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Found N/T Pistons in my 2g GSX?!?!

Posted by TurkF26, Apr 6, 2010

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  1. TurkF26

    TurkF26 Supporting VIP

    334
    4
    Joined Sep 6, 2003
    vacaville, California
    So a couple years ago i bought my 97 GSX from a craiglist guy who said the timing belt broke while he was driving on the freeway. Long story short, i got the car for dirt cheap knowing the motor was trash. I found another "rebuilt" longblock from a mechanical shop in the bay area. I pulled the trashed motor and installed the "rebuilt" 7 bolt.

    Not long after installing it and getting the car running, I notice and hear 2 not normal things. The first is a very random, loud clack coming from the drivers side of the motor. I spent weeks trying to narrow down the sound but could never pin point the noise. The noise was not constant but random and more persistant while under boost (14lbs). The second issue was that there was oil getting onto my new kevlar timing belt! I had checked and replaced all needed gaskets and seals on the motor before installing it. The oil seemd to be seeping from between the oil pump case and the block. So i stripped down the timing side, got a new oil pump casing and gasket, reinstalled everything and yet again, oil started getting on the belt.

    I started feeling very uncomfortable about the motor. I did a compresson test and got 195-205 across the board! I knew that was too high. Well come to find out, I pull the head and see what is pictured below! I am pretty sure i have my facts right but wanted to make sure 100% i was correct. I amlost have the block and trans out so i will be able to flip the motor over and check the rods.

    Does it look like this "mechanic" put N/T 1g pistons into a 2g block? I am afraid to pull the rods to see what is attached there. I am assuming the "clack" i was hearing was from the bottom end? He said he bought all new 2g piston rings, bearings, etc... Is it even possible to put 2g turbo rings on N/T pistons?

    Any and all help will be greatly appreciated, sorry for the long story.

    UPDATE: I pulled the block out of the car and took it apart. I only drove the car for maybe 5 miles and let it idle for a combined time of 30 minutes. Does this bearing wear look normal for that short amount of time? Also 3 of the rods have a "V" imprinted in them and 1 has a "W". They all look the same but also say GS on them as well. What kind of frankenstein motor does this look to be? Also there does not seem to be a VIN imprint on it? Im pretty sure its suppose to be on the trans side above the bell housing? I am not familiar with interal DSM markings so any help would be greatly appreciated!
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Apr 8, 2010
  2. DashLaflash

    DashLaflash Proven Member

    312
    7
    Joined Jul 4, 2007
    Millbury, Massachusetts
    Ya the turbo pistons have 63dT on them. They must have gotten some 1g non turbo 7bolt pistons by mistake. You sound like your getting a ton of knock from boosting with these pistons as well which isn't good for your engine and could have destroyed it. I say take it back to the shop and say what the hell did you sell me. If they told you it had turbo pistons then I see them as being at fault. Hopefully they can work with you on replacing the pistons.
     

    647  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    · 2G DSM
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  3. 805DSM

    805DSM Proven Member

    394
    2
    Joined Jun 10, 2005
    Oxnard Shores, California
    If they were n/t pistons they had to be off of a 1g n/t 4g63.. I belive the rods would be the same , correct me if I'm wrong tho..
     
  4. hubz91talontsi

    hubz91talontsi Proven Member

    1,121
    3
    Joined Jul 30, 2007
    bentleyville, Pennsylvania
    wrist pins would be different..
     

    802  0

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    · 1G DSM
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  5. DashLaflash

    DashLaflash Proven Member

    312
    7
    Joined Jul 4, 2007
    Millbury, Massachusetts
    The n/t rods and crank are the same as the turbo 7 bolt but the pistons are obviously different. All he has to do is swap the pistons for turbo ones. Assuming the rest of his engine is still in ok shape that is.
     

    647  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    · 2G DSM
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  6. TurkF26

    TurkF26 Supporting VIP

    334
    4
    Joined Sep 6, 2003
    vacaville, California
    I will have to get my digital camera and take a picture of the cross hatches on the cylinder walls. I will also post pics of the bearings, crank, journals, rods, etc... tomorrow when i get the motor all the way out. To me, for all the 4g63 motors i have seen, the "cuts" into the cylinder walls seems to be pretty deep. Dont NT pistons use different rings than turbo pistons? I bought the motor off CL and he had reciepts for the gaskets, water pump, and the receipt said he bought turbo piston rings. Can you even put turbo rings on a non turbo piston?

    All in all im pretty sure the block is as good as a boat anchor. I am going to start from scratch and most likely do a 6 bolt swap with a 2g head and speed density since i have V3 now... :thumb:
     
  7. beating4g63s

    beating4g63s Proven Member

    527
    1
    Joined Oct 31, 2004
    port arthur, Texas
    pull the oil pan and check and see if you have oil squirter's you might just have a fully 1g n/t 7 bolt motor.

    if you do have them you have a turbo block with n/t pistons
    if you don't have them it's n/t all the way.
     
