Anyone road coursing a FP DSM76?

[fergulus]

I just purchased the FP Green before I came over to Iraq, and was quite impressed with its performance. I have done a search for "HTA" but can't find out what specifically it is. Does this mean a more areodynamic wheel?

 

[Strm Trpr]

Yes sir, better wheel that'll be able to sustain higher pressure ratios more efficiently, this is the trademark of HTA.

You can probably gather some info from the Evo Green.
Forced Performance Turbochargers: FP GREEN 73HTA Turbocharger for Mitsubishi Evo IX

Wow, sumbitch ain't cheap either.
WTF, FP must think they have the cats ass of turbos....., but they do!

I'm gonna give a HX35 a shot on the road courses in my area.
I'm already set-up for an oil cooled CHRA anyway.

 

[fastfreddy]

What up Kevin hey let me know what you have leftover after your change in setup. I need me some parts, ill even take that turbo off your hands. Goodluck with your new setup man, this heat in az is killer thats for sure. Im a big fan of Ceramic coating, had a good experience with it on the Evo................aaaaaahhh The EVO...............

 

[We're on Boost]

Wow, there are 2 guys in this thread living right where my son has been for the last 1.5 years, worked as a flight instructor building time, until the economy dumped so many pilots out of work and even the Chinese are having big problems (his students were all from China - Hey - helping the import-export balance yay!). He lived in Goodyear (near Avondale) and flew from Glendale airport.

Anyway I've been wondering, you guys who roadrace, what do you think about partially smashed waterpipes for clearing large compressor housings? Does it cause you a problem with cooling having that extra restriction in there? What made me think of it was the HX-35, which has a real big compressor housing. The guys that mount one of those on a mitsu or FP manifold with DSM style turbine housing usually wind up smashing their waterpipes some. For that matter I think the FP DSM76 might have the same problem because it uses a big compressor housing, "S" size I think. Whereas the FP3052 uses an E size housing.

I just purchased the FP Green before I came over to Iraq, and was quite impressed with its performance. I have done a search for "HTA" but can't find out what specifically it is. Does this mean a more areodynamic wheel?

The story on how it was named is here, in post #78:

http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthread.php?p=4448615&highlight=tight#post4448615

You can probably gather some info from the Evo Green. Wow, sumbitch ain't cheap either.

Aw that's nothing. The "regular" Evo Green is now $9,999
Forced Performance Turbochargers: FP GREEN Turbocharger Evo IX
Well, glad to see Robert still has a sense of humor.

Gary

 

[KevinBoosted]

What up Kevin hey let me know what you have leftover after your change in setup. I need me some parts, ill even take that turbo off your hands. Goodluck with your new setup man, this heat in az is killer thats for sure. Im a big fan of Ceramic coating, had a good experience with it on the Evo................aaaaaahhh The EVO...............

Hahaha welcome to DsmTuners Freddy. Well keep in touch im sure, if i dont end up keeping the FP3065 ill let you know

Wow, there are 2 guys in this thread living right where my son has been for the last 1.5 years, worked as a flight instructor building time, until the economy dumped so many pilots out of work and even the Chinese are having big problems (his students were all from China - Hey - helping the import-export balance yay!). He lived in Goodyear (near Avondale) and flew from Glendale airport.

Anyway I've been wondering, you guys who roadrace, what do you think about partially smashed waterpipes for clearing large compressor housings? Does it cause you a problem with cooling having that extra restriction in there? What made me think of it was the HX-35, which has a real big compressor housing. The guys that mount one of those on a mitsu or FP manifold with DSM style turbine housing usually wind up smashing their waterpipes some. For that matter I think the FP DSM76 might have the same problem because it uses a big compressor housing, "S" size I think. Whereas the FP3052 uses an E size housing.

Gary

Yep i live about 8 mins from Glendale Airport, and its still next to a giant landfill

I dont think the compressor is that big of a deal. I have a FP3065 which has a bigger compressor housing than the FP3052, id say its about ready to kiss the water pipe but not in contact to it. Id heatwrap the waterpipe though to keep temps down, im sorry i never ended up doing that.

