420A 300HP 420A 1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS Build Path Recommendation?

[TTVxIndicaxHigh]

So, I'm gonna be purchasing a 420A Turbocharged Rebuild engine from O'Rileys for $2,700.

I wanted to see what build path I could take to achieve 300HP out of my 1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS. I believe i could be wrong that a 420A push's either 135 or 160 stock. What would I need to upgrade? What shocks do you guys recommend? What Type of Tires do I need?

Hopefully you guy can give me some good pointer. Please do not comment "Sell your car" or "Just get a GS-T or GSX" where I live. That is not a option an RS's & GS's are good to use as "Starter Builds". So, that's what I wanna work with. If seeing if I can push a 300HP 420A Eclipse GS.

 

[streetraceboi]

For $2700 you can buy a GST, put another 1-2k into it and have 300hp (including maintenance).

On the other hand, you'll spend $2700 for a naturally aspirated 420a (there is no 420a Turbocharged rebuild engine from O'Reilly, they came NA) motor that you'll have to rebuild with forged parts. Add in the cost of a turbo, intercooler, supporting mods, etc. Probably another few thousand. 300hp in a 420a sounds easier typing it than it actually is.

I get what you're saying, a "starter build", but unless you plan on sticking to 420a's for the rest of your life and not upgrade to a 4g63, its easier to get a 4g63 and use that as a starter build. Since 420a and 4g63 are two different ball games.

 

[Chewy4g63]

So, I'm gonna be purchasing a 420A Turbocharged Rebuild engine from O'Rileys for $2,700.

I wanted to see what build path I could take to achieve 300HP out of my 1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS. I believe i could be wrong that a 420A push's either 135 or 160 stock. What would I need to upgrade? What shocks do you guys recommend? What Type of Tires do I need?

Hopefully you guy can give me some good pointer. Please do not comment "Sell your car" or "Just get a GS-T or GSX" where I live. That is not a option an RS's & GS's are good to use as "Starter Builds". So, that's what I wanna work with. If seeing if I can push a 300HP 420A Eclipse GS.

First thing, good luck with your build man!!!

Here's a few steps I'd look at. Stock engine 420as don't like much power, so definitely look at rods and pistons.

Ebay turbo kit will work just fine.

Find a way to tune the ecu, or go standalone. I recommend megasquirt or speedyefi.

Last thing, the most important one, get poly engine bushing inserts. They'll save the whole build from wheel hop, destroying trannies. And etc.

To push 300, you're also going to need head studs, don't bither with arp main studs yet. A good set of rods and pistons (real st sells manley rods and wisecos or cps for like $1050), and head studs will let you make enough power to destroy transmissions.

 

[Echo-Eclipse]

First off...dont buy a oriellys rebuilt motor...youll need rods/pistons i recommend eagle rods with weisco pistons, with the tech we have now adays youd even be okay running a 10:1 piston, so long as your going standalone. there isnt alot of options for tuning your stock ECU....so id start there...Megasquirt is an excellent option with lots of support. you'll want head studs to achieve 300hp, and either a turbo or nos. alot goes into getting a significant amount of power out of these 420a engines. Best of luck!

 

[TTVxIndicaxHigh]

First off...dont buy a oriellys rebuilt motor...youll need rods/pistons i recommend eagle rods with weisco pistons, with the tech we have now adays youd even be okay running a 10:1 piston, so long as your going standalone. there isnt alot of options for tuning your stock ECU....so id start there...Megasquirt is an excellent option with lots of support. you'll want head studs to achieve 300hp, and either a turbo or nos. alot goes into getting a significant amount of power out of these 420a engines. Best of luck!

Could I use a DSMlink ECU on a 420A?

 

[Echo-Eclipse]

Could I use a DSMlink ECU on a 420A?

no. thats for the 4g63 folks...