  8. RedTurboEclipse

    RedTurboEclipse Proven Member

    5,616
    40
    Joined Jul 29, 2002
    Bay Area, California
    Just curious for reference for fellow Bay Area guys, what is the name of the shop and where did you buy it from.
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  9. TurkF26

    TurkF26 Supporting VIP

    334
    4
    Joined Sep 6, 2003
    vacaville, California
    I dont want to bust the shop / person online as it was their "engine rebuilder" who rebuilt the motor and sold it to me personally. I found some very interesting things / questions about the internals / block that i will be posting with pictures in a bit!
     
  10. knochgoon24

    knochgoon24 DSM Wiseman

    6,139
    74
    Joined Jan 29, 2008
    Troy, Michigan
    That looks like it is a complete 1g 7-bolt N/T block.
     

    2K  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1991 Eagle Talon N/T
    manual · 1G DSM

    2K  0

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    automatic · 2G DSM

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    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    13.869 @ 95.090 · 2G DSM
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  11. DashLaflash

    DashLaflash Proven Member

    312
    7
    Joined Jul 4, 2007
    Millbury, Massachusetts
    Those rods look like your standard 7 bolt rods. The oil squirters on a 7 bolt are pressed in underneath the bearings and point up towards the underside of the pistons. With the pistons removed you can see them looking down through the tops of the cylinder walls. They are cone shaped and pretty small. If you have oil squirters then you have a turbo 7 bolt block with n/t pistons. If you don't have squirters then you have a 1g n/t block which is unlikely because you would have had to use the 1g CAS to install it and is similar to a 6 bolt install and you made no mention of this. Lastly the VIN on the block is up behind where the turbo is and towards the right of the block.
     

    647  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    · 2G DSM
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    TurkF26 likes this.
  12. dsm-onster

    dsm-onster DSM Wiseman

    8,594
    96
    Joined Jul 11, 2004
    Bloxom, Virginia
    Check to see if your ringlands are broken. Looks like more than a ring there between the block and piston in that first pic. And the n/t pistons are famous for breaking those with the slightest of detonation even at a stock turbo power level.
     

    3K  0

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 1G DSM
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  13. CFeclipse

    CFeclipse Proven Member

    268
    1
    Joined Jul 10, 2007
    San Diego, California
    you just been BURNNNNNN LOL
     

    584  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    · 2G DSM
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  14. TurkF26

    TurkF26 Supporting VIP

    334
    4
    Joined Sep 6, 2003
    vacaville, California
    I have attached pictures of the pistons. These are the only pics i have right now of them. There are no oil squirters in this motor at all and everything installed is off a 2g motor. If this is really a 1g 7 bolt motor, would that explain the oil leaking onto the timing belt from around the oil pump caseing (housing)? I was under the impression it was a 2g motor so of course all the timing components, caseing, pump, etc... are all 2g. The 2g water pump bolts up fine as well as the tensioner, tensioner pulley, etc...

    I thought the vin was engraved behind the trans / starter plate? The item you are talking about is the plate where the 4G63 is engraved but no VIN number there. Also are the 7 bolt squirters in the cradle that holds down the crank or are they engraved into the block?
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Apr 9, 2010
  15. DashLaflash

    DashLaflash Proven Member

    312
    7
    Joined Jul 4, 2007
    Millbury, Massachusetts
    No the squirters are in the block itself not on the cradle. They are pressed in underneath the crank bearings. You can just knock them out with a hammer though. I wish I had pictures. Just take off the bearing that's resting on the block itself and you should see where they are or should be. The place I told you about that has the 4g63 stamped into it is the block serial number. Idk where the VIN is some reason I thought that was what you were looking for. Did you bolt up the 2g crank angle sensor to this block? I had read that installing a 1g 7 bolt requires the 1g CAS for it to work because the 1gs have just the CAS on the head. The cam angle sensor and crank angle sensor are combined on the 1g and not separate like on the 2g.
     

    647  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    · 2G DSM
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  16. DearestNameless

    DearestNameless Proven Member

    309
    1
    Joined Jan 16, 2010
    Linton, Indiana
    Nice shoes. I'm so jealous. Hope you get this frankenblock figured out. IMO I would take it back and drop it on his foot.
     
  17. XiKeiyaZI

    XiKeiyaZI Proven Member

    6,969
    41
    Joined Dec 28, 2008
    Dyersburg, Tennessee
    How sexy.. a badly turbo'd N/T Engine!

    Have you taken this thin back and slammed it into his skull yet?
     

    908  0

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 2G DSM
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