Turning up the boost

[clipto]

As well said by everyone i will get dsmlink later, but not what I want my setup to be for my testing phases of my dsm. Lets first start off with is it safe turning up the boost with a street tuned setup of 11:1 a/f done by a well known shop "no names", and is curently set at about 15psi on a 14b and 550cc injectors. How safe would upping it to 18 pounds be on this kind of setup. Supporting mods in my bio any unleft quesions feel free to ask as i am more looking for peoples opinions then faqs. as ive done alot of research but just what you guys think if this would be something to recommend, or feelings of a unsafe setup let me know. Please dont turn this into argument ive read enough threads of it turning to bench racing or people hating on other peoples thoughts of dissliking what someone says. Hopefully a few examples of peoples thoughts might point me in the right direction. As not wanting to setup a logger or run dsmlink at the moment knock is something cant really moniter on a 2g's that easly, as i stated i want to run max out of this setup "as is". So as for a unsafe setup with 18 pounds on a 14b and timing and what not let me know, thanks.

 

[RvlutionMtrsprt]

Without a logger you'd be rolling the dice to turn up the boost. I'd just leave it where it is unless you find a way to log afr, knock, timing etc...

 

[92AWDHX40]

Argue, we dont argue here we have our opinons, turning up boost, as long as your air fuel ratios are safe, and you have a wideband. How safe every car is different as far as how much boost, some cars with mods can, and keep in mind we dont know the condition of your engine, and maintenance. I never used a safc, so cant help you there but the a wideband is a much needed tuning device.

 

[clipto]

Love the forums, just my thoughts on other forums i read about these kind of discussions going sour. Also forgot to note would it change things if I increased the boost such as the the a/f ratio and effect the tune? I mean i know its is about 3psi more but can it be dangerous? Or would it have a small effect.

 

[Calan]

is it safe turning up the boost with a street tuned setup of 11:1 a/f done by a well known shop "no names", and is curently set at about 15psi on a 14b and 550cc injectors?

No...

 

[beendenied]

I'd definitely invest in a logger before upping the boost

But that's my opinion, and probably most others hehe, at least you'll know if she starts knockin on your door.

 

[92AWDHX40]

Take your time get the proper tuning devices and read some forums on tuning, and go from there.

 

[clipto]

Calan, I get why you replied no it's not safe, but after reading i can now rearrange my question. If upping the boost a couple turns on my mbc, and on a safc that tunes fuel by rpm points, does upping the amount of air dramatically change the amount of fuel being used if the 11:1 ratio is what I want will it stay at that ratio or change?

 

[Calan]

is curently set at about 15psi on a 14b and 550cc injectors. How safe would upping it to 18 pounds be on this kind of setup?

does upping the amount of air dramatically change the amount of fuel being used if the 11:1 ratio is what I want will it stay at that ratio or change?

You are asking questions that can't be answered.

The amount of boost you run is completely irrelevant, contrary to what most information on the net would lead you to believe. Your ECU works off of the amount (mass) of air entering the engine to calculate fuel requirements; not the pressure of it. So questions such as "how much boost can I run", or "can I raise boost" have no meaning without a way to equate boost to the actual amount of air entering the engine on your setup, and without a way to see how the ECU is reacting to that amount of airflow.

We could make some educated guesses based on where you are currently and from experience, but that doesn't mean it's safe. There really is no safe way to increase power via tuning unless you are monitoring the AFR, knock, etc...and making adjustments based on how the engine reacts.

You may be able to crank boost up 10 psi and the car will run fantastic. Or you might take it up 3 psi, knock like crazy and damage a piston or lift the head. Personally, I wouldn't want to be the person that says "go ahead, you'll be fine"... and then read a post about your motor blowing a day or two later because you ran out of fuel and leaned out to the crunch point without even monitoring knock. .

So... my answer is a simple "No, it's not safe."

If you want more power, invest in a logger of some type at the very minimum. If you want a really good tune and the ability to do much more than just raise boost, invest in a good tuning solution. Otherwise, enjoy your car the way it is.

