new cooling problem after fixing fans

[Anubis_4_99]

ok, so after i bought the 96 i discovered i had no cooling fans. dug into it after a little while and found the driver side fan was partially seized, it would still turn but pulled major power and ended up blowing the fuse.

also noticed that the coolant temp sensor was unplugged and jumped, so im assuming the fan was running constantly and was overworked, there by seizing up.

so now i have installed a new coolant temp sensor, repaired the splices where it was jumped, installed a new, and verified working thermostat, and a new driver side cooling fan. as well as draining and changing my fluid.

now the fans come on when they are supposed to, and work as they should. but here is my problem, my gauge still gets close to or just above 3/4 if i sit for too long. it never goes above this point, but it bothers me that it gets there to begin with.

also something i thought worthy to note is the radiator appears to be new or at the least, recently replaced.

so there it is, anyone with any info feel free to post, i would really appreciate any info i can get.

 

[Alan11]

-Bad Radiator cap
-Bad Thermostat
-Low on Coolant
-Coolant leaks (check hoses)
-Air pockets in the system.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

thermostat was tested and proven working, fluid level is full, just filled it, and im about 98% sure there are no air pockets but i will go through it again to make sure.

also there used to be a few leaks, but fixed those while i repaired the other things listed.

any way to test rad cap or is it best to just replace it?

 

[Bud92gsx]

If you sit for tooo long the fans are going to come on anyway..There is no air flowing through the radiator cooling the system..As long as the fans are turning on as they should your thermostat is working..

I would definatly let it cool down, and burp the coolant system..You could also check the coolant to water ratio..If there is too much coolant and not enough water it will run hotter sooner..

 

[Anubis_4_99]

well i know the fans are coming on, once i got everything fixed up i let it idle long enough for the fans to come on and shut off on there own twice. and i know the thermostat works because i boil tested it, opened at exactly the temp it was supposed to.

the coolant was the premixed type, so pretty sure it should be good, but i'll double check that as well.

If you sit for tooo long the fans are going to come on anyway..There is no air flowing through the radiator cooling the system..As long as the fans are turning on as they should your thermostat is working..

I would definatly let it cool down, and burp the coolant system..You could also check the coolant to water ratio..If there is too much coolant and not enough water it will run hotter sooner..

 

[Alan11]

Double check for all the little details.
Try a new Radiator cap is no more than $10

Also a clogged radiator, but you said it looks new.

I am starting to think its a blown head gasket.
Is it pushing coolant?

 

[Anubis_4_99]

i was wondering about a blown head gasket as well, but there is no oil or coolant mixing at all.

and how would i know if it's "pushing" coolant?

Double check for all the little details.
Try a new Radiator cap is no more than $10

I am starting to think its a blown head gasket.
Is it pushing coolant?

 

[TSiAWD666]

Sounds like a lot of unknowns with this car. If possible I'd find a way to measure the operating temperature of the car, especially whatever temperature you think the stock gauge is indicating as high. Maybe the previous owner pulled the needle and placed it back on improperly so a higher reading is actually in the normal range.

Pushing coolant means the car is pressurizing the coolant (by a leak somewhere internally allowing combustion gases to enter the coolant) and the coolant once up beyond the pressure of your radiator cap literally gets pushed out into your overflow. So check your overflow. You can also be more sure of this by getting a coolant testing kit from NAPA to test for the presence of combusion gases in the coolant. Alternatively you can rent (for free) a cooling system pressure tester from a place like Advance Auto and place the pressure tester on the radiator fill neck in lieu of the radiator cap. Run it up to operating temperature and watch the pressure on the gauge. I want to say when idling you shouldn't see the pressure go much past 7psi (don't quote me on this) but if you see the pressure continue to rise and start approaching the rad cap pressure rating (which is .9 bar I think for stock, or around 12-13psi?) you probably have a gasket leak or crack somewhere in the head/block.

 

[Alan11]

Pushing coolant into the overflow reservoir...
A compression test will tell if its a blown head gasket.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

it was bought for $500 where it sat under a tree for 3 months due to a bad alternator and no battery. so yeah everything so far is a surprise. i've found hacked stereo and interior wiring, some mystery wiring under the hood, and a few other things i've had to sort out. but during normal driving the temp stays at half way and never moves, but if i sit for 10 plus minutes thats when it starts rising a bit.

