Must haves to transfer from autocross to road course.

[dwdsm]

I'm thinking about my goal of moving from autocross to the local road course this summer and am considering parts that I'll need. I have plans of swapping out the 2g brakes for Evo brembo's and DBA rotors but other then that is there any necessary bracing to keep the girl square from the increased speeds and loads? I run the BFG Comp 2s for autocross on Evo 9 wheels and have a good cooling system for the oil and Coolant.
Thanks for the input.

 

[Ludachris]

I'm thinking about my goal of moving from autocross to the local road course this summer and am considering parts that I'll need. I have plans of swapping out the 2g brakes for Evo brembo's and DBA rotors but other then that is there any necessary bracing to keep the girl square from the increased speeds and loads? I run the BFG Comp 2s for autocross on Evo 9 wheels and have a good cooling system for the oil and Coolant.
Thanks for the input.

Maybe consider looking into a roll bar for safety? I got one from these guys for my 1g GSX, which I have yet to install:
95-99 MITSUBISHI ECLIPSE

Just felt it was worth it for the track. They sell you a set of pre-bent and notched tubing and mounting plates. You get it welded (or weld it yourself if you're a pro).

Other than that, make sure your cooling system is working well. Longer stints mean hotter underhood temps.

 

[FIBA M - EC17PSE]

Looking at your specs you are pretty good, if you get real serious then add a roll cage and some fender braces. The Evo calipers will be a good upgrade as the faster and harder braking loads will need to be looked at so at least your thinking that way, another is brake fluid but that can be done when you do the calipers,

Other then that your pretty set for now.

 

[2gmitsueclipse]

I would also recommend fresh high temp brake fluid (month or less old). More frequent oil changes also. A dedicated set of race pads (Carbotech for me) with dedicated rotors for them. I would also bring an extra set of rotors and pads should you need them to get home if you drive it to the track.

 

[Ludachris]

Looking at your specs you are pretty good, if you get real serious then add a roll cage and some fender braces. The Evo calipers will be a good upgrade as the faster and harder braking loads will need to be looked at so at least your thinking that way, another is brake fluid but that can be done when you do the calipers,

Other then that your pretty set for now.

I would say that if you plan to do road course days regularly, a roll bar should be in the plans. I've seen a few bad accidents at road courses and it's motivated me to get at least a 4-6 point roll bar installed.

 

[FIBA M - EC17PSE]

I would say that if you plan to do road course days regularly, a roll bar should be in the plans. I've seen a few bad accidents at road courses and it's motivated me to get at least a 4-6 point roll bar installed.

Yeah thats why i said if he gets serious about it as not everyone continues to do them and a roll cage might be a pain if he decides to not continue with it all. If he likes it then it gets serious then of course get one but a few taster days will see if he wants to be serious or not!

I fully agree on getting one, even if its just s central bar to help protect a little bit

 

[Pipnorcali]

Im hard on brakes so i need a better set and cooling those are usally my issues

 

[dwdsm]

Thanks for the brake fluid recommendation, I will definitely have to bleed the system of all the old Dot 3. I plan on only testing the waters this summer possibly 2 or 3 open track days. I also may finally finish my front splitter and add ducting for the front brakes while I'm in there. I'll consider the rollcage after the summer if I catch the road racing bug.

 

[GofaST4life]

Like already mentioned, Road Racing is much more rigorous on a car than a quick AX stint.

You'll definitely want to check, change, or replace the following items. Most people think its overkill, but honestly, your better safe than sorry. Right? Had a friend do brakes, rotors and what not, but never checked his suspension. He had a weak tie rod that ended up breaking and sending him off course into a tire wall.

- Brakes (Pads & Rotors)
- Brake Fluid
- Coolant
- Tires (no cords or uneven wear, proper PSI)
- Suspension Components (tie rods, control arms, ball joints, etc)
- Transmission Fluid
- Clutch Fluid

And, like many have said, if you do get the bug, a roll cage is always worth it. You just never know when it might save your life.


Go have fun!

 

[FIBA M - EC17PSE]

Thanks for the brake fluid recommendation, I will definitely have to bleed the system of all the old Dot 3. I plan on only testing the waters this summer possibly 2 or 3 open track days. I also may finally finish my front splitter and add ducting for the front brakes while I'm in there. I'll consider the rollcage after the summer if I catch the road racing bug.

Yeah dot 4 race fluid will help heaps plus add stainless brake lines aswell.

 

[gho5tone]

I also recommend better cooling ducting for both brakes and the engine.

 

[cait sith]

Easy stuff:

Turn your boost down.

Blanket/wrap everything (eg exhaust manifold/turbo/O2 housing/half your downpipe), and then some.

Take out a degree of timing in your ECU settings/what you run for pump gas and then drive with race gas. It'll help give more of a margin for error with long straights.