 

[BoostFrenzy]

If money is not a problem, this is what I'm thinking for you:

-Divided T3 GT3076R (With the Ported E cover)
-Ship it off to FP to HTA the comp wheel and they swap the E cover for the SP cover (you sell off the E cover)
-Rest of setup that would cost a lot of money

This would spool fast, flow a nice number of lbs/min and if you ever want to drag it and up the boost for power, respond VERY nicely. It really depends on how you want to run the car though. If you want to be competitive in some sort of time trial, then go with a smaller turbo and focus on hitting your marks. If it's just a shits and giggles car, go for it!

The next problem is keeping it cool and stopping

 

[We're on Boost]

Divided T3 GT3076R (With the Ported E cover)

Nice dyno results on a setup like the above shown here:

FULL RACE TWIN SCROLL 30R results and data - evolutionm.net

I think these results are pretty impressive, considering 93 octane pump gas ~25psi.
Dynojet, uncorrected, ambient conditions listed so you can draw your own conclusions about the numbers. One thing for sure though - very wide powerband, much stronger in the lower part of the range than typical single scroll setups.
Expensive - Full-Race tubular manifold, two wastegates, etc.
Lots of good pics of the install, shows the wastegates almost touching the radiator - this was on an Evo.

 

[BoostFrenzy]

Well luckily, now there is the V-band 38mm Tial so fitment won't be as much of an issue. Just if you have a 2g, you'd want to switch to a 1g radiator design to keep the upper rad hose away from the manifold. I'm looking into a divided 35R setup right now haha.

 

[We're on Boost]

Well luckily, now there is the V-band 38mm Tial so fitment won't be as much of an issue. Just if you have a 2g, you'd want to switch to a 1g radiator design to keep the upper rad hose away from the manifold. I'm looking into a divided 35R setup right now haha.

Yes, the new compact Tial 38 would definitely be the way to go with a setup like this. You don't need 44mm when there are 2 of them!
The 1g radiator idea sure seems like the way to go too.
When "evodan" switched from the twin-scroll 30r to a twin-scroll 35r setup he had serious surge problems because of the boost coming in earlier (at a lower compressor flow) than what the normal, non surge-ported GT3582 was designed for. It was kind of funny because Geoff had been telling him all along that it would happen. I don't remember how he solved it but Geoff @ Full Race would sure know. Probably switched to an anti-surge ported type compressor housing. The GT3076 didn't have this problem because it comes always with an anti-surge compressor cover.

 

[Strm Trpr]

If money is not a problem, this is what I'm thinking for you:

-Divided T3 GT3076R (With the Ported E cover)
-Ship it off to FP to HTA the comp wheel and they swap the E cover for the SP cover (you sell off the E cover)
-Rest of setup that would cost a lot of money

This would spool fast, flow a nice number of lbs/min and if you ever want to drag it and up the boost for power, respond VERY nicely. It really depends on how you want to run the car though. If you want to be competitive in some sort of time trial, then go with a smaller turbo and focus on hitting your marks. If it's just a shits and giggles car, go for it!

The next problem is keeping it cool and stopping

Here's what the above mentions, but the GT3076R already comes with the 4" SP Comp Cover.
Garrett GT3076R Ball Bearing Turbo - GT30R (500 HP) Garrett GT30R Turbo Ball Bearing GT3076R , GT3037R Turbocharger [700382-12 , 700382] - $1,120.00 : Himni Racing, Turbocharger, Turbo, Garrett, Turbo Kit, GReddy, Mazda RX-7, HKS, Apexi, TiAL, TurboX

Get that set-up with the Divided T3 .78 A/R housing.
It is the same as what's dynoed below in the EvoM.net link.

Nice dyno results on a setup like the above shown here:

FULL RACE TWIN SCROLL 30R results and data - evolutionm.net

Or, not sure if you've given this much thought, but your FP3065 is essentially a Garrett GT3082R.
Slap a .78 A/R T3 divided turbine housing on it.
It has the same 82mm Compressor Wheel found in the GT3582R, but instead it's spun by a 30R Turbine Wheel.