Sounds like a lot of unknowns with this car. If possible I'd find a way to measure the operating temperature of the car, especially whatever temperature you think the stock gauge is indicating as high. Maybe the previous owner pulled the needle and placed it back on improperly so a higher reading is actually in the normal range.

Alan11 Pushing coolant into the overflow reservoir...
A compression test will tell if its a blown head gasket.

and no its not pushing coolant into the overflow, i will break out my compression tester this weekend probably and get a reading on that.


thanks for the ideas so far guys, i'll give em a try and let you know! feel free to add anything else i might need to check.

 

[Alan11]

it was bought for $500 where it sat under a tree for 3 months due to a bad alternator and no battery. so yeah everything so far is a surprise. i've found hacked stereo and interior wiring, some mystery wiring under the hood, and a few other things i've had to sort out. but during normal driving the temp stays at half way and never moves, but if i sit for 10 plus minutes thats when it starts rising a bit.

OK so what fan turns on and off..
Or both turn on.?
Only one is supposed to turn on normally. The passenger side one.
The other one is when the engine is getting hotter. For example with the A/C on.

 

[Bud92gsx]

Yes Carlos the passenger side one is for the engine, and the drivers side fan is for the ac..That would be kinda cool tho if they both turned on when the car got hot..

 

[Anubis_4_99]

the driver side fan turns on normally, both turn on with the ac switch.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

ok i attached a pic of what my gauge gets up to after idling for more then 10 minutes. its now also accompanied by blue smoke and the smell of burning oil. but i dont seem to be loosing oil.

so im leaning towards a head gasket as well, gonna go do a compression test in about 10 minutes so i can let it warm up.

compression numbers are in and as follows from passenger side to driver side.

numbers are while warm and WOT, 210, 180, 190, 210

so to me it looks like its blown between cylinders 2 and 3, yes? if so here is my next question.

how bad would it be to drive on this for say, a month and a half? i have no coolant and oil mixing, and i check both levels and colors every few days.

only reason for needing to wait for a month and a half is i get school loans in by that time and will have the cash to throw at it.

 

[Alan11]

Compression looks good.
If i were you i would look really deep into the problem.
IF the car goes back to normal temperature while driving then there is still hope.


I will say to flush the whole system. Get a new Radiator cap, new thermostat( That yours opens doesn't mean that it works well, it can stay stuck open)...

And blue smoke it can be bad rings,vale steam seals or again the head gasket.

I would not drive it.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

yes it goes back to normal operating temp while driving, and stays there. it only gets that high like i said earlier, after 10+ minutes of idling or slow traffic driving.

as far as the compression, i was under the impression, from reading somewhere, that an acceptable psi difference in the readings was 14psi. did i just read wrong?

a new rad cap is in the works for today, as far as the thermostat, i have gotten bad ones before, which is why i boil tested it, and it opens and closes exactly as it should, but i'll get another one and see if it operates any differently then mine does and if so i will replace it.

and unfortunately i dont have another vehicle to drive, so i cant put the eclipse down, i am limiting my driving though, when i get my loans though i can do whatever i need to, from a hg to a new motor, so as long as it lasts that long i can fix it.

 

[bullettdsm]

yes it goes back to normal operating temp while driving, and stays there. it only gets that high like i said earlier, after 10+ minutes of idling or slow traffic driving.

Double check the simple stuff (you can search on here for my listing of what to look at for overheating. I've put it in a few threads over the years. Also, be sure that the temp is what it says it is. Those stock gauges aren't necessarilly accurate. But if it is higher than it normally operates, then obviously, its giving you correct info), but suspicions are pointing to HG. The comp doesn't necessarilly have to show that bad on bad HG's. Obviously, a more accurate test would be a leak down to see where the air is going. Does sound like you got a HG on the way out though.

Honestly, I would keep driving it. Worst thing that will happen will be something may give way in the HG and you'll turn into James Bond with the smoke screen out the back (been there, done that). Then you are limited on time to get her somewhere (but that probably won't happen)

But keep in mind (especially with the high temps), when I do a headgasket, I like to at least have the head checked for flatness. In the scenario that you have, I would just go ahead and have it decked.