Drill two small holes in your thermostat.

Get a coolant burp tank.

Build some sheet metal ducting between the FMIC to the radiator.

Hook the dipstick down so it doesn't blow out.

Extremes:

Lose the giant FMIC/Go to a smaller turbo (eg EVO 3/20G/FP68HTA maybe? mayyyybe FP3052 level as a max (IDK off the top of my head if DSM shops still build something so small these days of a turbo that much) but I've been having a bear of a time trying to keep it cool...). 400whp sounds cool, but it makes you rely on horsepower instead of developing handling skills. Making the car into more of a momentum vehicle vs. big acceleration -> big brakes -> try to muscle through turns is less than efficient, but some of us like banging our heads against the wall.

Get a fixed back bucket seat (DSM leather seats suck, get something FIA approved and not a reclinable eBay set), better steering wheel, at least a 4 point SFI rated harness.

Eventual advice:

Sell the car and buy an EVO/C5 Z06 Corvette/Spec Miata and stop banging your head against the wall with an under supported, aging floppy platform.

===

EVO Brembo brakes are fine, get some decent track pads (which the normal GSX 2 pots never get) and don't get drilled rotors.

I wouldn't honestly worry about bracing or whatever if your balljoints/etc are in decent shape. You're going to have a big enough problem learning how to drive the car at a ragged pace if you're making so much power. The less power you throw down the more you're going to learn. I know it sucks to hear that, but I learned more/turned faster laps with my car on a bigT28 than I have with a 3052 if only because of chasing cooling bugs and trying to get the right rhythm with the car.

 

[T2Small]

I know it sucks to hear that, but I learned more/turned faster laps with my car on a bigT28 than I have with a 3052 if only because of chasing cooling bugs and trying to get the right rhythm with the car.

I completely agree with this. Same turbos, same problems.

 

[WFO-TSi]

You say your cooling system is good to go, I hate guessing. I’d suggest some gauges to monitor actual coolant, oil, and trans temps.

If you have your mind set on stiffening up the chassi I’d also look at these guys…

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...ow-install-solid-bushings-front-subframe.html

While I still don’t have a cage I can definitely attest to the front and rear subframe bushings from black_gst stiffening up my car. I see you have DSMLink and therefore would have an account on their forum. If you want more info on the bushings there is a post by Andrew Brilliant that actually quantifies the improvement they made…check this link and note what Andrew Brilliant says on page 10.

ECMTuning User Support Forums

The cage is a very valid point as you can’t put a price on your life. My not having one is pure laziness.

One final point. cait sith has been doing this stuff for a LOOOONG time. If he takes the time to add his 2 cents to a post its worth taking notes. Some of what he says may be harsh but its just tough love

 

[arrowhead]

All of the above, with emphasis on at least a bolt on roll bar, then brakes, including ss lines.

If you decide to go further, a fender brace like is sold by one of the members here would be a large improvement.

To further stiffen your chassis do a subframe reinforcement.

I could go on but ,with what has been mentioned before you should have a good start.

Enjoy it and be safe

 

[theamsoilguy]

Proper seat and belts, hans device, roll CAGE, 3 layer suit with gloves and shoes. If you look at any sanctioning body for road racing you need all of that plus more like kill switch, fire system, etc. Those requirements are there for good reason. Lapping is different that road racing, however a crash for whatever reason has the same results, so plan for the safety stuff. Log book, tire pressure gauge, tire temp guage (laser ones are cheap and can also record rotor temp, manifold temp, etc ). I see a lot of people who dont look at tire temps and pressure close enough for road racing. For example I ended up 7-9 psi higher that what I start with from building up the temps.

 

[cait sith]

You're nuts. You don't need a cage (much less a hans device/fire system/etc!!!) for a car that hasn't ever seen a track, and is going to be puttering around in the newbie group HPDE with a piggy understeering AWD car.

 

[untouchablecc]

Which track do you plan on running at around here? Beaver Run? Thats the only one I know of to do this kinda stuff. Im just curious because Im kinda over the drag racing thing myself. Btw I think I might of met you at PRP once a few years ago, I remember the car and the owner was from washington PA I think, if your him. If not my bad haha.

 

[theamsoilguy]

You're nuts. You don't need a cage (much less a hans device/fire system/etc!!!) for a car that hasn't ever seen a track, and is going to be puttering around in the newbie group HPDE with a piggy understeering AWD car.

If your club racing, those are probably the requirements. Cage, hans, 5 point but not fire are the requirements locally for me. If your just doing lapping they are not. Fire systems are now mandatory in the Chump Car series and it wont be long where its required in all club racing is my guess.

