Who's swapped to a 1g NT throttle body

[turboglenn]

Just wondering what the gain was if dyno'd or felt in the seat of the pants, I have one that ultra soniclly cleaned up the other day and was going to put on when i did my new IC piping the other night but fell short of having another mandrel bend or 90* silicone coupler and had to leave it off...

i'km thinking about getting the piece to put it on today and was wodnering if it was even going to be worth my labor on this holiday weekend... the reason is because in order to mount it and get rig of the 2g elbow I need to make a way to mount my IAT sensor, nitrouse nozzle and one of my sometimes used methanol nozzles (that elbow is great for threading things into the intake tract, gotta admit it)

So..... Tell me all about it if you've done it.. I've fully cleaned and prepped it to go on besides pulling out the vacum sources and putting grub screws in to block them off

 

[ramsack]

I would think there would be minimal gains, if any. The bore is still identical. It would be an upgrade for a 1g car, but so would a 2g elbow be, too. The idea I think why people go with it is simplicity.

 

[Gamble97]

I did it, but can't tell you the gains as I did a few things at once. It was great, with the half shaft mod, and the best part is no throttle body elbow and no gasket to keep messing with.
The inlet is 2.75" just so you know.
I loved that TB!

 

[dsm-onster]

A 2g elbow is an upgrade to a 1g car when you have it ported.

I can't say you will get any gains. I may have with my setup. Since when I swapped to the n/t TB, I was able to do away with the stock 1g elbow. But you can just as easily get an upgrade elbow instead. I like the n/t TB because it's beaded and takes away another gasket that could lead to a boost leak WHILE forcing you to do away with the stock 1g elbow at the same time. Considering the likelyhood that there's no performance difference between a 1g n/t TB + coupler vs. stock turbo TB + upgrade elbow, I take the former because its easier to add/remove piping and prevents a possible boostleak. Removing/replacing the TB now only requires ONE gasket too. It's just a way of simplifying and increasing reliability and guaranteeing the best performance from your setup (no chance of that gasket failing since it is gone).

 

[turboglenn]

Thanks for all the replies.... I want to put this TB on because i've putn so much effort into restoring it to an almost new condition and I like the simplification as well, but currently i'm ryunning the regular 1g turbo TB with a 2g elbow and as i said my N20, alky nozzle and the haltech IAT sensor are all located in that damn 2g elbow So it's almost easier to leave it off but i think more than anything it's just that i've been on a roll using up the parts i've been collecting to put opn her over the last few years and Just wanted to do it because around here i think every 4g63 is running the 1gTB+2g elbow or a big honkin 75mm unit so it would make miy setup just slightly different, and i like that. Just figuring out where to mount all my goodies is the issue.....


think i'll siot tight and work on other things at the moment and see where it takes me after the fourth, I've still got some aluminum IC pipes to polish and 2 more rims left to paint and clear (had to do them 2 at a time because i could only take 2 with me to swap the tires off of them cause of the vehicle i was driving to get it done, now i don't wanna paint the fronts untill i've got 72 hours to cure them before they are subject to hot brake dust mesin up me clear coat, that craps too pricey to waste a drop of anymore

 

[ramsack]

If it was me, the IAT would be in the intake manifold with the throttle body air having a direct path to hit it. I bought a VPC for my mr2 and that IAT took the place of the cold start injector, which bolted on the bottom of the throttle body, and it sprayed after the throttle plate. I would think that in vacuum the air is a different temperature than before the throttle body. After all, you want measurement of the pressure AND temperature of the air entering the cylinders.

 

[kidtsi]

If it was me, the IAT would be in the intake manifold with the throttle body air having a direct path to hit it. I bought a VPC for my mr2 and that IAT took the place of the cold start injector, which bolted on the bottom of the throttle body, and it sprayed after the throttle plate. I would think that in vacuum the air is a different temperature than before the throttle body. After all, you want measurement of the pressure AND temperature of the air entering the cylinders.

you should place the AIT before the meth nozzle thats why he cant do that.

 

[turboglenn]

If it was me, the IAT would be in the intake manifold with the throttle body air having a direct path to hit it. I bought a VPC for my mr2 and that IAT took the place of the cold start injector, which bolted on the bottom of the throttle body, and it sprayed after the throttle plate. I would think that in vacuum the air is a different temperature than before the throttle body. After all, you want measurement of the pressure AND temperature of the air entering the cylinders.

When i first put the first haltech in my e-cripse, I had my IAT in the MDP hole (after i opened it up and tapped it) on the 2g manifold and just to be clear i'm in the metal fab field so boring holes and cutting threads is something i do daily. And when i went to take the IAT out of the 2g manifold (wass swapping to the 6 bolt ) the IAT actually rboke off in the intake flush and i would have had to drill it out and re-chase the threads if i wanted to put another sensor in it's place. So after that i started finding cheaper and easier things to take off the car to mount anything with a brass pipe thread that's going into aluminum

I've had this same brass on AL scenario happen once more since then with a push lock fitting i put in when i tried running all push lock hoses and realized the one for the rbake booster wasn't going to work , went to remove it and the same damn thing happened.. this one puzzles me but after those 2 incidents i'm leary of pipe threads with a brasss on cast AL fit where the AL is thick

And besides that, the amount of fueling changes you actually make between 90 and 130* F to achieve the same AFR is so minimal on big injectors that the air-temp fueling map is almost nill except at the extreme ends of the spectrum

And, the very last reason that it's not too important to me now days is because running methanol injection anywhere before the IAT was burning up the fast responding open element IAT sensors and i was forced to either change them all the time or go to a close element sensor like a coolant one, and it's okay but not going to make or break my performance by any means, I really only even run one for datalogging and seeing how efficient the IC and water injection is, the coolant temp sensor has more effect on my DD fueling than the air one does but i do like to have it there just because I can and it cannot be configured for any other input or output so might as well run it

damn that got long

EDIT, i took so long ause i got on the phone kidtsi beat me to one of the main points... thanks!

 

[ramsack]

Interesting.

 

[turboglenn]

Interesting.

yea, and i swear it's true... My rule based on these experiences is this "if the end of the threads can't protrude well past the back of the hole or the hole's thickness is more than half the pipe threads length on my car's aluminum cast parts, I won't put it in. And it's gotta be something with either me or the brass or mitsu's alloy for the intake.. cause my water neck is full of pipe thread AN fittings (but they are not brass either) and so is a lot of other parts on the car, and even the intake has some non brass pipe thread piepces in it currently, but seems like once inseted and if too a certain tightness the brass ones don't come back... i can shoot a pic o f the 1g intake with broken off push lock in it right now to show i'm not making it up because it's sitting in my closet right now because it hadn't been on the car a couple of days from being hot tanked before i tried the fitting adn broke it trying to get it back out, and i bored and tapped my own hole for it in the flat spot on the back corner by the factory location and used the OEM spot to mount a vaccuum manifold off of and it cam back out but it was aluminum