 

[TTVxIndicaxHigh]

For $2700 you can buy a GST, put another 1-2k into it and have 300hp (including maintenance). On the other hand...youll spend $2700 for a naturally aspirated 420a (there is no 420a Turbocharged rebuild engine from O'reilly, they came NA) motor that youll have to rebuild with forged parts. Add in the cost of a turbo, intercooler, supporting mods, etc. Probably another few thousand. 300hp in a 420a sounds easier typing it than it actually is. I get what youre saying, a "starter build"...but unless you plan on sticking to 420a's for the rest of your life and not upgrade to a 4g63, its easier to get a 4g63 and use that as a starter build. Since 420a and 4g63 are two different ball games.

O'Rileys probably found one that somebody built with a turbo installed onto it. They have access to the domestic market.

 

[Echo-Eclipse]

a turbo is an add-on...oreillys simply sells rebuilt engines, and the engines they sell is without exhaust manifolds....soooo it is unlikely that they are selling one with turbo attached...

 

[dustyboner]

I believe i could be wrong that a 420A push's either 135 or 160 stock.

a 420a completely stock puts down roughly 115-120hp at the wheels at sea level

I was considering it for a while. Until I priced it out. Well over 3k to get a swap to run in a dsm, unelss you already had everything from a totaled civic. Not worth it tbh

if you had one of these on it, it would be worth it.

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[TTVxIndicaxHigh]

For $2700 you can buy a GST, put another 1-2k into it and have 300hp (including maintenance).

I plan on purchasing a GS-T or GSX when I find one on the market around here at a decent price. But, I'm just sticking to a 420A for now.

 

[streetraceboi]

if you had one of these on it, it would be worth it.

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Off topic but related cause K series I traded a guy my one owner 95 tsi fwd auto for an 06 Civic SI years back. I thought "let me see what all this hype is about". I couldn't find the hype . The car was slow as balls in comparison to my gfs bolt on Spyder, even when VTEC kicked in yo. I guess its just the 20yr DSMer Honduh hater in me. Don't get me wrong, it was comfortable and roomy as hell, but I felt it would have taken twice the money to make it as fast as a decently built bolt on DSM

 

[streetraceboi]

I plan on purchasing a GS-T or GSX when I find one on the market around here at a decent price. But, I'm just sticking to a 420A for now.

Plan on possibly traveling a few hours for one. I looked around in your area and it seems deserted

 

[dustyboner]

Off topic but related cause K series I traded a guy my one owner 95 tsi fwd auto for an 06 Civic SI years back. I thought "let me see what all this hype is about". I couldn't find the hype . The car was slow as balls in comparison to my gfs bolt on Spyder, even when VTEC kicked in yo. I guess its just the 20yr DSMer Honduh hater in me. Don't get me wrong, it was comfortable and roomy as hell, but I felt it would have taken twice the money to make it as fast as a decently built bolt on DSM

this is what is looks like when the vtec kicks in

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[TTVxIndicaxHigh]

Plan on possibly traveling a few hours for one. I looked around in your area and it seems deserted

Possibly if it's running!

I'm working on getting a new job as a Dominos pizza delivery driver since they can make some good ass money. I'm saving to purchase & ship a 1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GS from Florida that running to where I am in North Dakota. The owner has been holding it for me. And he's letting me have it for $500. I'm just short $250 right now of $500.

After i purchase it imma help him get a new title then he will be mailing me the transfer title. So i can turn that in & start the perminate plate process an everything then he's gonna hold it for me until. I get the shipping ready But, shipping is $1700.

That's what I did with my GS!

 

[pieceofcloth]

Possiblely if it's running! I'm working on getting a new job as a dominos pizza delivery driver sense they can make some good ass money. I'm saving to purchase & ship a 1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GS from Florida that running to where I am in North Dakota. The owner has been holding it for me. And he's letting me have it for $500. I'm just short $250 right now of $500. After i purchase it imma help him get a new title then he will be mailing me the tranfer title. So i can turn that in & start the perminate plate process an everything then he's gonna hold it for me until. I get the shipping ready But, shipping is $1700.

That's what I did with my GS!

Red flag dot com. Never purchase a vehicle without a title. Especially since there are still thousands of these within the us. Is there a specific reason why the seller cant get the title on their own? You cant get plates till its been inspected. Itll be a safety inspection & will need to be done in the county registered.

