No oil going into rear caliper !? Help please

[DSM4LIFE-AWD]

Hey guys I'm trying to bleed my brakes and my pedal is stiff as hell, both front brakes works but not the rear one !? No oil is going into the rear caliper, bleeders are unscrew and my pedal is still stiff and front brakes are working !?

Wtf have I done wrong ? Hose on the master near the fire wall is going into the prop valve front passenger side, hose on master near intake is in driver front driver ports ... Front caliper from the buttom side ports on the valve and rear on the upper ports on each side.

Help please

I just unscrew the rear line before my ss lines at the rear wheels and still no oil going there ? Pedal is still stiff and front brakes working ! I'll try to unscrew one of the rear line at the prop valve and we'll see if oil is going into the lines ... Don't know what else to try ...

Edit: From this site my lines from the master to the valve are the opposite ? I'm still looking into my manual and it's the opposite of this site ? F**K http://codsm.org/forums/showthread.php?t=3358

No oil is coming out right at the valve from the ports for the rear lines ? I think my line are inverted, can someone confirm where the hose on the master near the booster is going on the valve ?

 

[luv2rallye]

Here's the non-abs 2g prop valve hook up: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=129736&d=1320973861

 

[DSM4LIFE-AWD]

Sorry this is on my 1gen, rocking a new brake master ... I think it's already bad, can't seems to find anything else.

I think I'll try to unscrew both hose from the master on the valve one at a time and see if they both push oil. I'm pretty sure I'll find out that one line is dry. Can't test it tonight I just left the garage before breaking everything ...

 

[DSMnoobsause]

Pics of how you have them routed would help us help you.

 

[DSM4LIFE-AWD]

Pics of how you have them routed would help us help you.

Simple,

On the master near the booster, it goes on the front of the valve passenger side port.
On the master far from the booster, it goes on the front of the valve driver side port.

Front brake are on the buttom on each side of the valve.
Rear brake are on top on each side of the valve.

The more I think about it, the more I think my brake master cylinder is bad. Like is the primary or secondary port wasn't working.

 

[okm12346]

It doesnt matter if the primary and secondary lines out of the master go either to the left or right side of the prop valve as long they are in the correct ports.

If your front brakes work then your master is fine.

You're looking at kinked hard line for the rears, or rusted(clogged) prop valve.

Crack loose the fittings for the rear brakes at the prop valve and see if fluid is coming out

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[DSM4LIFE-AWD]

It doesnt matter if the primary and secondary lines out of the master go either to the left or right side of the prop valve as long they are in the correct ports.

If your front brakes work then your master is fine.

You're looking at kinked hard line for the rears, or rusted(clogged) prop valve.

Crack loose the fittings for the rear brakes at the prop valve and see if fluid is coming out

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Well I already disconnected the rear lines right at the prop valve and no oil is coming out. Lines aren't kink they are braided ss one and I know it's not the lines. I've read a bit yesterday and it's not because my front brakes are working that my brake master is good. You don't have 2 lines coming out of it for fun. It's because if one fail you don't loose all your brake ...

A friend on Talk told me that he has seen this on a car when the engine wasn't running. No vaccum in the booster ... He's not 100% sure why but hey it's better than nothing ...

Tonight I'll disconnect the line rigth on the master and see if both ports push oil, one a the time don't worry
Pretty sure I'll find that the secondary port isn't working. Yes it's not usualy how our master fail but I know it can happen.

Update:

I just talked with my machinist at the shop who built cars for years and he think it could be the rod from my booster that is pushing on the brake master piston. If it push too much on the piston well the secondary port will never get feed with oil !

Do you see where this is going ? Before replacing the master I'll try to unscrew the rod on the booster just a bit. I tryed to mesure everything when I installed it but it's hard to mesure in a round hole ...

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From my thread on Talk:

Originally Posted by Sean485
Has the car been run recently? Sometimes I've seen vehicles where the front brakes will work without booster power but the rear brakes will not.

I think you could be right my friend, I'm still reading and I now know why it could have work when the engine is running. In a manual I'm ready it cleary say:

Make the adjustment with the engine running to ensure the booster
has vacuum. The booster body will change shape when a vacuum is
applied and may reduce the clearance for rod adjustment.

This information come from http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/brake05.pdf on page 17 ...

Damn I never tough it would be that hard ... I guess this car will teach me something new every time I work on it ...
Got to love DSM ...

You know all this crap that is happening is just making me want to run a Buschur kit and delete the booster haha

Ok since I'm not ready to start the car to test that sh*t I just ordered a hand vacuum pump. With that tool I'll be able to put 18-21 Hg of vacuum on the booster just like if the car was running on idle. I than will be able to mesure or adjust the rod if the master still isn't pushing oil ...

Got to start somewhere ...

A kit just like this, cost me 45$ and I'll have it in my hand this afternoon

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[okm12346]

you should have bench bled the master before installin it in the car. that way you know the fluid is distributed everywhere.

 

[DSM4LIFE-AWD]

you should have bench bled the master before installin it in the car. that way you know the fluid is distributed everywhere.

Even if I would have bench bleed it, if the rod is pushing on the piston it would do the same ... But you're right I would have know if the master is working ... Thanks for the help dude

Here's the update from yesterday evening:

Ok I putted vacuum to the booster and it didn't change anything.

I checked the rod adjustment and it seems in spect. I disconnected my ss line on the prop valve and bench bleed the master in place. Got to love ss line. No change no oil exit the ports for the rear right at the valve. I had both rear hose disconnected and no oil in the port while my friend pump and hold the pedal.

Then I decided to swap the feed line right at the prop valve. Guess what !? No oil for the rear and still build pressure on the front caliper.

Got the valve in my hand now, how can I test it ?

It will be hard to say but I'll give a try. On the valve there is 2 feed ports, each feed is for a side of the car. So it's not front and rear but driver or passenger side.

I putted 100psi of aire into each feed and it only comes out from the front caliper ports. Even if I block the front caliper port, nothing wants to exit for the rear. It's doing this on both side ...

Maybe I'm not thinking right but I don't think it's normal. If we can bleed our system with the kit posted in this thread, there's no reason why 100psi wouldn't pass.

That's it for tonight ...

Than this morning:
Made an other quick test this morning here at the shop, we hooked some lines to the valve and tryed to suck fluid with my MV8500 from the ports for the rear brakes. Like I tought no oil exit those ports at 30Hg vacuum ... Vacuum stay build, nothing pass in the valve.

That confirm me that the prop. valve is bad. Seems to be stuck because yes there are some kind of check in this. Sean was right as usual haha

By the way, I forgot to say this but the prop. valve I have is a used one that my friend gave me when he parted his car. What an asshole haha

Ordering a new valve right now !

 

[luv2rallye]

Sometimes you can free them up by tapping them with a hammer. But you'll still need to replace it.

 

[DSM4LIFE-AWD]

Sometimes you can free them up by tapping them with a hammer. But you'll still need to replace it.

Got my new OEM proportionnal valve today, I can push air in it with my mouth ...

Et voila an other probleme resolve !

Thanks for the help guys !

/End thread