Then if you still need more, you can send FP your FP3065 and have them HTA it for you.

FP HTA3065 in a .78 A/R T3 Turbine Housing should be bad ass on the road course.

 

[BoostFrenzy]

Here's what the above mentions, but the GT3076R already comes with the 4" SP Comp Cover.
Garrett GT3076R Ball Bearing Turbo - GT30R (500 HP) Garrett GT30R Turbo Ball Bearing GT3076R , GT3037R Turbocharger [700382-12 , 700382] - $1,120.00 : Himni Racing, Turbocharger, Turbo, Garrett, Turbo Kit, GReddy, Mazda RX-7, HKS, Apexi, TiAL, TurboX

That isn't an SP cover. It is a T04E PORTED cover just like I said it was. Regular 30R's don't go above this. Once you swap the compressor wheel to a GT35 wheel or even HTA it, then most companies go to the T04SP cover.

EDIT: I'd also like to note that the website linked, only offers the "bullet hole" style T04SP cover which has been said to do nothing with surge. For an SP cover, try and go with the newer Garrett covers like that of which FP uses.

Or, not sure if you've given this much thought, but your FP3065 is essentially a Garrett GT3082R.
Slap a .78 A/R T3 divided turbine housing on it.
It has the same 82mm Compressor Wheel found in the GT3582R, but instead it's spun by a 30R Turbine Wheel.

Then if you still need more, you can send FP your FP3065 and have them HTA it for you.

FP HTA3065 in a .78 A/R T3 Turbine Housing should be bad ass on the road course.

IMHO, the .78A/R divided hotside would be too small for a turbo like this. It would try and spool up like a normal 30R, but it has the 35R compressor wheel on it so it will force more CFM through the compressor. In my mind (because this has never been done) it would create surge no matter what compressor cover you put on it. Let alone the fact that if you HTA it, it will do it even more. For this particular type of turbo, I'd go with the .82A/R divided T3 hotside. It would still spool fast, and also flow more Lbs/Min.

 

[Strm Trpr]

That isn't an SP cover. It is a T04E PORTED cover just like I said it was. Regular 30R's don't go above this. Once you swap the compressor wheel to a GT35 wheel or even HTA it, then most companies go to the T04SP cover.

EDIT: I'd also like to note that the website linked, only offers the "bullet hole" style T04SP cover which has been said to do nothing with surge. For an SP cover, try and go with the newer Garrett covers like that of which FP uses.

IMHO, the .78A/R divided hotside would be too small for a turbo like this. It would try and spool up like a normal 30R, but it has the 35R compressor wheel on it so it will force more CFM through the compressor. In my mind (because this has never been done) it would create surge no matter what compressor cover you put on it. Let alone the fact that if you HTA it, it will do it even more. For this particular type of turbo, I'd go with the .82A/R divided T3 hotside. It would still spool fast, and also flow more Lbs/Min.

Didn't know Garrett offered a .82 A/R Divided T3 Hotside.
Is it really that much bigger than the .78 A/R T3 Hotside.

Didn't know you can get an Anti-Surge T04E Comp Cover with a 4" Inlet and 2" Outlet.

What makes it a T04S cover then?
4" Inlet & 2.5" Outlet?
Both a .70 A/R.

Also, everywhere I look I can't find Divided Garrett T3 Turbine Housings.
All I see is the .78 Divided one.

 

[BoostFrenzy]

Didn't know Garrett offered a .82 A/R Divided T3 Hotside.
Is it really that much bigger than the .78 A/R T3 Hotside.

It wouldn't be much, but it would be a move in the right direction. The only thing left after that is a 1.0+A/R hotside and although that would be good for maximum power and minimal surge, it wouldn't be good for overall spool times.

Didn't know you can get an Anti-Surge T04E Comp Cover with a 4" Inlet and 2" Outlet.

What makes it a T04S cover then?
4" Inlet & 2.5" Outlet?
Both a .70 A/R.

