dsm vs rx7

[mirkoelek]

if one of you would have option to choose between eclipse gsx 98 or one of the 93-93 turbo rx7 , which one would you get .
i know you all are crazy about dsm, just keep it real.

 

[Deathmug]

GSX all the way.
I'm not a fan of mazda. Thoes cars are a little bit on the limp-wristed side if you know what i'm sayin.

 

[destruckeclipse]

I dont like the styling of the rx-7, and definatley love awd.

 

[TSIMonsteR]

GSX!!! AWD is sweet!! In addition to that, you could get a 99 AWD DSM alot cheaper then most FD's which are up to 6-7 years older! Dsm's and Rx7's are comparable in reliability, but Rx7's are more maintanence heavy. Just do lots of research.

 

[mirkoelek]

rx7 is light car, and its easier to make it fast. Not Necessarily cheaper

 

[Red97Eclipseboy]

RX-7 all the way. You don't need AWD. RWD is the best.

 

[Sk8er07999]

RX7's or so bad ass. I would love to have one.

 

[GVR4592]

It depends on what your goals are. The RX7 in this picture was purchased for $5000 and has about $10,000 in performance modifications and runs mid 11 second times. The dsm in this picture at the time had about $5000 in performance modifications, and would take the rx7 in the 1/4. Put them on a road course and the RX7 would take the dsm. The RX7 was easier to work on, and it had a pretty good effect on the ladies. It was surprisingly comfortable also. So I think I would buy both.

 

[GVR4592]

Oh yeah I forgot to mention at the time that picture was taken neither cars were running The FD had blown an apex seal just minutes before and the talon had a connecting rod failure a week earlier. Gotta love these turbo cars.

 

[mirkoelek]

what car is more reliable

 

[GVR4592]

It depends on the person that owns the car and their maintenance habits. Both need constant preventative maintenance. Oil and coolant needs to be checked daily, regular fluid changes, proper tuning, etc. If you are buying a dsm expect to change the timing belt and all related components, along with the water pump(since it's right there), spark plug wires, and all other regular maintenance items that previous owners never check. With the RX7 buy the largest aluminum radiator and the highest flowing electric fans you can fit under the hood and get rid of the crappy twin turbo setup ( which is the cause of 75% of the cooling issues). I'm sure I left some things out but thats basically it. Neither car is more reliable than the other. They both have reliability issues when put in the hands of the wrong person.

 

[mirkoelek]

I have gsx fully moded for evo16g(dsmlinks and etc.), but i would like to try something new. Or maybe i should stick with dsm and get bigger turbo. What i've heard, rx7 is very expencive to maintain, is that true. DSM has a lot of moding options what about rx7......

 

[dhonda]

My boss' rx-7 got side ways on me and I crashed it. I love the look of the rx-7 , but they are too light in my opinion. Local mechanics don't like the rotory engine for maintenance.

 

[GVR4592]

It is no more expensive to maintain than any other car. They aren't too light you just have to know what you are doing behind the wheel. They do tend to get sideways, but there is a lot of room under there for bigger tires. The FD in that picture was pretty light, I don't recall exactly what it weighed but it was quite a bit lighter than stock, and it had 295mm wide tires on it. It would still get sideways in any gear except for 5th if you tried hard enough. Upgrades are just as plentiful as dsm upgrades.

I think that with the FD you would want to get some sort of standalone before you start messing with power upgrades. Rotaries respond to upgrades differently than 4 stroke piston engines do, and they require something more than an safc. The car in the picture had an APEXi Power FC that was purchased for about $600. It's plug and play and very easy to use.

 

[mirkoelek]

It is no more expensive to maintain than any other car. They aren't too light you just have to know what you are doing behind the wheel. They do tend to get sideways, but there is a lot of room under there for bigger tires. The FD in that picture was pretty light, I don't recall exactly what it weighed but it was quite a bit lighter than stock, and it had 295mm wide tires on it. It would still get sideways in any gear except for 5th if you tried hard enough. Upgrades are just as plentiful as dsm upgrades.

I think that with the FD you would want to get some sort of standalone before you start messing with power upgrades. Rotaries respond to upgrades differently than 4 stroke piston engines do, and they require something more than an safc. The car in the picture had an APEXi Power FC that was purchased for about $600. It's plug and play and very easy to use.

good info, thanks man. What about engine or transmission, how many hp can stock handle.

 

[GVR4592]

Stock engine with bolt ons and fuel system upgrades you could see 400whp. With an upgraded engine it's pretty much dependent on the builder. Some will tell you to go with expensive ceramic apex seals, others will tell you to keep stock apex seals. I prefer 3mm stock apex seals that are properly clearanced. A ceramic seal will handle more detonation before it lets go, but when it does it will take the whole engine out with it. Stock seals normally don't do that.

