Here is how my CYCLONE manifold will be activated.

[SnowBird]

Screw all the nonsense with having trouble opening up the butterflys at a certain RPM, or using the canister and solenoids. This is the T25 actuator mod for those who havent seen it. Its an easy way to get them to stay closed and open up at 8PSI. It will run of manifold pressure and will open up the butterflys @ around 8 psi when the actuator arm extends.

For people not sure what the cyclone is good for, it is good for bottom end torque associated with spooling up the turbo, preferably a big turbo, but hey faster spool up on any turbo is never a bad thing in my opinion.

 

[projecTSI]

What Lofty posted is the same thing in theory. It is a product from Sound Performance for twin scroll turbos. What it does is keeps one side of the scrolls blocked off for faster spoolup, and then the actuator opens up the other side when it reaches a certain boost level.

 

[Highbooost]

Where does that big bracket with butterfly go? I dont see anywhere that could bolt to or work, all the butterflys for the cyclone are inside and run on a long shaft, so I dont see how that flange with one big throttle body looking butterfly would work. How does that work and where does it go?

Trust me I'm a doctor.

Later Dr Turbo


Edit veiw post # 134 on the thread "who is dr turbo" to see pics

 

[rbwtrans]

I wonder if having them open at 8psi is better than having them open at a certain RPM? Also I wondered if you could lengthen the closed time (say to 12psi) with a simple MBC?

 

[99 GST-R]

Ok so what this does is it helps big turbos spool up faster... Whats the theory behind it? This is really cool. Whats the gain over a normal one? Would this work on a 2g? It would be awesome if it works and would work on a 2g because I want to upgrade to a 20g turbo.

 

[SnowBird]

Ok so what this does is it helps big turbos spool up faster... Whats the theory behind it? This is really cool. Whats the gain over a normal one? Would this work on a 2g? It would be awesome if it works and would work on a 2g because I want to upgrade to a 20g turbo.

Yes this would work just the same on a 2G, and with a 20G it would make a mean street setup. If Im not mistaken the cyclone was originally of an old EVO series with the 7 bolt.

 

[spoonman]

but hey faster spool up on any turbo is never a bad thing in my opinion.

You have never had a FWD, .

Snow bird, I have never seen someone use an internal wastegate actuator to open a cyclone manifold before. Very good idea I am surprised that I have never thought of or seen this before. One good thing about using the WG is that you can use a MBC to dial in at what boost the valves in the intake open, and that the the wastegate will crack open slightly and then gradually open intill it is fully open instead of having the valves open or closed.

 

[Highbooost]

Ok so what this does is it helps big turbos spool up faster... Whats the theory behind it? This is really cool. Whats the gain over a normal one? Would this work on a 2g? It would be awesome if it works and would work on a 2g because I want to upgrade to a 20g turbo.

Simple reply: it is like sticking your thumb over the end of a hose, but we are talking big turbos, not to put you down put a 20g is not big and I would think there would be little to no gain, the switch over point should be around 4K where your 20g should be at full spool anyhow. The actuator needs to switch at a RPM point, not a boost point. A RPM switch with a solenoid is the key to making this work. And yes this would work on a 2g. However for every gain there is a fall, when running a large turbo most DSMers like to have short runner manifolds to help higher breathing, this manifold WILL NOT do that. For me road racing I don't really care I am much more interested in torque, if you are going to be dragging this is not the mod for you.

Later Dr Turbo

 

[SnowBird]

You have never had a FWD, .

Snow bird, I have never seen someone use an internal wastegate actuator to open a cyclone manifold before. Very good idea I am surprised that I have never thought of or seen this before. One good thing about using the WG is that you can use a MBC to dial in at what boost the valves in the intake open, and that the the wastegate will crack open slightly and then gradually open intill it is fully open instead of having the valves open or closed.

Haha, yeah Ive never had a FWD DSM. I was under the impression that once the actuator hit 8PSI it would open them up all the way, depending on the length of the arm on the actuator.

 

[Highbooost]

You have never had a FWD, .

Snow bird, I have never seen someone use an internal wastegate actuator to open a cyclone manifold before. Very good idea I am surprised that I have never thought of or seen this before. One good thing about using the WG is that you can use a MBC to dial in at what boost the valves in the intake open, and that the the wastegate will crack open slightly and then gradually open intill it is fully open instead of having the valves open or closed.

There are some draw backs to that method. All MBC need a small hole to bleed boost off during shift, you have now created a boost leak, Second you would always have to run the same boost, becuase if you start messing with it then you have to also mess around with the actuator controller as well. uGGG that would be a tunning night mare.

Later Dr Turbo

 

[99 GST-R]

Hmm I see, thats fricken sweet! But no I dont plan on doing a drag set-up with my FWD. Im gonna have to add this to my wish list of parts. Even if I dont see much of a gain with that set-up and a 20g it might be worth it to find out.

