Be or not to be? T28 or Evo III

[Prodigyman]

Well I finally convicted my self not to go heavily on visual updates on my newly bought 97 GSX and get new Turbo with FMIC (which I got a very good deal on) and supporting mods of course. So I want this car to be my daily driver I will barley race it (just driving it hard sometimes here and there) and it will be my daily driver. So fuel economy comes to mind too.

My goal is not even 300 WHP AWD but around 275 WHP max. I am leaning heavily towards T28 because of faster spool up times and easy Bolton installation plus my car is AWD so faster spool up times does not interfere with traction. So my question is which T28 should I get? Or maybe even Evo III 16G? What about the size of the nozzles and such small things as I am not that quite experienced with turbo installation and someone will be doing it for me. What is safe and realible boost levels I should run the car? Also installing new fuel pump… is it absolutely necessary? Or can I just rewire stock one so it is getting 12-13 V.

What I currently have (most things haven’t been installed yet)

High Flow intake (with chrome pipe and heat shielded filter and BOV intake) Installed
http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=7966522766

MagnaFlow Cat Part #94009 (3") (Being shipped ATM)
MagnaFlow Muffler #14828 (3" inlet and 4" outlet) (Just got it)
Gonna get exhaust shop to custom bend me turbo back 3” exhaust system with above items

Greedy Type S BOV Recalculated back to intake (for 97-99 Eclipse, Being shipped atm)

Intercooler Piping
Here is the link and Upper pipe is made for my BOV (thinking of buying them)
http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=7970717651

Getting quite large FMIC for a good price and getting same shop to custom make me the pipes for it.

Rewire my stock fuel pump

Greddy Profec B-Spec II Boost Controller (Getting it soon)

Triple Pillar Pod with 3x gauges (52 mm, Boost, A/F, Water Temp)

And that’s about it! Also my car already has some nice aftermarket clutch installed on it.

Should I also port my exhaust manifold?

Let me know what do you guys think! Thx

 

[Jeff_Jeske]

The Forced Performance Big28 will hit hard and flow about 36 LBS of air. Its a direct bolt on and will take you into the 12s if you can drive.

The EVO3 B16G doesn't hit as hard down low but it pulls more up top. It is capable of 44LBS of air. In the end the price is about the same for either one.

Up to you if you want direct bolt on and sleeper status with super quick (instant) spool or if you can handle a little bit of lag to get more pull up top.

On average people get about 50HP out of the EVO3 but you need cams and such to push it that hard.

If you only what 300 HP then I suggest getting a 14B turbo.

 

[Prodigyman]

The Forced Performance Big28 will hit hard and flow about 36 LBS of air. Its a direct bolt on and will take you into the 12s if you can drive.

The EVO3 B16G doesn't hit as hard down low but it pulls more up top. It is capable of 44LBS of air. In the end the price is about the same for either one.

Up to you if you want direct bolt on and sleeper status with super quick (instant) spool or if you can handle a little bit of lag to get more pull up top.

On average people get about 50HP out of the EVO3 but you need cams and such to push it that hard.

If you only what 300 HP then I suggest getting a 14B turbo.

I actually want 275 WHP So what’s the difference between Big T28 and 14B? I don’t know much about it so. Is 14B direct bolt on? How is the spool up time and should I get FMIC for this one or just stick with my stock one?

Thx

 

[dynatos]

14b is the stock turbo in manual 1g's. Better than your t25, but i would go (with all the exhaust/intake stuff you got) with a t28 or evo3 16g. I think you'd be happy with either.

 

[Prodigyman]

14b is the stock turbo in manual 1g's. Better than your t25, but i would go (with all the exhaust/intake stuff you got) with a t28 or evo3 16g. I think you'd be happy with either.

I know its 1g’s turbo but is it weaker then T28? Also which T28 should I get? I am like very confused about which turbo does what and what’s the best one for me Are they bolt on turbo or should I get a kit for them? I am thinking of Hybrid T28 or Big T28 but defiantly not Evo III for my goals and my spool up times

 

[Jeff_Jeske]

Well if you can afford a little down time on your car.....you can send your T25 to forced performance and they will turn it into a FPB28.

