Dropped something in head...how screwed am I?

[kenamond]

NOTE: THIS WAS REVIVED FROM APRIL, 2006!! IT'S AN OLD THREAD!!

I'm waiting on a new valve cover, so I had two rags over the valvetrane to keep it clean. I was running my vaccuum line for my boost gauge and was ready to zip-tie the line out of harms way. A zip tie broke and I placed it on the rags on my motor and grabbed another one, but when I picked it up, it got snagged on the rag and the broken piece - 2" long with the box end on it - fell into the head. I'm not positive where it went, and I don't see it. I think it went down the oil drain passage on the front of the head between the #2 and #3 cylinders. Below is an image with that passage circled in red. After that is a zoomed in image. (sorry about the huge images)

How screwed am I? I'm praying that the passage returns to the pan, but I don't know.

What should I do? Help please!!

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[high klicks]

if that piece was 2 inchs long I don't believe you are going to find it in the oil pan and its not going to go further than 6 inchs straight down from the head because there is an oil galy there that goes horizontal so it needs to make that bend and the galy is the size of a nickel, best bet is try from above to get it

 

[kenamond]

Any idea of how to get it up out of that gally? I have a snake, but I can't see what I'm doing. I guess I'll just have to try sucking it up, flushing it down, then blindly grabbing at it with the snake if those fail. But if it's not going to make it through the gally, should I bother pulling the pan?

 

[high klicks]

Okay so I was wrong on where that oil went it does go down into the oil pan , so disregard what I said earlier , I just wripped apart a spare block I have in my garage just to make sure what I suggested was right. That galley goes straight down to the oil pan but there is a lip at the bottom about an inch after it opens up that's next to a balance shaft. first thing I would try take the oil plug out and take compressed air and blast that hole , it might get blown down the hole but probable not cause it may be sticking to side because of oil or the lenght of the peice , then try dumping oil down just that hole and hope it goes down . If that doesn't do it you may have to take the oil pan off . It deepend how scared you are of melted nylon going threw your engine although how worried you need to be about that i'm not sure because it will have to be small enough to get threw the sump screen and then threw the oil filter before it hits anything that it may harm. That galley is the middle one on the front of the engine (exhaust side)?

 

[big_eskimo]

Regardless if you leave oil in the pan or not, after a long absence from running or cranking, ALWAYS ALWAYS prime the oil system first.

A little bit off topic, but say your car's been sitting for six months, how do you prime the system? Just crank for awhile before starting it? I know it's off topic, but it's good info.

R.J.

 

[Ultimatedsm]

I would poor some extra oil in it to re-lubricate the top and then start it. After starting it for 30 seconds I would shut it off and drain the oil and put new oil in it.

 

[PieEyedPiper]

I think the tool Velocita was talking about is one like this:

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It shouldn't be magnetic. If you can see the zip-tie end, you can use this to grab it.

I had the exact same problem as the OP, except I dropped a rubber gromet the size of a quarter and about 1/2 an inch thick!

I borrowed the tool above fomr guys that were landscaping next door.
Good luck!

 

[CrashGNX]

I've seen people drop alot worse things in motors and never have a problem ... I'd just slap it back together and look for it in my next oil change ... whats the worst it can do in the bottom of the oil pan ... get slapped by the crank a few times or get sucked onto the screen of the oil pump? its plastic and its not gonna hurt it a bit. besides its too small to cause any oil flow problems. I've found old seals, plugs of silicone, washers, bolts, screws, even wrenches and sockets in the bottom of oil pans. I wouldnt worry till you drop something in the intake or cylinder .

 

[kenamond]

I made an adapter for my shop vac that would fit under the exhaust cam shaft, got a pair of pantyhose from my wife, snipped the foot off and used it as a filter in the shop vac hose (so I'd know if I caught it), pulled the drain plug, and sucked like a 5 cent ho. No dice.

Tried the snake and jabbed-n-grabbed for about 10 minutes, but it seems to make a bend at the bottom. So no dice.

So I poured a quart of oil down the passage and inspected my oil catch pan. No dice.

Just to be sure, I vaccuumed out the entire head in case it was just hiding really well. No dice.