 

[Highbooost]

To be honest it probably isn't worth the time and effort, cost of the manifold, rigging up a system, etc etc. It is a time consuming process. To be honest if you are FWD I would advise completly the other direction as torque is your enemy, you would want a SMIM for those long tall gears in the higher RPMS, even if it isn't drag. You can spin that 20G to 8000 all day long.

Later Dr Turbo

 

[99 GST-R]

Wow, thanks for the info! Ill look into that. Sometimes I wish I had gotten a GSX but this one was so clean and it was driven by an older gentlemen so it was a steal for what I paid for it... Oh well I can always get a GSX later, it's not like they are 20 grand cars anymore, I can afford two.... or three.

 

[desperatebroken]

dont mean to hijack you thread but id like to see what dr turbo says about my thread which turbo he can give me some insight on

 

[Highbooost]

dont mean to hijack you thread but id like to see what dr turbo says about my thread which turbo he can give me some insight on

I only input information when there is none else available, there are 1000 threads on here about turbo selections etc. Happy reading.

Later Dr Turbo

 

[crimsondragon]

No, this doesnt come on the stock IM or the Cyclone, I had it put on. I bet you are looking at your FPR on your fuel rail.



The stock intake flows 203CFM, The cyclone flows 201CFM. You think thats lacking? You wont even feel it, Ive rode in cars with this done before I persued it, you cant feel the slight loss of 2 CFM at redline, at least on an ass dyno. 2 CFM isnt much, when turbos flow xxx amounts.

I think you read me wrong. I said lacking in comparison to SMIM. Sheet Metal Intake Manifold. Yanno. The kind that sometimes come with velocity stacks and usually provide about 25hp on the top end with a well designed one. I don't know what your goals are. Maybe it's for better spool? More fuel efficient? One thing is for sure, you're not making big numbers anytimes soon with it.

 

[SnowBird]

I think you read me wrong. I said lacking in comparison to SMIM. Sheet Metal Intake Manifold. Yanno. The kind that sometimes come with velocity stacks and usually provide about 25hp on the top end with a well designed one. I don't know what your goals are. Maybe it's for better spool? More fuel efficient? One thing is for sure, you're not making big numbers anytimes soon with it.

My bad, I was looking at it as SIM for stock intake manifold or something, I missed that. Its good for making big numbers, performs better the bigger the turbo. Im not looking to have huge numbers like 500-600 HP, I drive this car everyday and just need it to be a fast AWD streetcar, but look at the numbers the guy I got it from put down with it in his cars.
Read through this page http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/bol...manifold-where-can-i-get-gasket-make-one.html where member Forces32Psi post#20 talks about the guy, Jerry "lancerman", hes the DSM guru here in the TampaBay area, but he was able to put them to some good use. Right above that post is a wiseman stating people have made 500WHP on the stock manifold. Im not on here stating Im gonna get mad power out of the cyclone, its just like a stock manifold, it just diverts the air differently for more torque, and I can use that on the street with an AWD.

 

[BoredDSM]

Can you explain your theory behind this? The only benefit I see is you would have a higher air velocity below whatever level you set it at to open. Yes you will get more mid range and low end power but at higher rpm's when your in higher boost it still will not flow as much as if the butterfly flapper wasn't there. The butterfly still takes up volume and is a restriction.

 

[toofast82]

i'm not going to get in the controversy of the cyclone intake. it is supposed to be proven to enhance low and mid torque and help spoolup. But what i did want to comment on is the creativity of using the wastegate to actuate it. very smart and simple. thumbs up!

 

[SnowBird]

i'm not going to get in the controversy of the cyclone intake. it is supposed to be proven to enhance low and mid torque and help spoolup. But what i did want to comment on is the creativity of using the wastegate to actuate it. very smart and simple. thumbs up!

Thanks, I didnt create it, but have rode in vehicles with it done.

IN GENERAL:Lets not get of subject here guys. I didnt create this post with the topic "Cyclone intake manifold is the best manifold to have" wanting to argue with everybody about whether its worth it or not. Half of the crap you can read on this website about it are from people with failed attempts at getting it to work properly, so they just bashed the whole concept of it putting out a bad word of mouth over and over again.

I opened the thread to show people how Im gonna have mine ran, and maybe encourage someone else to give it a try with a simple solution on how to run the butterflys. Thanks.

