The Top DSM Community on the Web

For 1990-1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, Plymouth Laser, and Galant VR-4 Owners. Log in to remove most ads.

Please Support STM Tuned
Please Support Rix Racing

No Reverse no neutral after trans build! Help!

This site may earn a commission from merchant
affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Is there a specific way this goes in?

Is this for real?

dude. get the manual. There's a specific way EVERYTHING goes in. Plus youll be on the "same page" as the rest of us when communicating your symptoms/problems/questions. Do you know how complicated a transmission is and if you do, how do you expect us to figure out whats wrong when your using the wrong names for things, no pictures, and the symptoms change? I stopped trying to help you figure out your issue when you started either trying to correct me or ignored half of what i was saying.

That's the front clutch that you're talking about. I guess it's getting a full tear down tonight... From my research the pump could be misaligned.

No that wasnt the front clutch i was talking about. Why would i call it the rear clutch and describe its location relative to the front clutch? How is someone supposed to help you when your gonna try to correct what they're saying?

Front clutch I'm talking about in by the pump and such. Rear clutch is accessible without removing the trans through the wheel well.

I know where the front clutch is. Do you know where the rear clutch is? Thats the end clutch your referring to in the side cover like someone tried to tell you. i was talking about the damn REAR clutch. Know where i got that name? The damn manual. Im not just making this stuff up. I think i have every book written about the w4a33 (which is what your trans. is called by the way.)

Not talking about the manual valve the shift valve

There are alot of shift valves. And they're all in the manual clearly laid out. All you have to do is look instead of having us wasting our time trying to guess.

when you moved forward in park/nuetral I/We suggested things to look at that could cause that like the shifter linkage (which you assured us was correct) and the park mechanism(which you aren't familiar with). you also had no reverse so i suggested things that could cause that like valvebody issues or something broken/damaged/improperly installed in the rear clutch. Then your rolling forward problem just went away and you did "some research" and decided you had the same problem as 11secdsm who couldn't roll backwards in any gear. Thats completely different altogether! In his case it was a misalignment issue. it could be the same for you, but If it's something put together incorrectly, i dont see how your gonna recognize it the 2nd or 3rd time around, especially when your just feeling your way through it. You dont trust what im saying then get the manual. it will tell ya the same stuff but a whole lot more and it even has pictures of everything! i posted a link to an overhaul manual pdf earlier which you ignored. Find your own then but trust me its worth having. There could be hundreds of things installed improperly that nobody is likely to just guess. Every single component has very specific rules for its placement, orientation, and handling not just because of how they fit together but also for longevity, lubrication, heat, pressure, ect. Theres a reason besides greed why trans. shops charge so much. Its the most complicated part of the car. "is there a specific way this goes in?" LOL.. your killin me!
 
Been looking at the manual for the past day or so actually, making things look a whole lot simpler.

Yes I had the rear clutch and end clutch confused when someone first used the term LOL that's my fault. This is my first time having a auto trans apart in my life. I'm determined to make it work though and I'm learning terms sir.
 
Been looking at the manual for the past day or so actually, making things look a whole lot simpler.

Yes I had the rear clutch and end clutch confused when someone first used the term LOL that's my fault. This is my first time having a auto trans apart in my life. I'm determined to make it work though and I'm learning terms sir.
Don't give up just keep on trying till it works
You'll feel good driven after all that work hah

Get a authentic manual and Litterally just use that do assembly it gives you everything and then some hah
Make it your bible
 
Don't give up just keep on trying till it works
You'll feel good driven after all that work hah

Get a authentic manual and Litterally just use that do assembly it gives you everything and then some hah
Make it your bible

Is there a trans manual only or just a shop manual? I already have it downloaded but I'll go ahead and buy a set off of eBay. I've been meaning to have one around anyways.
 
Last edited:
More than likely bro the clutches were installed improperly make sure all of the clutches you removed were installed properly steel clutches steel etc until all are installed and then check the manual clearance specs and measure them with a feeler gauge then if it is available blow compressed air through the specific ports to verify movement of the pistons to be sure the piston is working properly in that clutch pack whether it forward or reverse, rear, end, etc. You mentioned something in an earlier post referring to a broken seal was that taken care of and be sure to line all the clutches up in that drum be sure the parts are fully seated by twisting them as you seated them together
 
Well guys I got front and rear clutches back in the correct way, as well as the pump.

