1G ATI Super Damper Offset from Alternator/Water Pump Pulleys 91 6-bolt

[greekgodchaos]

Big thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread and helped solve the issue of why it was hitting the cover when properly installed.

EDITED FOR CLARITY:

I installed my ATI hub and damper with the provided hardware in addition to the BS spacer and metal crank plate, but it was hitting timing belt cover. I filed the circular ribs down with a Dremel and gave it more clearance. The damper fully installed now sits offset from the water pump and alternator pulleys by roughly 12mm.

At the moment, IMO, this offset can only be explained as a design oversight by ATI, as the hub should protrude out 10-12mm further than it does now in order for the 3 pulleys to line up properly. This would also eliminiate the need for buyers to modify the lower timing covers (91+) in order for them to not rub against them.

From what I have read, early 1990 timing belt covers didn't have the raised ribs so no modification is needed.

After contacting ATI, they sent me the design CAD and it shows in the side notes that the cover needs the modification, as they designed it on a 1992 7-bolt.

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NOTE: This ORIGINAL thread was created at almost 4am after struggling with stress of it not working as easily as I thought it would on the first attempt, and lacking any energy to walk back out to my garage to check anything out, so my ideas and theories were a bit crap.


Does the OEM spacer drop (the one in the picture) into the hub BEFORE you put it on the crank? (Mine was stuck to the old timing gear so I just noticed it today)
NO
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Because my pulleys aren't lining up properly and I feel I skipped this by accident. They included a large silver washer (not pictured) This is for the damper side and sits under the crank bolt.

I oven roasted the hub at 450* under the broiler for 45min and it slipped right on the anti-seize coated crank easy peas, but I have a feeling I'm going to need to pull the hub back off (SPOILER ALERT, I DID) with a proper balancer puller (not an arm puller style as per the ATI instructions)

[I didn't need to remove it, it was installed properly. ]

NOTE: when using the hub puller (not on the damper itself, but THE HUB), you will NEED a heavy duty impact gun and a large compressor. IMO, I don't see that coming off with hand tools.

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[19Eclipse90]

You’re talking about this washer?

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Looks like it is for the crank bolt itself, installed inside of the hub, after installing the hub on the crankshaft.

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How far off are the pulleys on your engine currently?

 

[greekgodchaos]

No, that one in the picture is the one I had on my OEM gear, there is a larger and flatter one that came with it that does go on the outside, but I feel I may have needed that thicker one inside the hub before I slid it on. Its off by I would say the thickness of that washer in the picture.

 

[19Eclipse90]

I’m assuming that you’re still using your crank trigger plate and balance shaft sprocket (or balance shaft spacer)?

I would imagine that this would simply butt up to those.

 

[bastarddsm]

No, that one in the picture is the one I had on my OEM gear, there is a larger and flatter one that came with it that does go on the outside, but I feel I may have needed that thicker one inside the hub before I slid it on. Its off by I would say the thickness of that washer in the picture.

Can you post a picture of what you are talking about?

 

[greekgodchaos]

I’m assuming that you’re still using your crank trigger plate and balance shaft sprocket (or balance shaft spacer)?

I would imagine that this would simply butt up to those.

Yes I am still using both of them. And it does butt up against then, but when the damper is bolted on it is rubbing badly against the timing belt cover and the pully is off by a bit compared to the water pump and alternator.

 

[bastarddsm]

Do you have the right damper? You will have to cut the hell out of the cover to clear the ati.

 

[greekgodchaos]

EDIT: I think I found the issue. I didn't install the balance shaft sprocket. I only used that ring spacer that comes with the BS delete kit. I'm thinking they designed it based around having that installed, not just a spacer. But even so, the thickness of the spacer (~14mm) should be the same as the BS gear. Unless I'm supposed to use 2 of them?


I do have the correct pulley.

The damper pulley is ~12mm inwards than the water pump pulley.

This is true concerning the HUB,

The factory lower timing cover will need to be trimmed for hub clearance.

"Stock timing cover must be trimmed for hub clearance"

BUT, this is true for the HUB, but not sure if this is also supposed to apply to the damper itself, because I did file the cover down for the hub AND pulley (EDIT: ***NOT ENOUGH***), and it now has an Itty bit of clearance from the cover, but I do feel as if I missed something.

 

[bastarddsm]

Unless they have changed something it is the bs sprocket/tin, or the spacer/tin, or like a kiggly trigger wheel. Only 1 of those, no other spacer needed, and then the hub goes up against that. It is possible your damper is missing pieces. There are several parts that go in the shell. I have a brand new one in the box, and one on my car now, I'll check it out when I get home.

Is your timing belt on, and working out ok? If you are missing spacers than the timing belt would be all crooked. The hub replaces the factory gear, and works just like it.

 

[greekgodchaos]

Unless they have changed something it is the bs sprocket/tin, or the spacer/tin, or like a kiggly trigger wheel. Only 1 of those, no other spacer needed, and then the hub goes up against that. It is possible your damper is missing pieces. There are several parts that go in the shell. I have a brand new one in the box, and one on my car now, I'll check it out when I get home.

Is your timing belt on, and working out ok? If you are missing spacers than the timing belt would be all crooked. The hub replaces the factory gear, and works just like it.

Much appreciated

Right now it's 16mm bs spacer>metal plate>ati hub>damper

The timing belt lines up just fine. Right now the one thing I can think of is if an Eagle 2.3 crankshaft has a shorter end shaft than the 2.0 ones, which measures 15mm.

 

[greekgodchaos]

I just took a dremel to raised ribs and ground it down flush with the rest of the cover. Went too deep at the bottom, so I globbed some RTV behind the thin spots. Anything to save this black cover, seeing as a new black one would set me back almost $200. I'm getting a new alternator belt tomorrow so I'll see how it looks with it installed and its offset.

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[19Eclipse90]

So it’s not just Fluidampr that has some “compatibility issues”. Good to know.

1G timing belt questions/fluidampr questions

 

[greekgodchaos]

So it’s not just Fluidampr that has some “compatibility issues”. Good to know.

1G timing belt questions/fluidampr questions

After reading that, it seems as though the Fluidampr and the ATI damper were both designed around the 1990 timing belt cover that didn't have those raised ribs, 91+ got the ribs and now we are seeing people having to remove them to alleviate this issue.

Hope that alt belt will be OK if the damper is 12mm off. They really they need to make a 10-12mm spacer that slips onto the mating flange for the damper before you bolt it down.