 

[crimsondragon]

My bad, I was looking at it as SIM for stock intake manifold or something, I missed that. Its good for making big numbers, performs better the bigger the turbo. Im not looking to have huge numbers like 500-600 HP, I drive this car everyday and just need it to be a fast AWD streetcar, but look at the numbers the guy I got it from put down with it in his cars.
Read through this page http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/bol...manifold-where-can-i-get-gasket-make-one.html where member Forces32Psi post#20 talks about the guy, Jerry "lancerman", hes the DSM guru here in the TampaBay area, but he was able to put them to some good use. Right above that post is a wiseman stating people have made 500WHP on the stock manifold. Im not on here stating Im gonna get mad power out of the cyclone, its just like a stock manifold, it just diverts the air differently for more torque, and I can use that on the street with an AWD.

Go through this thread.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/bolt-tech/302154-cyclone-manifold-porting-ported.html
It's the only reason I researched about the Cyclone and have thought about buying one to put on my car. Using DSMLink's nitrous control and an FPS solenoid to control the butterfly valves and extensive porting for more flow.

 

[T_K]

thats cool, I'd like to hear from some of the people who run it successfully on the performance of it.

I've been running it like that for maybe two years now. I never really tested it (like, drive with the whole thing disabled and then enabled and log some difference), however my butt dyno thinks it works as advertised.

 

[dsmfa9nutter]

I believe its something like this, am I correct?

Yes, but instead of being on the exhaust (like the one in the picture), it's in the intake manifold.

 

[94awdcoupe]

Just saw this thread and have some valuable comments. I have been running the cyclone intakes with T25 mod for 3-4 years. The picture in post 1 looks like my work. I run this setup on both 20g and 35r cars. The cyclone is an amazing piece of hardware. It works virtually the same as Mivec does on the evo 9. You dont hear too many people wanting to get rid of the Mivec on evo forums? Of course not. Because it works fantastic as does the dual runner manifold. The cyclone makes very noticeable gains in both torque and turbo spool. It is not the restriction people think it is. My 35r made over 600whp and pulls hard to 8000rpm on 2.3 engine. A 50 trim or 35r turbo will spool 4-500 rpm faster on the cyclone. that is nothing to sneeze at. I cant get around not using them when I put a car together. there is nothing that works quite so well for so little money and effort.

I am not sure if I was the first to do the T25 actuator mod but I find it the most practical reliable method of using the manifold with a few minor drawbacks. The t25 actuator starts to open the butterflies at 14psi. They will not be fully open till 24psi. This is because as the actuator compresses the spring inside compresses as well and it takes more boost to over come the shorter and shorter spring. I use the original hole on the butterfly arm. You might be able to drill a hole inside of that to make them fully open sooner. as the travel for actuator would be less. The crossover point for the manifold is 4100 rpm when controlled by the ecu. This means that above 4100 the manifold makes more power with all runners open. below that rpm the manifold makes more power with all runners closed. But what about when runners are half open? doesnt matter because the factory controlled method snaps them open at 4100. The t25 method progressively opens the flys. I have not dynoed to try and show what happens when they are half open. To determine where ideal open point is you simply dyno with runners closed then dyno with them open. Then just use the point were the graphs cross as you ideal open point. If you added a third pull with runners half open you might find the graph to be higher at the cross point. not sure.

So lets just say the ideal open point is 4100rpm. So from that ideal turbo needs to see 24psi at or below 4100 rpm. If turbo sees less than 24psi after 4100 rpm the performance will suffer as the runners will not be fully open. This is an important point as a 16g will typically not hold 24psi at redline. a 20g barely does. larger turbos clearly have no problem. But clearly if you plan to run less than 24psi this method is not for you.

If your turbo is seeing 24psi before 4100 rpm that is great. the performance of all 8 runners is at least as good as stock manifold so no performance is lost if you see 24psi at 3800rpm. You would still be getting the faster spool and low end torque increases.

My 35r turbo setup sees 25psi very near 4100 rpm. full 35psi at 4700 makes 600whp at 5500rpm. The manifold just plain works in the setup. It has devastating quick hard hitting power band in every gear.

Both my cars use the 7 bolt head. epoxy is used to fill runner transition.

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[94awdcoupe]

There was a comment in here that FWD cars dont need this. My response to that is a few years ago I received a car that was initially built at another shop. 97 GST with magnus built 2.0 head block, and SMIM. running AEM and gt30 turbo. The car just had lackluster performance on pump gas 25psi. I asked the owner if he would allow me to remove the magnus SMIM and install the cyclone. The results were amazing. It spooled the turbo 1000rpm faster on this car and just plain made the car fun to drive. Night and day difference. No other way to describe it. While I dont recommend fats spooling 2.3 torque monsters on a FWD anything that makes the power hit sooner will move a traction limited FWD better. late hitting power bands annihilate the tires when the power hits. broad power bands are much more effective on FWD. you may have to peddle the throttle but at least you are getting max power the tires will allow for much longer than just a brief top end hit.

 

[reno23]

This is all new to me. Really interesting manifold thats been around for years and is pretty cheap using the actuator. So why don't more dsm'ers run this Cyclone setup? Are they hard to come by?