Tuning FIC Blue Max 1650cc injectors with AEM

[my1997gsx]

So I have been doing allot of reading on running AEM EMS with 1600cc injectors and finding that allot of people are running injector driver boxes to get them to work correctly. However it seems like some people have been having really good results with the FIC blue max 1650cc injectors and not needing an injector driver box. So my question is if I where to get FIC blue max 1650cc injectors should I run a driver box and if so which one would be recommended?

 

[black_gst]

maybe these guys can help out... and they sell fic's
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/ven...el-sale-injectors-pumps-fuel-return-kits.html

 

[1fastlaser]

So I have been doing allot of reading on running AEM EMS with 1600cc injectors and finding that allot of people are running injector driver boxes to get them to work correctly. However it seems like some people have been having really good results with the FIC blue max 1650cc injectors and not needing an injector driver box. So my question is if I where to get FIC blue max 1650cc injectors should I run a driver box and if so which one would be recommended?

Im not running a injector driver box with my bluemax 1550cc injectors. It runs perfect. You just gotta dial in the injectors good.

The injector driver box was ment for running injecters aka bosch 1600s which are 5ohms. Some guys have idle and part throttle problems with them so thats why they put on the driver boxes. Blue max injectors were created to virtually eliminate that problem.

 

[awdwhip]

Im not running a injector driver box with my bluemax 1550cc injectors. It runs perfect. You just gotta dial in the injectors good.

The injector driver box was meant for running injectors aka Bosch 1600s which are 5ohms. Some guys have idle and part throttle problems with them so that's why they put on the driver boxes. Blue max injectors were created to virtually eliminate that problem.

Oh the irony!

 

[my1997gsx]

Im not running a injector driver box with my bluemax 1550cc injectors. It runs perfect. You just gotta dial in the injectors good.

The injector driver box was ment for running injecters aka bosch 1600s which are 5ohms. Some guys have idle and part throttle problems with them so thats why they put on the driver boxes. Blue max injectors were created to virtually eliminate that problem.

Thanks that was very helpful!!!

 

[Slippi84]

This problem seems to be only with the 1650 bluemax injectors or bigger though Steve. I have heard a couple guys say they have problems with the bigger ones on the link forums. I plan on running 1650 bluemax's or bigger for my goals and I am very curious how some are not having any problems and some are.

 

[bigf4]

Its all about how you tune them. Especially on AEM

side note: I have Brand New 1650 bluemax injectors for sale!

 

[1fastlaser]

This problem seems to be only with the 1650 bluemax injectors or bigger though Steve. I have heard a couple guys say they have problems with the bigger ones on the link forums. I plan on running 1650 bluemax's or bigger for my goals and I am very curious how some are not having any problems and some are.

Im running 1550s...I highly doubt 100 more cc's of fuel is gonna make a night and day difference, considering I bump the fp up to around what the injectors would flow 1600, and it is still perfectly fine. The thing that sets these apart is the ohm rating being 2.2 ohms rather then the bosch 5 ohms which is what the injector box is useful for, even though it sometimes dosent make it that much better.

It also has to do with the injector style. Blue maxs are ball and seat vs pintles like the boschs which has a pretty bad spray pattern at idle/part throttle.

 

[Slippi84]

Im running 1550s...I highly doubt 100 more cc's of fuel is gonna make a night and day difference, considering I bump the fp up to around what the injectors would flow 1600, and it is still perfectly fine. The thing that sets these apart is the ohm rating being 2.2 ohms rather then the bosch 5 ohms which is what the injector box is useful for, even though it sometimes dosent make it that much better.

It also has to do with the injector style. Blue maxs are ball and seat vs pintles like the boschs which has a pretty bad spray pattern at idle/part throttle.

It must because even on the site it says 1650cc injectors don't need a driver box and 1750cc and bigger do.

 

[Savage Talon]

It could be done, but the AEM injector driver box is not that much money. I use the driver box because I wanted better control of the injectors which makes it easier to tune. It's just a better way to do things plus if I want to run a dual injector setup in the future it's a piece of cake to do so. My tuner told me the stock Mitsu ecu injector driver is better then what comes inside the aem ems. So Link should have a easier time with them then the ems alone would.

 

[slowgsr]

the aem box is overpriced, read the aem forums, lots of guys have issues with it. Go with the FJO driver, its much cheaper and much more reliable than the AEM one.