In my opinion....the forced performance big 28 is the hot ticket. Direct bolt on and you will pick up about 100HP over the T25.

I was flowing 26LBS on my T25 and I am flowing 36LBS on my FPB28.

1LB=11CHP

You will definately hit your goals and then some. You will need to get some injectors. I suggest bigger than 550's because at 36LBS I was at 102% injector duty cycle.

You will not find a quicker spooling turbo that hauls ass. The only problem is when you run small turbos at high boost (22PSI) they turn into mini flame throwers. A FMIC is highly recommended.

 

[gsturbo11]

Well if you can afford a little down time on your car.....you can send your T25 to forced performance and they will turn it into a FPB28.

In my opinion....the forced performance big 28 is the hot ticket. Direct bolt on and you will pick up about 100HP over the T25.

I was flowing 26LBS on my T25 and I am flowing 36LBS on my FPB28.

1LB=11CHP

You will definately hit your goals and then some. You will need to get some injectors. I suggest bigger than 550's because at 36LBS I was at 102% injector duty cycle.

You will not find a quicker spooling turbo that hauls ass. The only problem is when you run small turbos at high boost (22PSI) they turn into mini flame throwers. A FMIC is highly recommended.

how long did it take for you to swap out the t25? i'm looking to put the big28 in this weekend? any tips for installation? did you change your oil lines? thanx.

 

[Jeff_Jeske]

I dicked around and it took about 2 hours.

Tips: New oil line gasket and copper crush washers
An O2 sensor socket is a plus.
Have some line wrenches so you dont strip the oil lines.
Spray everything with pb blaster penetrating oil.
Have new coolant on hand to refill your car up when you are done.



I drained and removed my radiator. That only took a few minutes. I left the exhaust manifold on the car but if you plan on porting it you might as well pull that off as well.

 

[BoredOutaMyMind]

I have the FPBigT28 and i love it. Im only boosting about 15psi right now and it pulls a lot harder than my old t25. I shipped my blown t25 to FP and they sent it back in like 3-4 buisiness days, i also got it ported. They were very helpful too, they called to make sure that i wasnt putting the t25 on my old motor (which blew about 2 seconds after the turbo) because they found some metal debris in my old turbo. I believe the 14b (which is much cheaper but harder to install) flows at 405CFM's and the BT28 flows at 550CFM, while the beefy t25 flows at like 250CFM....

 

[CRiXman]

If one changes to a FP big T28 and run it on the same boost around 13-14 psi, as the were on a T25, will they see a difference? And will it be significant enough?

C.

 

[Jeff_Jeske]

You will see a difference but it wont be much. The T25 would heat the air up more making it prone to knock and retart of timing. The FPB28 wouldn't be working hard at all thus getting full timing all the time.

That being said there's no reason not to run 17PSI on the FPB28.

 

[heavyD]

If you want marginal improvement over a T25, get a T28. If you are looking for a large improvement over the T25 get an MHI EVOIII 16G. They are both a simple install.

 

[ShapeGSX]

Personally, I'd get the Evo III 16G. A lot more headroom. And it will be easier to get to 275hp, too, if that is your "ultimate" goal. I bet that your goals will change after having the turbo bolted up for a while, though. 275hp isn't all that much.

 

[Jeff_Jeske]

If you want marginal improvement over a T25, get a T28. If you are looking for a large improvement over the T25 get an MHI EVOIII 16G. They are both a simple install.

I would say you are completely wrong in this statement. My T25 flowed 25LBS of air the FPB28 was flowing 36 at 20@ without cams. That well over a 100HP gain with the T28 not to mention instant spool with instant torque.

The EVOIII16G only gives you more top end if you have top end supporting like cams. It also spools no where near as quick or hit as hard as the FPB28. Oh yea and it bolts right on!

 

[ShapeGSX]

The EVOIII16G only gives you more top end if you have top end supporting like cams. It also spools no where near as quick or hit as hard as the FPB28. Oh yea and it bolts right on!

They can't be all that different in terms of spoolup. The Evo III 16G spools up seriously fast and hits like a ton of bricks.

And the Evo III can definitely give you more top end, even without cams. Though cams will help with either turbo.