I think you are a little bit confused. Normally, a 30R (GT3076R) will come with a standard T04E cover (3" inlet, 2" outlet, .60A/R). Most companies either only sell or offer for the 30R the T04E Ported cover (4" ported inlet, 2" outlet, .60A/R). The T04S cover consists of a 4" inlet, 2.5" outlet and it is a .70A/R. The SP is the same thing, just with either the "Bullet hole" style or the more modern Garrett style port to them.

Also, everywhere I look I can't find Divided Garrett T3 Turbine Housings.
All I see is the .78 Divided one.

That's the other thing. The .78A/R housing is easy to get because if my memory serves me right, that's the one that comes on the GT32. A turbo that pretty much no one uses. The other 2 available (.82 and the other one that's 1.0+ A/R) in a T3 are much harder to get because Garrett isn't manufacturing a lot of those (if at all anymore). After that it's a T4 divided but that's only on a GT35 and up turbo.

 

[Strm Trpr]

Ah... Thanks for all of the clarifications.

 

[We're on Boost]

Probably the best vendor to get info from (and buy from) about twin-scroll is Geoff at Full-Race. He is "Mr Twin Scroll". He would know what housings are available and how to mix and match stuff if you want to try that. He is a Garrett dealer, a Borg-Warner dealer (I'm talking actual BW now, not Bullseye, don't mean anything bad about bullseye though!) and also a Forced Performance dealer.
Here is a link to his page for the GT3076 twin scroll.

Full-Race Motorsports

 

[KevinBoosted]

I live about 20 mins away from Full Race i took a trip down to the shop around the summer time to ask a few questions but i was dealing with a popping i/c pipe at the time and they were pretty busy at the shop. I did however take a trip over to UMS Tuning about 2 weeks ago and talked over my build with Tony and are getting details down to the T.
All is looking well so far so im going to go make my build thread when i get back from my vacation back home in Connecticut after the holidays, and i move into my new house. Then its time for the dsm to go under the knife and all the fun begins

 

[KevinBoosted]

Well a little bit of an update. Some awesome news. My motor build has begun, and the car is slowly starting to transform. Crank is at the machine shop getting its specs verified and integrity checked as well as some polishing motor is headed out next. But as far as the turbo...its a surprise

 

[95blackGsTurbo]

GT55R with a 200 shot directly into the exhaust manifold to help spool?

 

[Atuca]

seriously, where is the fun in "its a surprise"!!!

I demand all people who helped before your last post get a PM with what turbo you chose

Can't wait to see it come together!!

 

[95blackGsTurbo]

You should just create a build journal Kevin. That way in 22 months when it's almost done you don't have to revive this thread again .

 

[We're on Boost]

...its a surprise

.... meaning he hasn't made up his mind yet!

 

[KevinBoosted]

Its a surprise. I promise i will let you guys know when the time is right, dont want to jump the gun before the turbo is in my posession
Adam i can tell you its not a t25 on a built motor

 

[95blackGsTurbo]

Its a surprise. I promise i will let you guys know when the time is right, dont want to jump the gun before the turbo is in my posession
Adam i can tell you its not a t25 on a built motor

Wanna race? I'll even let you get a 30 second push start.

 

[shane90gsx]

So it sounds like you already bought a turbo. or moving in that direction for a turbo. Can i throw another...what about this turbo. The turbo tech is crazy these days. I do a lot of road racing and i also have my motor being built

may i suggest the or have someone comment on the PT&E 57trim. dual ball. Not once did someone mention the new Built turbos from pte. . Fast spool on my stock 2.0 6bolt. great top end. And it liked to be ran at both high boost drag. and medium. (18-22) My built is a .020 over piston, stock rod length. High rev motor. It sounds like we have similar set ups. I can go on about what I'm building, but the point is does anyone like these turbo's.

 

[We're on Boost]

Well ^ Ryan Gates seems to be doing real well in time attack in his evoX with AMS 750R (PTE billet 5857 ball bearing version). Gates311.com
There are a lot of videos of that car, a lot of them are from last year with the stock I think turbo. The video I like, I can't find it right now, was an in-car cam view on one of the lower speed tracks where you can really hear the quick throttle response coming out of the corners, with the 5857, shot very recently.