1G Fuel Pump Issues

[bluelaser92]

I'm pretty sure my fuel pump went out the other day. The car will start right up, but only idles for about 1 to 2 seconds before dying out. It does this repeatedly, no matter how much time I leave in between startups. The car had been acting up recently, and running really poorly, puttering and missing and whatnot. It would idle at 500rpm and keep jumping to about 700rpm, all the while sounding like SH1T. Anyway, I figure it had to be either the fuel pump/filter or a fuel pump relay...

So here's what I need to know: First of all, I want to check the relay first since it would be a cheaper fix if that takes care of things... but where are the relays for the fuel systems? Also, AutoZone wants $150 for a replacement pump, but is it worth it? Can't I just upgrade to a performance pump for less money? I've also heard that fuel pumps are a beyotch to replace because of how difficult it can be to remove the original... anyone know for sure what sizes the wrenches are that I will need? (14mm and 20mm flare wrenches?) Any help is greatly appreciated... Thanks.

 

[GSGoinFast]

I'm pretty sure my fuel pump went out the other day. The car will start right up, but only idles for about 1 to 2 seconds before dying out. It does this repeatedly, no matter how much time I leave in between startups. The car had been acting up recently, and running really poorly, puttering and missing and whatnot. It would idle at 500rpm and keep jumping to about 700rpm, all the while sounding like SH1T. Anyway, I figure it had to be either the fuel pump/filter or a fuel pump relay...

So here's what I need to know: First of all, I want to check the relay first since it would be a cheaper fix if that takes care of things... but where are the relays for the fuel systems? Also, AutoZone wants $150 for a replacement pump, but is it worth it? Can't I just upgrade to a performance pump for less money? I've also heard that fuel pumps are a beyotch to replace because of how difficult it can be to remove the original... anyone know for sure what sizes the wrenches are that I will need? (14mm and 20mm flare wrenches?) Any help is greatly appreciated... Thanks.

$150 for a stock replacement?!?!?! ... hold on... ... ok. You can get a walbro 255 for $104. http://www.nolimitmotorsport.com/prod/GSS341-400-857 check there. i dunno if 255 is overkill, but i cant imagine it hurting could it?

 

[21stEagle]

First man, buy a manual book for your car, than you will know where and what to do.
About relay, maybe it is a problem, but when my relay was bad my car couldnot start, and if it would start it would shut down in a couple of minutes.
About fuel pump, check the fuel pressure first.

 

[4G63luvr]

just a tip, before you go replacing stuff in the fuel system, pop off the hose that connects to the fuel rail from the gas tank after turning it over for awhile, and make sure an assload of gas comes out. If gas does come out, it's not your fuel system at all.
chris

 

[bluelaser92]

I thought of getting a walbro 195 or a 255 but like you said, I'm not sure if that could hurt anything or not? And yea, both NAPA and AutoZone said $159 for the stock replacement pump, thats the 1.5" one... AutoZone said they have a 2" pump for $104 but that didn't sound right to me...?

 

[bluelaser92]

Please help me out here guys, I really need to get my car running before I head back to school... I mean who else is gonna make pizza runs? Haha but seriously, is a 255 overkill, can it do any damage? And the pump is under the spare tire right?

I do have one of those DSM manuals on CD (from eBay) but I can't find it at the moment...)

 

[21stEagle]

Dont panic man.
Where where, I think....
If you are realy in a big hurry, just jack up the back of your car and look under, look where you fuel lines come, look ander the back sit. You will see there something.
And, I changed my fuel pump to a factory one, and it gives me enough psi. You dont need a big powerfull fuel pump for N/T unless you have a LOT of mooooods, specialy fuel system modes. But if it is cheaper,that is a different question.

 

[Thunderskull]

Please help me out here guys, I really need to get my car running before I head back to school... I mean who else is gonna make pizza runs? Haha but seriously, is a 255 overkill, can it do any damage? And the pump is under the spare tire right?