MB

 

[Th3DooM]

I drove my car for more than 1.5 years with exactly the same problem. I changed my radiator, thermostat, fluid, sensors, just everything. In the end it was the wrong thermostat that I bought with the oem parts number. They gave me a 195° t-stat, but IMO it's way to high. I just drilled two holes into it and now everything is perfect. The gauge stays a lil bit under the center, just like how it's supposed to be.

But blue smoke is never a good thing. I'd check the valve seals. In case it is the head gasket your coolant fluid would boil.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

That's what they gave me was a 195 and I was curious as to if it wouldn't be too hot. What size holes and where did you drill them?

I think when my loans come in I will pull the head and just go through it for good measure, I would rather go through it and spend the cash while I have it then get screwed afterwards and not have the cash to fix it.

I drove my car for more than 1.5 years with exactly the same problem. I changed my radiator, thermostat, fluid, sensors, just everything. In the end it was the wrong thermostat that I bought with the oem parts number. They gave me a 195° t-stat, but IMO it's way to high. I just drilled two holes into it and now everything is perfect. The gauge stays a lil bit under the center, just like how it's supposed to be.

But blue smoke is never a good thing. I'd check the valve seals. In case it is the head gasket your coolant fluid would boil.

As for the head, yeah I plan on having it decked and magnafluxed to make sure there aren't any cracks etc. Probably have it hot tanked too. Anyone local know a good machine shop?

 

[bo0st]

I just had my eclipse sitting for about 5 - 6 months and then after I started driving it again, it rose to about 3/4 when idling at a stop light or somewhere. When I was driving it was alright but the high temperature at idle really concerned me because my car never got that hot under any conditions..

I tried out some royal purple purple ice radiator thing from oreilly autoparts and it was pretty good it got me back to half temps all the time.. I recommend you try it out if you want a possible quick fix.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

thanks for the info, i will probably try that stuff out.

i just replaced my thermostat with a 180 degree and it still goes about 3/4 once the thermostat opens and the fans turn on.

i just got my new headgasket in today and have new rod bolts waiting as well. hopefully this week i will be ripping into it and replacing them.

i seem to be burning about a quart of oil every 1500 miles or so, and about a quarter gallon of coolant every week and a half. neither one is mixing at all though, and i have no leaks present under the vehicle after driving and parking.

when i get ready to do the headgasket i will be ordering in new valve stem seals as well and doing them while the motor is apart.

one thing i did notice is that i may or may not have a coolant leak behind the motor, i changed my vss, and there was a light coating of coolant along that whole area of the transmission. although i also spilled some on the power steering while i was filling it and it flung it a ways, so maybe that's what it came from...

anyone have ideas on a possible coolant leak behind the motor?

*edit*
i boil tested this thermostat as well, and on comparison i can say my old one only opened about half way, if that.

I just had my eclipse sitting for about 5 - 6 months and then after I started driving it again, it rose to about 3/4 when idling at a stop light or somewhere. When I was driving it was alright but the high temperature at idle really concerned me because my car never got that hot under any conditions..

I tried out some royal purple purple ice radiator thing from oreilly autoparts and it was pretty good it got me back to half temps all the time.. I recommend you try it out if you want a possible quick fix.

 

[Alan11]

anyone have ideas on a possible coolant leak behind the motor?

Heater core hoses.. that could be your whole problem.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

how much of a pain are those going to be to get at?

it was a royal pain to get the vss changed out. i'm a bit of a fluffy guy

 

[Alan11]

how much of a pain are those going to be to get at?

it was a royal pain to get the vss changed out. i'm a bit of a fluffy guy

They are a PITA. Take you time and remove all the stuff you need. (Intake,battery,ect.ect)
Seriously do it carefully and don't break the connection that is coming out from the the firewall connected to the hoses.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

They are a PITA. Take you time and remove all the stuff you need. (Intake,battery,ect.ect)
Seriously do it carefully and don't break the connection that is coming out from the the firewall connected to the hoses.

Ive broken those on an integra i owned once, i nearly set the car on fire right then and there .

i work a job where i can afford to have my car down for weeks at a time, so i will probably pull it apart soon and just easy go it. thanks for the info.