I started to mess with the input shaft a bit and the gear selector while the trans was out to see what would happen. I have no idea if this works while the trans is out but it seemed to just fine.

I actually inserted both of my axels into the trans with a friend. Gear 1, 2, and D the axels turned freely forwards with the output to tcase and input shaft moving as well. (When we both moved the axels) they also wouldn't spin in reverse.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.

I'm neutral was a different story though, the axels spun well in the forwards direction but felt like they needed a decent ammount of force to move in reverse.

In reverse the axels wouldn't spin forwards (like normal I'd think) but they would move in reverse also with a decent amount of force. As in I couldn't just move input shaft or the shaft out to the tcase by myself. Also when I span the axels in reverse only the tcase output shaft would move not the larger input shaft.

In park it all locked up both ways and wouldn't move at all.. I'm not sure if I fixed my issue or not. I went through the factory manual multiple times making sure everything that I did checked out and was correct. I would think this seems right but I'm not 100% if it should feel so much more difficult to move in reverse direction in neutral and reverse?

I apologize for being such a noob on this topic I'm really trying my best. I've been reading all over the place. I'm starting to think it's just my VB somehow if this doesn't fix the issue but I spent a ton of time making sure that was correct too.

If I don't get this in a few days I'm gonna just fork over the money to a trans shop unfortunately , learn what I did wrong, and do it right the next time. I feel like there's one small mistake somewhere. Thankso everyone for the help once again.
 
Good job on getting the manuals and getting this far! You've made progress for sure since originally you couldn't even stay in park. Now that you've ripped into it a few times you can probably see what the park mechanism is doing and where it is. I think you might have fixed it but I'm not 100% sure as I've never tried to bench test mine the way you did. I'm gonna try to dig out my parts trans and see if I can duplicate your findings. I do remember it was a bi*** to spin by hand but I never threw axles in..I wanna say ya fixed it cuz it moves in both directions now. If you bolt it up and lose the ability to spin in both directions then I would suspect your trouble lies elsewhere in your driveline or deeper in your trans. Keep going! Your saving a ton of money and now your on the right track. :thumb:
While the trans is out does your drive shaft and rear seem to move freely?
 
Good job on getting the manuals and getting this far! You've made progress for sure since originally you couldn't even stay in park. Now that you've ripped into it a few times you can probably see what the park mechanism is doing and where it is. I think you might have fixed it but I'm not 100% sure as I've never tried to bench test mine the way you did. I'm gonna try to dig out my parts trans and see if I can duplicate your findings. I do remember it was a bi*** to spin by hand but I never threw axles in..I wanna say ya fixed it cuz it moves in both directions now. If you bolt it up and lose the ability to spin in both directions then I would suspect your trouble lies elsewhere in your driveline or deeper in your trans. Keep going! Your saving a ton of money and now your on the right track. :thumb:
While the trans is out does your drive shaft and rear seem to move freely?

I actually don't have the rear of the car supported currently. But I probably should to insure that. One thing I can say the car wanted to go forwards easily and I drove it right into the garage before I pulled the trans. I really don't think the driveline is sticking up at all. It was a bi*** to spin for sure! Just seemed weird to me it went forwards probably 3 or 4 times easier than reverse, but would also make sense because the trans is going forwards 99% of the time. I think I might just pull the VB out one more time while the trans is out and it's easy to get to and just make sure it's all seated correctly inside.

I would be very curious to see if it was harder to turn in reverse on a bench for you. If so I'm pretty confident it's fixed LOL
 
Good job on getting the manuals and getting this far! You've made progress for sure since originally you couldn't even stay in park. Now that you've ripped into it a few times you can probably see what the park mechanism is doing and where it is. I think you might have fixed it but I'm not 100% sure as I've never tried to bench test mine the way you did. I'm gonna try to dig out my parts trans and see if I can duplicate your findings. I do remember it was a bi*** to spin by hand but I never threw axles in..I wanna say ya fixed it cuz it moves in both directions now. If you bolt it up and lose the ability to spin in both directions then I would suspect your trouble lies elsewhere in your driveline or deeper in your trans. Keep going! Your saving a ton of money and now your on the right track. :thumb:
While the trans is out does your drive shaft and rear seem to move freely?