I do have one of those DSM manuals on CD (from eBay) but I can't find it at the moment...)

Did you follow 4g63luvr's suggestion and check for fuel flow? Check your timing belt while you're at it.

 

[bluelaser92]

I'm in the process of checking things out... The problem is that the car broke down 35 mins from my house, so when I'm here typing I can't just go out into the driveway and check the car. I'm just trying to get some ideas so that when I can get a ride back in to my car I can take care of everything in one trip. I didn't wanna have to drop for towing if I could get it running where its at.

BTW, I know that I most definitely don't need a 255lph or even 195lph pump. What I want to know is... can it do any damage? Does it hurt to have a bigger pump if it's not something that I need?

 

[Thunderskull]

With either of those, you run the risk of overflowing the stock fuel pressure regulator and running too rich. You could safely put a fuel pump from a turbocharged vehicle in there.

 

[bluelaser92]

I did find a 2" stock replacement pump at AutoZone for $104, and actually that one is cheaper than the 1.5" one ($160) but I guess the 2" one would work just as well...

Can anyone help me out with where the relays are for the fuel system?

 

[bluelaser92]

Okay the problem is definitely not the fuel pump. When individually hooked up to a bttery, the pump works fine and the car will run forever. Therefore, logic tells me that something in the car (ECU?) is simply not telling the fuel pump to work...

At first I thought that it was a fuel pump relay, but it seems after looking through some DSM manuals that there is no relay for the fuel system. Is this the case? Is the pump controlled through the ECU? I'm kinda stuck right now...

 

[steve]

Based on the description of the problems you were having before and what you posted in your other thread, it sure sounds like your ECU caps took out the ECU. First the caps stop filtering the power as designed causing the car to run like crap then elecrolyte leaks out and eats away at the copper traces and solder joints until one or more circuits fail and the car stops running. As long as nothing burned up they are usually fixable.

Steve

 

[bluelaser92]

Thanks Steve... sounds like this could get a little expensive? Hopefully I won't have to replace the whole ECU... but if I do, that's probably not something that I'd wanna get into. Or is it less of a job than it sounds? And does anybody know what I'm lookin at price-wise for an ECU fix or for a new ECU? I'm under the impression that they cost like $400...

 

[steve]

Usually people wind up changing the ECU as a unit because they don't have any other options. From the dealership your talking huge bucks, Smaller shops might find a used or refurbished ECU for $250-300. You might find a used ECU on eBay for $100-200 but it will need new caps or your just going to have the same problems down the road. Fixing one depends on how bad the damage is. I won't repair one that it would be cheaper to replace and put fresh capacitors.

Steve

 

[steve]

, it never dawned on me that you had a 1.8L NA.

Here's what the damage looks like on your ECU. I haven't cleaned the corrosion yet to see how badly damaged the traces are.

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Update: The traces under the metal heatsync (removed in the picture) to pins 109 (fuel pump sense (on 1.8L)), 56 (fuel pump enable) and 64 (check engine light) were destroyed by acid etching from the leaking caps. That explains your fuel pump problems. Almost all the power traces under the caps were gone. The SMD filter cap (just above the big black diode) and surrounding traces were goners.
The fiberglass had soaked up the acid and took forever to neutralize. It seems to work like a champ now.

Steve

 

[Robernut]

Usually people wind up changing the ECU as a unit because they don't have any other options. From the dealership your talking huge bucks, Smaller shops might find a used or refurbished ECU for $250-300. You might find a used ECU on eBay for $100-200 but it will need new caps or your just going to have the same problems down the road. Fixing one depends on how bad the damage is. I won't repair one that it would be cheaper to replace and put fresh capacitors.

Steve

I got one from a junkyard and its doing fine

 

[steve]

I got one from a junkyard and its doing fine

That's great!

I'm not sure I get the point of reviving a 18 year old thread for that but I hope you read the whole thing and understand that no matter where you get a 1G ECU from you need to make sure the original capacitors get replaced before they kill it.

That fact hasn't changed in the passing years.