Shipping 1700? Gah damn, 1-300 for title, inspection 7$, never seen the vehicle and you & 500 for the vehicle. Im sure there is time and energy to factor in, but if patience runs out.. you make moves like these. Be careful, hope all goes thru & well. Im not sure if theres a hobby lobby out there but supposedly they got there starting pay at 15$ when i started at 15yrs it was like 5.15 an hr

Off topic but related cause K series I traded a guy my one owner 95 tsi fwd auto for an 06 Civic SI years back. I thought "let me see what all this hype is about". I couldn't find the hype . The car was slow as balls in comparison to my gfs bolt on Spyder, even when VTEC kicked in yo. I guess its just the 20yr DSMer Honduh hater in me. Don't get me wrong, it was comfortable and roomy as hell, but I felt it would have taken twice the money to make it as fast as a decently built bolt on DSM

I remember when the rsx type s came out. I was around some folks who were privileged to get it off the lot immediately. He took us all 1 by 1 around and i swear, it was the moment i never wanted to deal w honda again

Thats coming from a honda head thats done it all back 98 from type r crx, lsvtc integra, b16 hatch, h22 hatch, etc.(except turbo) I honestly didnt know what or heard about a dsm till i moved to new mexico.i saw a video of a talon launch, all 4 got off the ground.. I WAS HOOKED. The K can have all accessories, turbo, w/e.. itll never be for me, nvr... not while the 4g63 exists

 

[pauleyman]

No way would I give 500 for a car and 1700 to ship it. Huge red flags. Patience is what you need. Find a local independent dealer and tell him what you're after. Let them find it at auction.
If you're short 250 on a 500$ car you're really not gonna like it when you have to do mainenance and repairs up front. I'm sure this is not what you want to hear.
On the dominoes thing. Money is not that great. You absolutely must consider you are essentially selling your car to them 1 mile at a time. I know because I did it. I had a brand new truck and after 1 year I had 30k on it.

 

[CKOPOCT]

Wow - a lot of info in this thread.

OP - if you are looking to get into a GST/GSX down the road, don't spend your money trying to beef up a 420A. Save it for the GST. If you were financially sound and were just looking for an interesting hobby, that's one thing... but if you're looking to finance your build while living paycheck to paycheck, trying to boost the 420A and get 300HP out of it will be expensive. If you're looking at Domino's Pizza as a good source of income and are short $250 on a $500 car, I doubt you have money to burn - which is exactly what you'll be doing.

As others have said, have patience. Get yourself a cheap, reliable grocery getter so you can deliver pizzas and earn cash. Spend the next several months squirrelling away that money and live on DSMTuners, reading the forums and learning from the veterans and pros on here. Then, armed with sufficient cash and a healthy amount of knowledge, get the car you want to build - be that a 420A or a 4G63. You'll have good info to be able to buy a good car to build, you'll know how to approach it, what you'll be getting into, and about how much you'll need to get your project where you want it to go.

Looking forward to reading how your build goes over the months/years.

 

[CKOPOCT]

​

So, I'm gonna be purchasing a 420A Turbocharged Rebuild engine from O'Rileys for $2,700.

I wanted to see what build path I could take to achieve 300HP out of my 1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS. I believe i could be wrong that a 420A push's either 135 or 160 stock. What would I need to upgrade? What shocks do you guys recommend? What Type of Tires do I need?

Hopefully you guy can give me some good pointer. Please do not comment "Sell your car" or "Just get a GS-T or GSX" where I live. That is not a option an RS's & GS's are good to use as "Starter Builds". So, that's what I wanna work with. If seeing if I can push a 300HP 420A Eclipse GS.

You've gotten gotten a bit of unsolicited financial/fatherly advice that didn't really address your original questions - including from me. Revector -

You ask what you would need to upgrade. That depends on what your goals are for the car. Daily driver scooting around town? Track time? Road racing? Embarrassing every Mustang and Subi you see? That answer will begin to determine where you should focus your efforts.

Tires - You'd need different tires for road racing than for running down the drag strip, and both would be a waste of money if you're just zipping around town from stoplight to stoplight. Being in Montana, if the car is a garage queen during the cold months that changes things vs. driving around on the ice and snow. If people are impressed by the brand of rubber you're running, you're hanging with the wrong crowd. Nobody cares until your setup matches theirs and you're beating them down the strip... then they'll look at your tires, maybe.