Alright everyone so I got the transmission back into the car and everything hooked up correctly. My car stays in drive perfect now, has neutral, goes into all the gears, and even moves backwards in neutral! All progress which didn't work before, so obviously I did something right with reassembly, and tried to take my time to make sure everything was correct as could be to the shop manual I was looking at online.

I STILL HAVE NO REVERSE!
LOL I'm happy the car made it this far, and that's my only issue remaining.. none of the clutches inside the car were burnt, nothing was damaged, and my fluid was very clean when I disassembled it.

Obviously I've been reading around for days on this stuff now, and read that "reverse is completely mechanical"... what should I check? Obviously I'm calling it a night now but any other bits of input would be great.

Thanks again everyone for the info it's definitely helped.
 
There is an o ring that sit on top of valve body, if it is torn or missing....no reverse

Yes sir. That was the first thing I originally checked when the car first had a issue. I am gonna pull the valve body again after work and make sure again.. Honestly I'm pretty motivated to do whatever I have to do to get this thing going.
 
I'm just curious how it doesn't work or it would be something "not working" after everything was flawless before I took it apart. Is it possible I damaged a sensor/solenoid? I guess I will test all of those tonight too.
 
The "reverse is mechanical" thing is because no solenoids are used to shift you into reverse. You shift it into reverse yourself (shifter linkage - manual lever-manual valve). Bad sensors and solenoids won't rob you of reverse. (unless it was pressure control but you still have forward) It's something else. I'm working on getting my spare together. I forgot how disassembled it was. At least I got it dug out and most of the major components together. Now that your only problem is no reverse its a little easier. Something isn't working in your reverse components whereas before it could have been something in your reverse or forward components not allowing the shaft to spin backward. Now that your neutral and park act right it's narrowed down to the pressure circuit and clutches/pistons involved in reverse. Hope that helps some.
Do you have a way to check oil pressure? There are ports that you can check individual component pressures on the case.
 
The "reverse is mechanical" thing is because no solenoids are used to shift you into reverse. You shift it into reverse yourself (shifter linkage - manual lever-manual valve). Bad sensors and solenoids won't rob you of reverse. (unless it was pressure control but you still have forward) It's something else. I'm working on getting my spare together. I forgot how disassembled it was. At least I got it dug out and most of the major components together. Now that your only problem is no reverse its a little easier. Something isn't working in your reverse components whereas before it could have been something in your reverse or forward components not allowing the shaft to spin backward. Now that your neutral and park act right it's narrowed down to the pressure circuit and clutches/pistons involved in reverse. Hope that helps some.
Do you have a way to check oil pressure? There are ports that you can check individual component pressures on the case.

I do not.

What would I purchase for this and possibly a link? I saw the tools in the manual but I'm assuming those are very expensive being OEM Mitsubishi tools.
 
you are scaring me to get my car going i just did all these to my auto but i still am missing a motor, hope you get this figured out, props on dropping everything multiple times and not giving up.
 
Well I found a few really small metal shavings in the pan upon pulling it off (didn't have it off when trans was out last and I redid the front and rear clutches and pump alignment... I can't believe I paid someone money to do this for me the first time, then nothing worked... If I would of done it from the get go it would of been fine. I was just scared to tear into it myself now I see how easy it is. So how f***ed am I? Full rebuild? I will say I'm passed pissed off. I'm taking very small metal shavings but I know that means a lot in something like this. There wasn't any when the trans came out and was unmodified.
 
If it were my car (so I'm not saying this is the best idea), I would change all the fluid run it again just in neutral if you can get it there to let the pump run and let it sit that way and inspect for more shavings. If it was a minimal amount you may be alright. I would give jon at ipt your valve body and make sure it's done 100%, that way there will be no suspicion of the vb.
 
That sucks! I would tear it apart again and find out what's getting shaved. Props for tearing it down already a million times though. Your absolutely right about doing it yourself and being better off.. forget the oil pressure until you figure out what clearance is off or what's bent/broke/twisted/stuck..
 