On top of that, my new full IC pipe kit arrived, and it doesn't fit. This was after them shipping me the wrong thing (took 1.5 weeks from order to arrival) which I had to return (another 1.5 weeks), which they sat on for another week until I emailed them about it. A week and a half later (after emailing them, "wtf?"), they said it had been fabricated (spray painted and hose-clamped together, I guess), and 1 weeks later it arrived. Total: 6.5 weeks. So now I am no better off than 6.5 weeks ago. By the way, this was "Incline Design" and I don't recommend getting IC pipes from them.

So now what? Pull the downpipe, driveshaft, transfer unit, then oil pan for a ####in 0.1 cent broken zip tie that might still be lodged in an oil passage?

I thought about digging in to the oil pan removal, but I figured with this hot streak, the damned jackstand would fail and I'd cut both of my arms off between the rotor and concrete, crush my skull, lie there for hours in pain, be saved, brain damaged, and an "excellent driver" but "only on Mondays" - hypothetically only, of course, due to the lack of arms AND A RUNNING CAR.

It's not been a good day.

I still appreciate all the help, though.

 

[kenamond]

I've seen people drop alot worse things in motors and never have a problem ... I'd just slap it back together and look for it in my next oil change ... whats the worst it can do in the bottom of the oil pan ... get slapped by the crank a few times or get sucked onto the screen of the oil pump? its plastic and its not gonna hurt it a bit. besides its too small to cause any oil flow problems. I've found old seals, plugs of silicone, washers, bolts, screws, even wrenches and sockets in the bottom of oil pans. I wouldnt worry till you drop something in the intake or cylinder .

Did you ever find a hard IC pipe kit with a 1G BOV? Wanna sell it cheap?

I can choose to listen to you or those who say it's going to be a problem. I like your story a whole helluva lot better.

Woohoo!! 100 posts. Still no rep points...I must truely be an idiot.

 

[big_eskimo]

I made an adapter for my shop vac that would fit under the exhaust cam shaft, got a pair of pantyhose from my wife, snipped the foot off and used it as a filter in the shop vac hose (so I'd know if I caught it), pulled the drain plug, and sucked like a 5 cent ho. No dice.

Tried the snake and jabbed-n-grabbed for about 10 minutes, but it seems to make a bend at the bottom. So no dice.

So I poured a quart of oil down the passage and inspected my oil catch pan. No dice.

Just to be sure, I vaccuumed out the entire head in case it was just hiding really well. No dice.

On top of that, my new full IC pipe kit arrived, and it doesn't fit. This was after them shipping me the wrong thing (took 1.5 weeks from order to arrival) which I had to return (another 1.5 weeks), which they sat on for another week until I emailed them about it. A week and a half later (after emailing them, "wtf?"), they said it had been fabricated (spray painted and hose-clamped together, I guess), and 1 weeks later it arrived. Total: 6.5 weeks. So now I am no better off than 6.5 weeks ago. By the way, this was "Incline Design" and I don't recommend getting IC pipes from them.

So now what? Pull the downpipe, driveshaft, transfer unit, then oil pan for a ####in 0.1 cent broken zip tie that might still be lodged in an oil passage?

I thought about digging in to the oil pan removal, but I figured with this hot streak, the damned jackstand would fail and I'd cut both of my arms off between the rotor and concrete, crush my skull, lie there for hours in pain, be saved, brain damaged, and an "excellent driver" but "only on Mondays" - hypothetically only, of course, due to the lack of arms AND A RUNNING CAR.

It's not been a good day.

I still appreciate all the help, though.

Damn, , I'm sorry to hear about your troubles. At least you still have a sense of humor. I know all the perfectionists will say get it outta there, but the bottom line is, it is only a tiny plastic zip tie, don't get me wrong I'm not saying it can't cause problems, but I'd imagine that it's unlikely that it will cause any damage. Good luck with the IC pipes.

R.J.

 

[GVR4592]

It should only take you about 30-45 minute to get the oil pan off. You are going to have to do it at some point, it's a dsm. I would pull the pan and if it's not in the pan, I would take a little shot of compressed air and try to blow it out of the passage.

 

[GVR4592]

I agree that it probably won't hurt anything, but if it somehow ends up in your oil pickup and restricts flow then it could trash your engine. In my opinion it's worth taking the time to get it out.