 

[beendenied]

Listen to the man, he knows his stuff.

 

[clipto]

Listen to the man, he knows his stuff.

Will do, thanks that was enough opinionated result to keep it where it is till I get dsmlink, I totally understand what he means by no it's not safe without really seeing any kind of log. After seeing alot people use safc on bigger setups assuming they have a way to log it also then what I had, I assumed it would be ok. But blown motor not worth the 3psi.

 

[LiquidX]

Sounds like you have your head on right

I would still highly HIGHLY consider selling the SAFC and just get ECMLink. You'll be much happier and well, it's a tuner and logger in one. You will have more control over everything.

Here is some more backing to why you need a logger. I'm using a Holset HX40 at 15 lbs (roughly 30-35lb/min if I'm looking at a good log) I'm still seeing knock with conservative timing and fuel. I have no idea why but it's just a strong reason why you need to moniter your engine when you make changes. You cannot just base off of the AFR and because it's withing x:1 everything is fine.

Again, it sounds like you know what to do

 

[jrohner]

It sounds like you think that the only thing that matters in a tune is AFR. Have you not heard of a thing called ignition timing? Do you have any understanding of how that relates to knock and cylinder pressure?

 

[bertrenolds]

You could probably find a pocket logger for under $100 now days so why not get one. And instead of wasting your money on a SAFC II you should have gotten dsmlink in the first place. Until you can see knock, A/F ratio, and rpm like you can in dsmlink then I would leave it. If you get a pocket logger you can see knock but it obviously is not as easy to fine tune with as DSMlink.

 

[clipto]

Yea if i could find a pocket logger to work for my car that would be great, and the safc was free so its a win win. I know a little about timing how u can add/remove timing to get rid of knock if i am correct, and that timing has alot to do with a tune. Seeing alot of people run safc with bigger setups then me i tend to wonder how they are running ok. I have read people running 20 psi on a 14b with safc but with race gas, would running race gas help the issue where its "safer" to turn up the boost a few pounds and just run safc and be more safe from knock? I do understand dsmlink is the way but i know many people have run this setup before and i mostly doing it for testing purposes, but dont want to do it if not all that lenient.

 

[LiquidX]

I have read people running 20 psi on a 14b with safc but with race gas, would running race gas help the issue where its "safer" to turn up the boost a few pounds and just run safc and be more safe from knock? I do understand dsmlink is the way but i know many people have run this setup before and i mostly doing it for testing purposes, but dont want to do it if not all that lenient.

Race gas has a higher octane rating which prevents it from detonating as easily. You can push the motor harder tune wise before you would see the effects that a lower octane fuel would get at a lower tune.

Just having a harder burning fuel can allow a few more airflow into the motor safely and can also advance timing more to gain more out of it. It will still succumb to knock if pushed hard enough.

SAFC was a great tuning device years ago, it's pretty out dated now with much better options. It'll do what you need it to do for now, but I would still get ECMLink or another equal/better tuning device.

Also note that those other people that are running an SAFC are still using a logger. Even with race gas, you still need to monitor what's happening. Just a hair too lean and you could be knocking more than you wish.

 

[clipto]

I hear what your saying liquid, i guess im just a little late on the scene. I just always wanted to try these setups but i guess in a mind set matter i should just get the link and do it the easy(safe) way. Even still getting the 14b how it is now runs amazing i know its not the fastest setup, but it feels real good for what it is. My test was to max this 14b out and see how much whp i can get out of it, but the more i try with this setup, the more trouble it seems to be.

 

[LiquidX]

If you want to use it, use it. Just be sure to get yourself a logger. You won't be able to do anything close to what link will do but it can give you a basic rough tune.

Also, since you have a 95, check your ECU to see if you already have an EPROM or not.

 

[clipto]

First thing i checked was eprom and yes it is. Is there a logger that will work for my car i know 95 dsm and there wacky ob2 setup alot of loggers wont work besides link. But are there any suggestions on a basic pocket logger i can use. Yes i know link is the easy way out but if there is something i just wanna see what this puppy will do on such basic tools.