If you do end up getting an RX7 and you want a built engine, these are the guys to go to. http://www.pineappleracing.com/ They can do amazing things with a rotary engine and they have a very good reputation. Porting is a big mystery to some people but it's basically the equivalent of upgrading cams in a piston engine. Stay away from anything more than a street port for a turbocharged application. Anything more than that is probably to aggresive and will shift your powerband too high for the street. I know a guy with a bridgeported engine in his fd and he starts making power at about 6000 rpms.

 

[danielbui]

It depends on the person that owns the car and their maintenance habits. Both need constant preventative maintenance. Oil and coolant needs to be checked daily, regular fluid changes, proper tuning, etc. If you are buying a dsm expect to change the timing belt and all related components, along with the water pump(since it's right there), spark plug wires, and all other regular maintenance items that previous owners never check. With the RX7 buy the largest aluminum radiator and the highest flowing electric fans you can fit under the hood and get rid of the crappy twin turbo setup ( which is the cause of 75% of the cooling issues). I'm sure I left some things out but thats basically it. Neither car is more reliable than the other. They both have reliability issues when put in the hands of the wrong person.

its also interesting that the RADIATOR SIZE is the same as some of our intercoolers, 3 inch thick and also ressembles an intercooler aswell. CRAZY

 

[danielbui]

OK so i am exaggerating but the FD radiator size can get pretty stout

 

[Kapok6]

I love my DSM, fun in the snow, but the RX-7 is wassup. If I had an opportunity to get one, I would, but that's b/c I am a huge fan of drifting and that car is a perfect drift machine.

 

[badbu68]

OR, you could drop a sbc (ls1) into the fd and never worry about silly rotary issues again and go low 12s high 11s mostly stock.

 

[yangtech]

i like dsm, but the inside of the rx7 is so i would go with the RX7

 

[GPTourer]

The FD is a beautiful car, but I would never have one, unless I was rich and was just filling out my GT4 Garage fantasies. People dog DSM's and Mitsubishi all the time for poor reliability, but I think FD's are the worst. Every for sale ad for them I see, even if their mileage is in the 5 digits almost always say "New Engine." Check your local classifieds, autotrader, ebaymotors and you will see what I mean.

 

[Camaro350]

OR, you could drop a sbc (ls1) into the fd and never worry about silly rotary issues again and go low 12s high 11s mostly stock.

Local guy here did that. Cammed LS1 with 125 shot of nitrous and a t56. Its crazy fast.

 

[99gst_racer]

OK so i am exaggerating but the FD radiator size can get pretty stout

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Just a few things to point out.....

That picture is mirrored - it show everything on the opposite side of what it should be.

That is not the stock radiator; the stock radiator is not nearly that thick. I recently installed a Fluidyne in a 93 Rex and it wasnt even that thick. And that's not even where the radiator is normally mounted either. The stock IC usually sits there and the radiator sits below that.

There is a reason that they used such a thick radiator. Many RX7 owners dont use FMIC's because it can block the airflow path and cause cooling issues. And cooling is one of the most important factors in the longevity of the Mazda turbo rotary. So it looks like the owner of that car installed a FMIC and then moved the radiator up into the old stock IC's place. After that, I'm sure he had major cooling issues due to much less airflow to the radiator's core, so they decided to go with a thicker core.

 

[99gst_racer]

Jumping aboard........

I prefer 3mm stock apex seals that are properly clearanced.

For reliability purposes, I too perfer the 3mm seals.

If you do end up getting an RX7 and you want a built engine, these are the guys to go to. http://www.pineappleracing.com/ They can do amazing things with a rotary engine and they have a very good reputation.

I've always got good information from the guys over at Pettit Racing.

Porting is a big mystery to some people but it's basically the equivalent of upgrading cams in a piston engine. Stay away from anything more than a street port for a turbocharged application. Anything more than that is probably to aggresive and will shift your powerband too high for the street. I know a guy with a bridgeported engine in his fd and he starts making power at about 6000 rpms.

Yes, very true. Unless you have a track-only car or you are an experienced rotary builder, I wouldn't recommend anything more than a mild street port. The race ports cut into the water jacket, which means it has to be filled. And that takes away alot of it's cooling affect, thereby lowering the life expectancy of the engine. Most track-only RX7's that have an aggressive race port, have to rebuild more often than equivalent piston motors do.


To the thread starter: I would recommend staying with a DSM. The 3rd gen RX7 is a beautiful car and is very fast, but it is much less reliable than your 98 GSX. The rotary is a whole new world compared the the DSM piston motor that we are ever so familiar with. It's not as difficult to rebuild as everyone thinks it is, but if you own one for a few years and you race it, I can almost guarantee you will need to rebuild it. And tuning with them is more of a PITA. They are not at all forgiving with detonation like the 4G63 is. You really have to know what you are doing with the tune, or you will lose your apex seals quick (basically equivalent to losing your piston rings).

Basically, the RX7 is a badass car, but it is a handful. If you have one, prepare to spend alot of time and money with it, and prepare to become a rotary expert. If you want more money in your pocket and less of an obligation, then stick with your GSX.