2G Fp 68hta or mhi evo 3 16g rebuilt

[bmw335ikt]

I'm about to pull the trigger just want to see what's the better option
Brand new fp 68hta
Or
Mhi evo 3 16g rebuilt

Thanks

 

[EG Hatch]

The evo 3 16g flows about 42-44 lb/min while the 68hta flows 52 lb/min. This means that the 68hta will be able to produce around 100whp more. The limits are about 400whp and over 500whp for the 16g and 68hta respectively. The 16g will spool faster, but I can't say for sure since I haven't been in a 68hta car.

If it were me I would go with the 68hta hands down since its normally a 1000$ turbo, and its going to be able to support power that the 16g simply cannot.

Plus it's going to look like a 16g so when you pop your hood you'll have a surprise for people once you start driving.

 

[gofer]

HTA68, not even close...

I've owned every MHI 16g variant (small, big, and Evo III) then upgraded to the HTA68 back in 2010 and never looked back. The HTA68 is what you're expecting a 16g to do, you can run pump gas and be mid 300whp with the right supporting mods or put it over 450whp running it to the edge. The Evo III 16g your going to be mid 200whp and running to it's limit you'll be lucky to see mid 300's.

HTA68 or bust.

 

[JusMX141]

Think of the 68HTA as a billet 18G because that's the closest MHI wheel by the specs.

It ultimately depends on your goals for the car. If you're going to drive around on the stock fuel system at 12psi, then the 16G is a better option. If you already have a tuning platform and bigger injectors, go for the 68HTA. I wouldn't even attempt to run the 68HTA on the stock fuel system using the 18psi actuator it comes with.

 

[Nate355RS]

HTA68, not even close...

I've owned every MHI 16g variant (small, big, and Evo III) then upgraded to the HTA68 back in 2010 and never looked back. The HTA68 is what you're expecting a 16g to do, you can run pump gas and be mid 300whp with the right supporting mods or put it over 450whp running it to the edge. The Evo III 16g your going to be mid 200whp and running to it's limit you'll be lucky to see mid 300's.

HTA68 or bust.

You really think he'll be in the mid 200whp range on a MHI 16g and supporting mods? I've been able to get over 300 easily on 93 with mine. Weird.

 

[bmw335ikt]

Yea I was looking at the fp but a buddy told me at the evo 3 is 7cm housing and would match with the manifold while the fp is a 8cm. Idk what kind of difference that makes

 

[gofer]

You really think he'll be in the mid 200whp range on a MHI 16g and supporting mods? I've been able to get over 300 easily on 93 with mine. Weird.

Yes I do, unfortunately. I had every bolt-on/supporting mod running my 16g on 91oct (not everyone has access to 93oct) and this is the best I could do. Stock 7-bolt s16g Dyno

It was on a s16g but as I mentioned, I ran every variant (big and Evo III) on the same setup and didn't see a change in airflow numbers or trap speeds at the track. I literally popped and swapped the CHRA's/compressor housings from each 16g into the 7cm turbine housing I left bolted up making no other changes and saw no gains. I was limited to ~21psi and very little (8* peak) timing advance because of 91 but I would expect similar results for most 16g setups running the same fuel.



Here's a my dyno printout after the HTA68 swap.

The RED line is 91oct and 21psi (peak timing was 8*)...
The BLUE line is E85 and 28psi (peak timing was 17*)...

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Just swapping to the HTA68 and retuning the car on 91oct the car went from 260awhp to 350awhp, keeping AFR's/timing/boost the same. You can see what a increase in boost/timing advance does running E85 with at HTA68 setup and this is on the 7cm housing. Currently I'm on a 8cm BEP hotside and accurately logging over 52lbs/m on the same turbo so my butt dyno's telling me I'm ~450awhp now.


HTA68 all day for that price FP's selling them for. I wasn't aware that FP was selling these with their 18psi actuator but, if this is the case, you can pickup a used td05 12psi wga (stock on 14b/16g) for <$30 and it will bolt right on until you can get the proper supporting fuel/tuning modifications to run more boost.

Another thing to consider, if you've got $600 burning a hole in your pocket you can spend your money better elsewhere and pickup ECMLink. Which is actually the best option from the two choices you posted, you won't be able to really benefit from either turbo install at the point I'm guessing you're at in your build @bmw335ikt. Maybe look at getting ECMLink first?

 

[bmw335ikt]

I was to order the fp 68hta should I get the internal wastegate or do the external off the o2

Thanks

 

[gofer]

External off the o2 if you can afford it since you can't max out with that turbo internally gated. Don't forget you'll need a externally gated o2 housing and external wastegate actuator, i.e., another $600 dollars.

PR Tial EWG + O2 Housing (atmosphere)
PR Tial EWG + O2 Housing (recirc)
​

If you plan on running boost into the low 20's (nothing more) internally gated is probably fine, assuming you can control boost (don't see boost creep).