Shocks (struts). Again, without knowing your goals it's impossible to make a good recommendation. For my build I bought an inexpensive set of Tien coilovers. My plans are for a daily driver pushing roughly 300-450 at the wheels out of my 4G63. No track time and not bear bait. The coilovers are a mild set ($900) and I expect they'll provide a smooth ride based on others' feedback. They wouldn't work for road racing as they're not stiff enough for that level of punishment. They'd be fine for the strip but only if I dabble; for competition I'd need a different setup. What you get will depend on your wallet and your needs/goals. I'd say don't focus on the suspension until your get your power plant and goals figured out. If you're interested in wow factor, spend your money elsewhere first. You might be able to score a cheap set of used equipment on here, but I think your cash would be better spent on the engine first.

But for the real meat behind your question - You mention 300HP out of the 420a. It sounds like what you want is a zippy, powerful car without having to try to find a GST/GSX. I am not sure about the O'Rileys engine - as has been said, the 420A was manufactured and sold as a naturally aspirated engine, not boosted. If you're buying an engine from O'Rileys and it has a warranty, be aware that modifying ANYTHING on the engine that pushes more power will void that warranty. Get a long block for a N/A car from a parts store and install a turbo on it, if a piston burns or a rod punches through the block, or even in the timing belt breaks and you bend valves, you'll be SOL getting the parts store to honor the warranty.

For the 420a, factory compression ratio for the engine is 9.8:1, which is boostable. But boosting the 420a is not as simple as just throwing a turbocharger on the car and calling it good. Every contributing component and system needs to be taken into account. Pushing 300HP out of the 420a means you are more than doubling the engine's factory output. That can be done, but not without changing up a lot of other things. As a comparison, that would be like expecting you to go from bench pressing 200 pounds to benching 400 pounds by only increasing the strength of your chest muscles. Sure, your pecs could handle it, but the rest of your supporting muscles (triceps, delts, intercostals, etc.) wouldn't be able to handle it and you'd injure something fast.

So what do you need to upgrade to boost your 420a? Depends on how much boost you will put to the engine. You can put few pounds of boost to it without changing the stock internals, but not much, and a lot will depend on how well built the engine is. Just because you bought it from a parts store doesn't mean it was rebuilt well. Auto parts stores are resellers, not professional engine builders. O'Rileys, Autozone, Advance, Pep Boys, etc. all get their engines from high output companies that employ relatively low-paid employees to basically do monkey work. That's why a complete engine from one of those stores is a couple grand complete while a professionally built engine is double that or more. Everything from O'Rileys will be within tolerance, but there can be a lot of slop in a generic rebuilt engine. The more boost, the more stress on the engine and the more that slop matters on how long the engine lives.

If you do decide to boost it, you'll need to upgrade fuel delivery, intake charge cooling, exhaust, and engine management accordingly. You can likely put around 5-7 pounds of boost to the car without getting too deep in upgrades, putting you somewhere around 200HP. If you put more boost to it than that you'll have to strengthen the internals, do head work, and really start upgrading the rest of the components. This is where the real expense will begin to happen. Research is your friend here. You'll have to see what it will take component-wise to reach your goals and bump that up against your wallet. You could easily spend $10K and more on a setup that will eat the streets.

Check out these threads to get you started:
How Much HP / Boost Can a stock 420a lower end handle?
how much boost can a 420a handle?

Hope this helps.

 

[BLACK'98DSM]

One of the weakest parts of the 420a is the ringlands on the pistons. I've seen some that were broke with nothing but bolt on mods. You will learn a lot about the 420a by tearing them down at the junkyard.

This being said, I would never boost a 420a with stock pistons, when they fail without boost. Given the cars I've seen like this, we're probably driven like a bat out of hell, and would have lasted a lot longer if they were treated right. But the fact is, if you're turbocharging your 420a you're not just doing it for looks, you know you're going to run it hard at least occasionally. Plenty of people on the forums will say "oh 7 pounds is fine on stock internals"... but is it really fine? Is it also fine to crack your ringlands on a nonboosted application?