Personally, I'd call both turbos "bolt on." You don't want to keep that flexible stock 2G lower intercooler pipe, anyway (especially with a front mount), so buy the 16G pipe. You need to get a new oil feed line whenever you get a new turbo, so get a stainless steel version made for a 16G. After that, the only modifications you need are to bend some water lines and slot the oil drain pipe bolt holes. Voila, bolt on 16G. You get to keep your old T25, or sell it. Your car doesn't have to be down for days while your T25 gets converted. And the Evo III is cheaper, to boot. What's not to like?

 

[heavyD]

I would say you are completely wrong in this statement. My T25 flowed 25LBS of air the FPB28 was flowing 36 at 20@ without cams. That well over a 100HP gain with the T28 not to mention instant spool with instant torque.

The EVOIII16G only gives you more top end if you have top end supporting like cams. It also spools no where near as quick or hit as hard as the FPB28. Oh yea and it bolts right on!

I have a ported FPT28 installed on both my 1G & 2G and have driven a 2G with an EVOIII 16G and I know what I'm taliking about. EVOIII 16G hits only slightly later but pulls much harder after 5000 RPM. If you really tried them back to back you would know.

 

[gsturbo11]

You will see a difference but it wont be much. The T25 would heat the air up more making it prone to knock and retart of timing. The FPB28 wouldn't be working hard at all thus getting full timing all the time.

That being said there's no reason not to run 17PSI on the FPB28.

at 17psi or more will i feel a significant difference from the t25? i just installed the fp big28 and i'm running it at stock boost for now and don't notice too much of a difference, if any.

 

[heavyD]

at 17psi or more will i feel a significant difference from the t25? i just installed the fp big28 and i'm running it at stock boost for now and don't notice too much of a difference, if any.

After you upgrade your fuel system you will want to run at least 18 psi but even at 16 - 17 psi you should be able to tell that it's not a T25.

 

[Jeff_Jeske]

After you upgrade your fuel system you will want to run at least 18 psi but even at 16 - 17 psi you should be able to tell that it's not a T25.

I agree. Its hard to really feel the increase. It may just feel like its running strong.

Fortuneatly I had a logger and could see the improvment in my 60-90 time.

After 17PSI it is very noticable. With alchohol injection I tried 24PSI and the car just hauled major butt even over the 20PSI daily driving setting.

 

[CRiXman]

Well if I am looking for a vtec like sensation, will a FPBT28 do the trick? When I mean vtec sensation I mean pull harder at higher rpm...

 

[ShapeGSX]

You will never get a VTEC-like feeling out of a DSM because DSMs actually have torque.

 

[Jeff_Jeske]

Well if I am looking for a vtec like sensation, will a FPBT28 do the trick? When I mean vtec sensation I mean pull harder at higher rpm...

Probably not. My FPB28 felt like a 100 shot of nitrous. As the RPM's climb it gets harder for a small turbo to keep up with the motor. Sounds like you want a 50 trim.

 

[heavyD]

Well if I am looking for a vtec like sensation, will a FPBT28 do the trick? When I mean vtec sensation I mean pull harder at higher rpm...

T28 would be the wrong turbo if you are looking for high rpm thrust. It runs out of steam like the T25 (not quite as bad mind you) at higher rpm. You would need a 50 trim turbo or at the very least an EVOIII 16G with cams.

 

[97ClipseDSM]

Not trying to bring an old thread back but i have a buddy with a Big T28. It pulls hard low end but it runs out of steam top end just like the t-25 though not as bad. I was looking at the T28 before i bought the Evo III and all i know, driving both a T28 Equipped DSM and a Evo III 16G equipped dsm (mine)..there is not much of a difference in spooltime. The Evo III 16G spools almost as fast as the t28 and definitely pulls much harder top end than the T28. For $1000, id say a t28 is seriously not a good deal. I think trying to push a Evo III 16G is alot safter than pushing a T28. You said your goal was 270 WHP, you are most likely to get that easier with an Evo III 16G.

Go with the Evo III 16G and call it a day..if u havnt already made a different purchase

 

[evolvingGS-t]

My EVO3 spools @ pretty low RPM's. Between 2800-3100 and lasts until 5800 or more.