 

[Jay Cooper]

Don't pull timing, it will cause higher EGT. Keep it simple and you need virtually nothing over basic maintenance and what ever the track rules say. We run a 1g for 24 hours at a time on street tires, good pads, and a bunch of duct work and a proper alignment. We are likely lighter than you but as long as you don't have stock wheels you won't boil the brake fluid.

Make over 300whp and have a street/strip cooling sytem and not heat shielding on your hot side your asking for trouble. Put a giant fmic in front of the rad and no duct or hood vent and your asking for it. Run slicks on your first outing, power shift, attempt heel toe, worry about lap time and your asking for it.

Just be conservative. Remember that the car takes a lap of two to come in. Don't hammer down the first lap of your second session just like you last the last lap of you first. Be smooth and memorize not just the course direction but that one skid mark that you brake on and the filled in crack that marks your apex. Get to know your tires.

 

[Phil1320]

Everyone has listed off pretty much everything here. The only thing that I didn't see anywhere, would be wheel bearings. If you have a high mileage car with original bearings, as a precaution you may want to swap in a fresh set. This especially applies to the fronts.

Also, if you're new to the road course, I'd recommend running your first several sessions on a High Performance Summer tire rather than jumping right to an R compound or full slick. Gotta let the car move around a little and get used to that before you give it all the stick.

Have fun!

 

[dwdsm]

Which track do you plan on running at around here? Beaver Run? Thats the only one I know of to do this kinda stuff. Im just curious because Im kinda over the drag racing thing myself. Btw I think I might of met you at PRP once a few years ago, I remember the car and the owner was from washington PA I think, if your him. If not my bad haha.

Yup that's me I'm sure. My buddy Mario had a white 1g but if it was a 2g that would probably me myself. Although I think there was another with a green roll cage running around for a while. Come autocross sometime or try out this trackcross on the big track. Trackcross | Pittsburgh International Race Complex

 

[dwdsm]

Easy stuff:

Turn your boost down.

Blanket/wrap everything (eg exhaust manifold/turbo/O2 housing/half your downpipe), and then some.

Take out a degree of timing in your ECU settings/what you run for pump gas and then drive with race gas. It'll help give more of a margin for error with long straights.

Drill two small holes in your thermostat.

Get a coolant burp tank.

Build some sheet metal ducting between the FMIC to the radiator.

Hook the dipstick down so it doesn't blow out.

Extremes:

Lose the giant FMIC/Go to a smaller turbo (eg EVO 3/20G/FP68HTA maybe? mayyyybe FP3052 level as a max (IDK off the top of my head if DSM shops still build something so small these days of a turbo that much) but I've been having a bear of a time trying to keep it cool...). 400whp sounds cool, but it makes you rely on horsepower instead of developing handling skills. Making the car into more of a momentum vehicle vs. big acceleration -> big brakes -> try to muscle through turns is less than efficient, but some of us like banging our heads against the wall.

Get a fixed back bucket seat (DSM leather seats suck, get something FIA approved and not a reclinable eBay set), better steering wheel, at least a 4 point SFI rated harness.

Eventual advice:

Sell the car and buy an EVO/C5 Z06 Corvette/Spec Miata and stop banging your head against the wall with an under supported, aging floppy platform.

===

EVO Brembo brakes are fine, get some decent track pads (which the normal GSX 2 pots never get) and don't get drilled rotors.

I wouldn't honestly worry about bracing or whatever if your balljoints/etc are in decent shape. You're going to have a big enough problem learning how to drive the car at a ragged pace if you're making so much power. The less power you throw down the more you're going to learn. I know it sucks to hear that, but I learned more/turned faster laps with my car on a bigT28 than I have with a 3052 if only because of chasing cooling bugs and trying to get the right rhythm with the car.

Thanks for all the Input:
When I built the car I did take a lot of time thinking about the future so currently the car has:
-Scroth Rally I harnesses
-Full urethane bushings
-Sparco adjustable back seats
-Sparco steering wheel
-245/45/17 BFG Comp 2's that will be used at the track.
-full heat wrapped exhaust and blanketed turbine housing
-Large aluminum radiator with electric fan controller.
-During the orgional build 7 years ago it got new ball joints and wheel bearings at least in the front of the car.
- I do have a 1 quart coolant burp tank
-Stainless brake lines
-The catch can setup solves the popping dip stick issue many have.
Also currently I am trying to sell the 50trim for a FP 71HTA as I do autocross and really want to be competitive in the dsmshootout max effort next year. So I still need some air flow.

Brake ducting and finishing the front splitter is in the works as well as an evo rear diff.

I'm going to enter this event first as it seems like an easy beginning.
Trackcross | Pittsburgh International Race Complex

 

[turbosax2]

I'm going to enter this event first as it seems like an easy beginning.
Trackcross | Pittsburgh International Race Complex

That looks fun, maybe I'll have to get in on some of that this year