 

[fwdmaster]

There was a thread started here awhile back on that. I haven't seen the guy update the post since

Lmaooooo

 

[CKOPOCT]

Restarted the thread, eh? Ok. Build path for 300HP out of your 420a:

Pull the engine and have it machined and built with high-quality parts that can withstand 400HP. This will probably include a crank, pistons, rods, and bearings. Have it balanced, align hined, shot peened... the works. Over-build the intetnals. That way the engine will outlast fun punishment.

Have the head machined with appropriate valve train, including cams.

With an engine that can handle 400HP and 25psi of boost, obtain the turbo, intercooler, and piping that fits your application and budget.

Next, get 650-750cc injectors.

Next, EMS (megasquirt works well, but there are others - just make sure it is for the 420a and not the 4G63).

Exhaust is next. 3" turbo back.

Decide how you want to measure the air and tune - MAF or SD - and get the associated sensors.

There will be wiring in all of this

Now that your power plant is putting out your desired HP - upgrade the clutch assy (assuming MT).

Drive and enjoy. Replace/upgrade engine mounts, suspension, shifter, brakes, tires, etc. as you see fit once you see how it rides.

If you want specific parts recommendations, every engine is different. Manley I-beam rods and pistons are fine, but then so are any number of other manufacturers' stuff. How much money do you have and how much overbuild is too much?

You won't get a reliable 300HP out of the 420a without spending good coin on ensuring the engine is solid before buying bolt-ons.

 

[TTVxIndicaxHigh]

Restarted the thread, eh? Ok. Build path for 300HP out of your 420a:

Pull the engine and have it machined and built with high-quality parts that can withstand 400HP. This will probably include a crank, pistons, rods, and bearings. Have it balanced, align hined, shot peened... the works. Over-build the intetnals. That way the engine will outlast fun punishment.

Have the head machined with appropriate valve train, including cams.

With an engine that can handle 400HP and 25psi of boost, obtain the turbo, intercooler, and piping that fits your application and budget.

Next, get 650-750cc injectors.

Next, EMS (megasquirt works well, but there are others - just make sure it is for the 420a and not the 4G63).

Exhaust is next. 3" turbo back.

Decide how you want to measure the air and tune - MAF or SD - and get the associated sensors.

There will be wiring in all of this

Now that your power plant is putting out your desired HP - upgrade the clutch assy (assuming MT).

Drive and enjoy. Replace/upgrade engine mounts, suspension, shifter, brakes, tires, etc. as you see fit once you see how it rides.

If you want specific parts recommendations, every engine is different. Manley I-beam rods and pistons are fine, but then so are any number of other manufacturers' stuff. How much money do you have and how much overbuild is too much?

You won't get a reliable 300HP out of the 420a without spending good coin on ensuring the engine is solid before buying bolt-ons.

I have a huge question! While I'm saving up for a new engine. Could I start the car up an let it run on idle or would the rod that's knocking would still have a high chance of breaking on the engine. Just running the car on idle.

When I got the car it seems oil leaked out of it an had a burning smell. Does that mean I need new engine valves or hoses maybe I can take care or those so I can stop running the car on battery all the time an just idle on gas. Until I get a call Monday on the rebuild.

 

[CKOPOCT]

Rod knock - if you truly have a rod knock then that means you have significant wear on the bearings and running the engine, even at idle, will increase the wear and damage. It is unlikely that the rod will break and punch a hole in the side of the block, but it would be extremely unwise to run the engine at all. The potential for breakage and damage is very much there and there's more to be concerned about than just a junk block. Metal shavings can become a problem as they get trapped in the oil. If the oil filter doesn't capture them they become major problems throughout the system. So if you have a rod knock, my advice is to not run the engine at all. Be aware that other things can sound somewhat similar to a rod knock to the untrained ear.

Oil leak - means a gasket needs to be replaced or something needs to be tightened up (assuming this is an external leak and not an internal one). Since you are getting a rebuild, don't worry about it. Just make sure that everything is good and as it should be when your new engine is installed.

"so I can stop running the car on battery all the time an just idle on gas" ... I don't understand what you are talking about here.