injector ballast resistor, and this FIC "easy tune" box are going to stay on the inside of the firewall near the ecu.

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This is all the wiring that goes into the engine bay. Injectors, TPS, CAS, AIT, MAP, Coolant temp, knock sensor. I have to add 2 wires for boost control and 2 for tranny shifting that will go in another loom.

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This pic was taken in the middle of soldering up the switch panel, gauge cluster wires, and the 7 wires going to the engine bay fuse/relay box. This shows pretty much the entire wiring for the car.

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Switch/gauge plate. Fits against the center console area of the dash's inside layer of plastic. The top row will be a 45psi boost gauge and a Innovate MXT-L wideband gauge (I splurged and bought a new wideband). There is a nitrous pressure gauge going in the bottom area.
Top row switches: START, IGNITION, RAD FAN, LIGHTS
Bottom 4 switches: IC PUMP, NOS RELAY, NOS Heater, NOS purge
The light switch turns on the tail lights and illumination lights inside the gauges/cluster. Brake pedal switch also still works..it was one wire more, so I figured why not. hahahah

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Here's what the dash will cover:

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More pics/updates coming as I finalize the wiring and finish up the motor assembly. Im hoping to have the motor in the car mid week and the car running last next week. Sunday May 1st is my goal to get to the track for the first time.

 

[pantherballhp]

is it a custom cage in there? or a certain manufacturer?

 

[larrykoren]

Looks like what I did with my 3000gt. Gut it all and redo every last wire and follow it all back. I am still hesitant to do it with my dsm since I like driving it on the street, to the track and in the cold. But it might change. Looking good though man. I am rebuilding the engine in my other car so it looks like a very familiar site in my garage.

 

[Nate Crisman]

is it a custom cage in there? or a certain manufacturer?

It's a basic mild steel 6pt rollbar which I bought (in like 1999) from Art Morrison Engineering. I had a local welder install it back In the day. Someday eventually, I'd like to remove the bar and have a chromoly certified cage done.

 

[Nate Crisman]

The mighty 16G powerplant is almost ready to drop in. Tonight I'll setup the Tbelt and bolt the engine mount brackets, coil bracket, knock sensor onto the block. I put on a coat of POR15 last night, that was reason for waiting till today to finish up.

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I really think I'll be able to start it up middle of next week.

 

[motozachl]

Impressively quick build man, patiently waiting results

 

[Phil1320]

Awesome Nate.

 

[1qkfwd]

And here im excited that we are getting our 16G car into the mid 11s with a mild weight reduction 5spd car.

Good luck nate, I enjoy reading your track stories so hurry and get her done.

 

[banishedmunk]

I know in the larger displacement motors world that when they use a large shot of nitrous, normally in dual stages. They run a larger exhaust valve than the intake valve to help make power by getting the gases out faster. more thorough explanation here . Do you feel there would be any gains from incorporating these ideas into a head design for your specific application considering you are running the equivalent to a 300+ shot on an eight cylinder application.

 

[motozachl]

^I agree, it's the same concept as running 264/272 cams --> the perfect small turbo cam setup

 

[Nate Crisman]

I know in the larger displacement motors world that when they use a large shot of nitrous, normally in dual stages. They run a larger exhaust valve than the intake valve to help make power by getting the gases out faster. more thorough explanation here . Do you feel there would be any gains from incorporating these ideas into a head design for your specific application considering you are running the equivalent to a 300+ shot on an eight cylinder application.

Im absolutely sure there are things I could change in the engine setup to tailer the car to making more power and efficient use of nitrous. Im also sure that a second stage would be useful to run a "mid-size" hit from launch till mid 2nd and then lay down a second stage for 200+hp to the trap. Or jetting the kit for 200hp and pulsing the solenoids to make it progressive from about 100hp off the line in first gear ramping to 200hp after the 1-2shift. Im honestly not sure how much torque the stock driveline would handle at say 5000rpm in first gear. If you sprayed it with a 200shot right off the line, it's adding more than 200ft-lb to the 450+ft-lb that a 16G can make when spiking past 30psi at 4000-5000rpm. That's also assuming the tires can take it without going up in smoke through first. 650ft-lb at the wheels is more than most of the big turbo/auto cars make, especially in such a violent hit that nitrous can make.

But...Im just as concerned with making the car run well with the nitrous off as I am with it on. So, that makes it a little easier on me to just run a "normal" engine setup and the nitrous adds what it will add.

Not to mention, but Im also under significant budget restraint in that the only parts I can realistically run are what I obtain through parting out cars. I didn't go buy/build a cyl head...this 2G head came off a parts car. So I didn't have a choice in valve size or cam profile. The nitrous kit is somewhat pieced together from a used partial kit. I unfortunately don't have the budget to go Optimal on setup.

 

[banishedmunk]

Im absolutely sure there are things I could change in the engine setup to tailer the car to making more power and efficient use of nitrous. Im also sure that a second stage would be useful to run a "mid-size" hit from launch till mid 2nd and then lay down a second stage for 200+hp to the trap. Or jetting the kit for 200hp and pulsing the solenoids to make it progressive from about 100hp off the line in first gear ramping to 200hp after the 1-2shift. Im honestly not sure how much torque the stock driveline would handle at say 5000rpm in first gear. If you sprayed it with a 200shot right off the line, it's adding more than 200ft-lb to the 450+ft-lb that a 16G can make when spiking past 30psi at 4000-5000rpm. That's also assuming the tires can take it without going up in smoke through first. 650ft-lb at the wheels is more than most of the big turbo/auto cars make, especially in such a violent hit that nitrous can make.

But...Im just as concerned with making the car run well with the nitrous off as I am with it on. So, that makes it a little easier on me to just run a "normal" engine setup and the nitrous adds what it will add.

Not to mention, but Im also under significant budget restraint in that the only parts I can realistically run are what I obtain through parting out cars. I didn't go buy/build a cyl head...this 2G head came off a parts car. So I didn't have a choice in valve size or cam profile. The nitrous kit is somewhat pieced together from a used partial kit. I unfortunately don't have the budget to go Optimal on setup.

I agree with you 100 percent with not having to rely on the nitrous to have the car running well.

it may not fit in your budget but Im sure you could figure out a way to duplicate it but have you by chance seen the nano nitrous setups. it helps maintain full bottle pressure the entire length of the track. even though I believe it is more tailored to the top speed competitors

 

[Nate Crisman]

Well, I did pick up a 15lb bottle which should help with pressure down the track compared to the normal 10lb bottle I ran last year. Im also going to wire the bottle heater into the car so it can be run all the time. Last year the heater was run only in the pits and hooked up to a car battery we'd set on the pass floor between runs.

 

[banishedmunk]

I give you props for what your endeavors and do believe the record is in the near future. It just goes to show that you dont always have to go to the larger framed turbos

 

[dsm-onster]

I love the assend of eagles dont you? What made you go with heavy eagles for this build?