I should of never let anyone touch it man...

I probably will switch fluid and check again honestly, because it was like 2 or 3 smalllll shavings. I'm just really picky about stuff like this. They were definitely metal though, shouldn't be from normal wear. Could it of just ended up from taking it apart so many time though?
 
I had to rebuild mine because I had no forward, no reverse, and I had shavings in the pan. The cause was a thrust bearing that had completely disintegrated and caused the front clutch assembly to grind into the back of the pump. The metal shavings and the pieces of the shattered thrust bearing then jammed up in everything and it required a complete disassembly/rebuild. I didn't want to take the chance that any other areas were contaminated with shavings/chunks so I disassembled-cleaned-rebuilt everything. The rest of the trans isn't any more difficult than what you've done already so you might as well do the whole job. Take it all apart. Clean and check everything for scratches/knicks/cracks...put it all back together checking clearances as you go..if something is out of spec..adjust your spacer until it's right. Check the condition of your pistons, make sure everything goes in correctly. Something still isn't right in there.
 
I had to rebuild mine because I had no forward, no reverse, and I had shavings in the pan. The cause was a thrust bearing that had completely disintegrated and caused the front clutch assembly to grind into the back of the pump. The metal shavings and the pieces of the shattered thrust bearing then jammed up in everything and it required a complete disassembly/rebuild. I didn't want to take the chance that any other areas were contaminated with shavings/chunks so I disassembled-cleaned-rebuilt everything. The rest of the trans isn't any more difficult than what you've done already so you might as well do the whole job. Take it all apart. Clean and check everything for scratches/knicks/cracks...put it all back together checking clearances as you go..if something is out of spec..adjust your spacer until it's right. Check the condition of your pistons, make sure everything goes in correctly. Something still isn't right in there.

Where would I go about ordering spacers and OEM parts or equivalent for a rebuild on this thing? I don't think this was like this the first time, but I think the bearing went bad in the input shaft for the T Case. Seems to be way out of spec in how much play it has. I'm guessing I have a similar issue, bearing exploded, contaminated my trans. This probably occurred when we struggled to remove the t case as it's the original one and trans to the car and has never been removed previously. Would something like this be the cause of my no reverse issue? I'd assume so just because anything not right can lead to failure.

I'm debating on taking it to a ship or doing it myself... at this point I feel pretty confident. But I'll have to pick up some tools and sorce out the parts fast.

Basic list of specialty tools needed?

Thanks again sir sounds like we may have actually had a similar issue.
 
In the manual theres a list of the spacers pertaining to each section. Like when your rebuilding a clutch assembly it will show that you have an option of snap rings of varying thickness to make up for the specific space that you measure. Each section of the trans will have a part that is used to set the spec. Sometimes it's a snap ring, sometimes it's a flat bearing, or a washer. Depends what section your working on. If your assembly is out of spec, Then you look at the list , find the part that equals what you need and there's the part number. Once you know the part number of the part you need it's easier to find where to buy it. I get my trans parts at several places depending on brand, price, availability, ect.
Do it yourself! It's still gonna be cheaper than sending it out and your gonna learn how to rebuild an automatic. You already have most of the parts. Go all the way this time. Tear it apart. Clean it out. Put it together one section at a time. Measure everything. Each thing measures a different way. You can improvise sometimes..get a thickness gauge at least..set everything according to the book. If it's good, next section. Find what's missing or damaged and order it. Keep everything spotless. I would never call this easy but it's not impossible, just tedious. Something like a bearing exploding could definately cause ya all kinds of issues including no reverse. A chunk could be lodged anywhere causing all kinds of different problems. Take your time, go piece by piece, clean it all out and rebuild it. while it's apart you could replace your seals, bearings, and all that so it's all done. If you haven't run away screaming from going this far, then ya can probably handle it.
 
Support Vendors who Support the DSM Community
Boosted Fabrication ECM Tuning ExtremePSI Fuel Injector Clinic Innovation Products Jacks Transmissions JNZ Tuning Kiggly Racing Morrison Fabrications MyMitsubishiStore.com RixRacing RockAuto RTM Racing STM Tuned

Latest posts

Build Thread Updates

Vendor Updates

Latest Classifieds

Back
Top