Ideal surge tank design for DSM road racing

[Ludachris]

Can we get a shot of a 2G in the same location to see if there's the same amount of space?

 

[Ludachris]

Can the 2G guys post photos of the area on both sides of their fuel tank? I'd like to see if they're the same as the 2G N/T - I have access to a 2G N/T for measuring. But I don't know if the N/T and the turbo models are the same back there.

 

[turbosax2]

I believe the N/T and turbo FWD are very similar in the rear, if not identical, but the AWD is different.

 

[Ludachris]

I'm only interested in the space next in the rear on the side where the muffler is NOT located on the 2G, as highlighted in this photo:

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Are there differences in that area between the FWD, AWD and N/T 2G cars? I know the rear suspension is different, but I'm guessing the location I'm interested in is similar, if not the same.

 

[turbosax2]

I'm confused where you're talking about. Our fuel tanks are under the rear seats, on the front side of the rear crossmember. We have the spare well in the back near the muffler.

FWD:

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AWD:

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[Ludachris]

I'm looking for pics of behind the rear suspension on the side opposite the muffler. The last photo posted shows a part of that area, but not very well.

 

[turbosax2]

Those are the best I got, hopefully someone else can contribute.

 

[Ludachris]

Those are the best I got, hopefully someone else can contribute.

As far as you know, are the spare tire wells the same on all 2G's? It appears that's the case in the photos.

 

[turbosax2]

I've never inspected a n/t in person, but I would think they're all the same back there.

 

[turbosax2]

I think the Chilton manual has some good underbody shots of all the models. Anybody have one handy that can check?

 

[Ludachris]

I think the Chilton manual has some good underbody shots of all the models. Anybody have one handy that can check?

I think I have one at home... I'll have to check.

 

[tsiboosted]

If my car was not at the trannsmission shop I would get out there and snap some off. Are you looking for a place to maybe mount a surge tank like the earlier pics in this thread Chris?

 

[gixxerdrew]

I'm working on this right now actually. Some delays because I'm out of the country for for a little bit but I should have one of these running by year end. It will be mounted in the trunk as one of the primary purposes is to gravity feed the aeromotive eliminator pump. -6 in -8 return (to tank) -12 feed to main pump -8 return from rail. Provisions for level sensor warning, temperature sensor for AEM fuel density compensation. Too bad I missed this thread until now!

I'm also going to have another line with an aeromotive shut off valve that I can open and close to drain the swirl pot back to the main tank. This is for switching fuels so I dont have to drain the swirl pot. Also a T junction/switch at the fill from the main tank so that the main in tank pump can be used to connect a hose to and pump out fuel quickly/easily. Something like a reserve tank switch except that it switches the stock in tank pump to push fuel out to either a -6 fitting or to the fill on the surge tank. That way pumping out fuel I just flip the switch attach a hose out to the jug and kick on the in tank pump

I will try to power the in tank pump off of the voltage control as well so that they both run on 9v when I am off boost to save on power consumption. At zero pressure at 12v+ I think a 255 walboro can supply the fuel required by 700whp

I may include a spare fitting for feed from an aux fuel tank for events like silver state or when using E85 and extra fuel capacity may be called for.

 

[Ludachris]

If my car was not at the trannsmission shop I would get out there and snap some off. Are you looking for a place to maybe mount a surge tank like the earlier pics in this thread Chris?

Yes, I'm looking at that location as a mounting point. The goal is to create a surge tank design that will fit both a 1G and a 2G with the only difference being brackets. I don't think it should be too difficult to achieve. I might be able to get a vendor interested. I just want to make it easy for them so that they can make them available at a good price.

 

[turbosax2]

I'm working on this right now actually. Some delays because I'm out of the country for for a little bit but I should have one of these running by year end. It will be mounted in the trunk as one of the primary purposes is to gravity feed the aeromotive eliminator pump. -6 in -8 return (to tank) -12 feed to main pump -8 return from rail. Provisions for level sensor warning, temperature sensor for AEM fuel density compensation. Too bad I missed this thread until now!

I'm also going to have another line with an aeromotive shut off valve that I can open and close to drain the swirl pot back to the main tank. This is for switching fuels so I dont have to drain the swirl pot. Also a T junction/switch at the fill from the main tank so that the main in tank pump can be used to connect a hose to and pump out fuel quickly/easily. Something like a reserve tank switch except that it switches the stock in tank pump to push fuel out to either a -6 fitting or to the fill on the surge tank. That way pumping out fuel I just flip the switch attach a hose out to the jug and kick on the in tank pump

I will try to power the in tank pump off of the voltage control as well so that they both run on 9v when I am off boost to save on power consumption. At zero pressure at 12v+ I think a 255 walboro can supply the fuel required by 700whp

I may include a spare fitting for feed from an aux fuel tank for events like silver state or when using E85 and extra fuel capacity may be called for.

Wow, great information and you have great ideas! Please be sure to keep us updated, I'm very interested to see how this turns out.

Chris, you might want to consider adding some of these features like the low fuel warning and drain.

 

[gixxerdrew]

Wow, great information and you have great ideas! Please be sure to keep us updated, I'm very interested to see how this turns out.

Chris, you might want to consider adding some of these features like the low fuel warning and drain.

Thank you! I'm thinking to try one of the low coolant warning sensors from any OEM application. Summit has a bunch for around $30. The temp sensor will be standard GM because thats easy to map the correction to in AEM. Thanks to NABR for the help on that.

 

[Flash]

Chris, contact Peterson Fluid Systems if you want a nice tank. Peterson makes some extremely nice products and best of all they are located in Colorado a few minutes away from where we live. They are reasonably priced and are extremely willing to make a custom tank. Check them out, their products are impressive. They might be able to do something about a dry sump system too.

Peterson Fluid Systems
9801 Havana St
Henderson, CO 80640
Phone: (800) 926-7867
Peterson Fluid Systems

 

[Ludachris]

Chris, contact Peterson Fluid Systems if you want a nice tank. Peterson makes some extremely nice products and best of all they are located in Colorado a few minutes away from where we live. They are reasonably priced and are extremely willing to make a custom tank. Check them out, their products are impressive. They might be able to do something about a dry sump system too.

Peterson Fluid Systems
9801 Havana St
Henderson, CO 80640
Phone: (800) 926-7867
Peterson Fluid Systems

I'll look into that, but the idea is to come up with a design that can be sold to the DSM crowd at a lower price than say, Canton products. I'm not just looking for a tank for myself here, but more of a solution for all DSM road racers.

 

[Ludachris]

I'm just now starting to source some parts for this project - what would a good fuel pump combo be? I currently have a Walbro 255HP in the tank. I was thinking about going with a Bosch 044 external. I see that AMS uses an external Walbro 255 with their kit. Would it be wise to go with another 255HP or should the external be rated a little higher than the in-tank pump?

 

[gixxerdrew]

Mine will be done in roughly 2 wks time

I reccomend the bosch pumps I'll be running dual 044

 

[waltizie]

Any update on the surge tank?

 

[gixxerdrew]

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raced on it. Ran the gas level down to the warning lamp being lit. That is in comparison to not even able to go 3 gallons less than full at the last race.

 

[waltizie]

What size tank are you using 2 liter?

 

[gixxerdrew]

5 or 6 liter I think... its big. Supra pump and twin bosch 044

 

[waltizie]

Wow that is large. Are you running the bosch's in the tank and the supra inline? Are you taking the car with you when you go to japan?