 

[kenamond]

I'll probably do it. I'm running out of things to do while waiting on IC piping. I emailed the vendor of the 2x wrong pipe kit and flamed them (kindly so that they'll give me my money back), and then I ordered a Dejon kit. To make me feel better, I also bought the Dejon intake pipe. So if I have time this week, I'll finish up the boost gauge install and probably pull the pan off.

 

[G3ne]

dude..to flush gear oil in t-case and remove t-case dont take so long. I'm not sure why don't you remove it in first case to see instead of going harder way.
remove damn oil pan and see whats up.

 

[kenamond]

dude..to flush gear oil in t-case and remove t-case dont take so long. I'm not sure why don't you remove it in first case to see instead of going harder way.
remove damn oil pan and see whats up.

Umm..removing the oil pan is the hardest option that has been proposed, so I don't know what you mean by "instead of going harder way". And like I already said, I'll probably "remove damn oil pan".

 

[Dream On]

dude..to flush gear oil in t-case and remove t-case dont take so long. I'm not sure why don't you remove it in first case to see instead of going harder way.
remove damn oil pan and see whats up.

I couldn't agree more with this guy. It really doesn't take long man...Take off the two nuts on the downpipe, wire up somethign to hold the driveshaft, and take off the 5 transfer case bolts. This should take what, a half hour? Then just pull off the 100 screws on the oil pan and gently pry. It's not something you should be scared to do, you should be more scared of shit floating around in your oil.

 

[kenamond]

I plan on it.

 

[conquestpa]

so what ever happened here???!!!

You coulda pulled the head, sounds like that may be easier then pulling the oil pan for you.

personally i woulda turned the crank by hand a few times if all else failed. then started it up and get it nice and hot and melt that plastic tie.

 

[kenamond]

so what ever happened here???!!!

You coulda pulled the head, sounds like that may be easier then pulling the oil pan for you.

personally i woulda turned the crank by hand a few times if all else failed. then started it up and get it nice and hot and melt that plastic tie.

LoL. Didn't know I didn't follow up on this.

Check out this thread.

And then this one.

And then this one.

And finally this one.

 

[tcpx]

.. replacing the oil pan on a 1g dsm takes some time, not sure if its the same setup on a 2g

 

[AlaskanDsm]

Man i'm sorry!!! Well my internet is so slow I can't load the pictures you have up there right now. But I would like to suggest something that you might be able to try. Instead of just trying to vacuum from the top, see if you can create some kind of an additional hose that would run off of the existing hose (say if it were a shop-vac) and then feed a tube of roughly the slightly smaller size down it. It shouldn't take more but a small footlong piece of a hose...and some duck tape?? And then you can probably use it as a suction tool to at least grab onto it? Just a suggestion.

Also I heard someone mention something about compressed air? If you remove the pan and its not in there... its likely to still be in there. In my opinion see where the hole come from and blow compressed air *UP* the hole. Maybe do it a couple times and tape off some of the other holes to direct more forced air up through the lines. you may just get lucky. A 2" piece of zip tie could be pretty tough to bend or move through the passages except for the way it already came. I could be wrong. I'm still new the the DSM community. Learning what I can.

Good luck and I hope that you get the right parts from Dejon this time *knocks on wood*. I'm currently ripping an entire engine out of a 91 GSX and the bracket that hold the driver side shaft up...is killing me. So I understand the frustration...I might just have to go buy an air tool set and a compressor

 

[Defiant]

Screw it. It's a piece of plastic (nylon, delrin, et al) too tough to get melted by the oil, and is too big to be picked up through the oil screen. Even if it did get hit by the crank -and, it won't- it wouldn't hurt a thing. It's too light and too soft to hurt anything in the engine's guts.
Give the grippers a couple of tries, and if you don't get lucky, pretend it never happened.

 

[zero97tsi]

... Hmmm. I can't tell if Defiants being sarcastic or if you really didnt look at the original date.

I think he got it figured out... a while ago...

 

[kenamond]

... Hmmm. I can't tell if Defiants being sarcastic or if you really didnt look at the original date.

I think he got it figured out... a while ago...

I wondered how many folks would think this was new. Sorry y'all!! I modified the thread title so folks don't get as confused.

 

[AlaskanDsm]

Wow. I feel cool . I guess I should have read more closely. Sorry. My idea might have worked though haha. I noticed that it also said something like wow 100 posts.... but Kenamond has like 1650 posts.... sooo anyways my bad!