 

[bmw335ikt]

Ok if I go with the external which is better a recirc or to atmosphere. Idk if blow off valves matter but I'm recirc. I will have all supporting mods such as the ecmlink

Thanks

 

[crash]

You should not vent to atmosphere on a mas pre turbo. You can do it....but the car will hate you for it. There should be a thread on this somewhere here. Someone, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

On the related topic, I just ordered the 68hta internally gated. It's a killer deal from what I can tell. When I called fp I was told they'd sold 100+ last month so I'm not the only one jumping on the sale.

Edit....just realized you're probably asking about the o2 housing. There's probably a thread on that on here to. One of the more experienced guys can point you in the right direction there.

 

[bmw335ikt]

Let me ask you, if I get it internal wastegate is there a way to convert it to external later. Thanks and what does mas pre turbo mean.

 

[crash]

Air flow sensor pre turbo...aka, stock...ish

I believe you can weld you waste gate flapper shut if you want to go external later.

 

[bmw335ikt]

I was looking at the punishment racing wastegate with recirc this one
http://www.punishment-racing.com/pu...culated-o2-housing-package-for-eclipse-talon/

Would this bolt straight on to my apexi downpipe with no modification Thanks

 

[Dan90tsi]

Just to give some input. I'm on a fp68hta with the 8cm hotside and on 94Oct, 20psi and 13* timing up top I'm at 320whp. Ecmlink shows 38-39lbs a minute and around 390hp. Not sure how accurate that is but the 320whp was off the dyno. I'm internal gated as well and lose almost 2psi at 7100rpms. I'm gonna go water/meth to turn this turbo up as close to the 30psi range and see how that feels

 

[crash]

Not sure on your downpipe question. I imagine if it is a 2.5 or 3 in then yes?

Here's the thread that got me looking at the 68hta. Lots of good info in here and covers pretty much the same 16g vs 68hta question.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/dsm-68htas-for-579.497886/

 

[2gmitsueclipse]

If you will be running anything under 20psi, a recirculating o2 housing would be best. You and everyone around would tire of it quickly.
If you prefer to just make bunch of noise, go for the open dump.

It is easier to put the OE heat shielding on when using a ported OE housing though.

 

[bmw335ikt]

last question before i purchase. would you do the 16g compressor housing or 84 mm flow advancement

 

[Type1DSMr]

What's your supporting mods for either turbo? What's your power goals, etc?
I'm currently running a rebuilt Evo 3 16g from Jusmx141 on e85, and I love the quick spool and power. I also have a fp 68hta but don't have it installed, and don't know if or when I will. Having too much fun with 16g. Keep in mind for me I use it as dd street car not a race/drag car.

 

[bmw335ikt]

can you not use the fp 68hta for the street

 

[crash]

I went with the 16g housing as I am good with the smaller inlet and didn't feel it warranted the extra buck fifty.

 

[Type1DSMr]

can you not use the fp 68hta for the street

No you can just spools a little slower than the 16g, but has more top end power.

I hold 22psi to redline on my billet 16g on e85 but the fp 68 hta can hold more.

 

[Dan90tsi]

I'm seeing 20psi at 4200rpm

 

[Slavonic]

8cm BEP

What is the housing? Is it for holset?

 

[eclipse012]

It kind of sounds like you have a bit more of reading and research to do on what is right for you and your setup. What's your goals? I can try and help steer you in a little bit of a direction that could help you. You should ask yourself:

- What is my goal HP I would like to achieve that I can afford and be satisfied with? (Be realistic, no plan and winging it will cost you more in the long run in money and time)

- Do you plan on running regular pump gas, or do you have the want to run strictly E85? Also is E85 readily available where you live? (Remember E85 means you can run a little higher boost with both turbo's which means more power. But be aware of the drawbacks of running E85. A simple search will give you a heads up of some issues that other dsmer's have ran into and what would be good sized injectors etc. for your goal.

- How do you feel about the boost your car currently has? Consider the evo 3 will have slight more lag time (delay) than what your turbo is and the 68hta will have a for sure noticeable difference in lag time. The evo 3 you will get a longer power band out of if your leaving your red line alone. But the 68hta will be more powerful and have better top end. Both are street able, you just have weigh out your odds. What do you think you'd be satisfied with?

- Consider the quality of both turbo's (reliability) The 68hta is brand new from a very reputable source and would be a good choice. The evo3 16g what's the rebuild going to be like? Do you know who's doing it, and are you sure it will be a proper rebuild that would be worth the money? Evo 3 16g's have been a great turbo that have been very popular in the dsm community for years. But again be sure its in good condition.

All in all, if you can get a really good deal on the 16g evo3 and it is genuine and will be rebuilt correctly then go that route if it saves you some coin for now. The 68hta is a great turbo and can be had at a great deal right now, but ask yourself if you really need it. Boost is addicting and if you can afford to do it, then get what parts you can for your build that leaves you the room to grow in the future. (overkill it a bit with injector size, maybe a little bigger fmic than what you had in mind, external waste gate etc). These are all things you have to consider or you will have a issue with spending more than what you may have thought you were going to and are willing to. It can wear some of the novelty off a person pretty quick and that's not good. I suggest getting a idea put together what you want, figure out what your cash limit is and then start putting a build list together and see if you can make it work as your best bet and go from there.