On a daily driver, or any car that gets driven on the street a lot, just use a driver with larger injectors unless your on E85, it just makes things easier and its not that much money. However, sure you can run 1600's without one.

 

[Steve93Talon]

The thing that sets these apart is the ohm rating being 2.2 ohms rather then the bosch 5 ohms which is what the injector box is useful for, even though it sometimes dosent make it that much better.

That's actually backwards. A proper peak/hold injector box design is meant to work with injectors that are around 3 ohms or less. Here's an e-mail from Jean at JBPerformance, who makes a DIY driver box explaining further:

Steve,

You're correct that you will need to remove the resistor pack. One thing to check though is the peak and hold currents needed by the injectors. This is related to the resistance and I couldn't see what the value is for those injectors. The p&h board is designed to provide 4A peak current and 1A hold current which requires an injector with a resistance below about 3 Ohms. Some of the big injectors have a resistance of between 4 and 6 Ohms and require a 2.5A peak current and a 1A hold current.

Please check the resistance of your injectors. If they are designed for 2.5A/1A then the board will still work but won't be doing the true peak/hold but will instead apply full battery voltage for about 3.9ms then will go to a 1A hold current. This will still run the injectors (and better than a resistor pack) and won't hurt them but you'll have more current going through them than needed.

If your injectors have a 3Ohm or lower resistance or you know they require a 4A/1A peak hold current then this is the best situation and the board will work perfectly as intended.

Cheers,
Jean

So according to this, the FIC Blue Max should work better with a P/H driver than the old style Bosches. We've got one of these drivers on order, we're hoping it makes the car driveable on the 1650s and stock ECU (V3).

 

[awdwhip]

That's actually backwards. A proper peak/hold injector box design is meant to work with injectors that are around 3 ohms or less. Here's an e-mail from Jean at JBPerformance, who makes a DIY driver box explaining further:



So according to this, the FIC Blue Max should work better with a P/H driver than the old style Bosches. We've got one of these drivers on order, we're hoping it makes the car driveable on the 1650s and stock ECU (V3).

Steve, are you going to buy the drvr box that FIC made or are you going with the DIY box?

 

[Steve93Talon]

I've got the DIY peak/hold box on order, should be here any day. The FIC box isn't even anything I'd call a driver box. It's only 3 wires - power in, power out, and ground. It intercepts the 12v feed to the stock resistor pack and manipulates voltage. So essentially all they're doing is shifting the deadtime curve slightly. Will this work? Seems to help some people, I wouldn't trust that it'd help everyone though. Is it the right way? Not in my opinion. They're called peak/hold injectors for a reason, I'd feel much better driving them with a proper peak/hold driver than the stock saturated driver with a resistor.

 

[1fastlaser]

That's actually backwards. A proper peak/hold injector box design is meant to work with injectors that are around 3 ohms or less. Here's an e-mail from Jean at JBPerformance, who makes a DIY driver box explaining further:



So according to this, the FIC Blue Max should work better with a P/H driver than the old style Bosches. We've got one of these drivers on order, we're hoping it makes the car driveable on the 1650s and stock ECU (V3).

Another hear say has been erased....good info.

 

[awdwhip]

I've got the DIY peak/hold box on order, should be here any day. The FIC box isn't even anything I'd call a driver box. It's only 3 wires - power in, power out, and ground. It intercepts the 12v feed to the stock resistor pack and manipulates voltage. So essentially all they're doing is shifting the deadtime curve slightly. Will this work? Seems to help some people, I wouldn't trust that it'd help everyone though. Is it the right way? Not in my opinion. They're called peak/hold injectors for a reason, I'd feel much better driving them with a proper peak/hold driver than the stock saturated driver with a resistor.

Good to know, I've been following this thread on Link too so I'm anxiously waiting on your results.

 

[my1997gsx]

Thanks for all the great input guys it help greatly!!

 

[Steve93Talon]

Good to know, I've been following this thread on Link too so I'm anxiously waiting on your results.

I received the DIY kit today and I've got all the components soldered on, just have to mount it in the case and finish it up. The car is an hour away though, so I may not be able to test it out until the weekend. Anyone planning to try this, make sure you have a soldering pencil with a very thin tip and some thin gauge solder. Variable heat will also help.