Trying to compile my parts list for build

[Colossus]

I've decided to go ahead with building a race motor for my GSX. But, I'm not to sure as to which parts I need. No, this isn't some newbie question about "which parts do I need for 324987whp", but more of a, I can't decide and need some more general knowledge of the parts before I select parts. Sure, my goal is around 600 whp on race gas, and nitrous.

So far, I've compiled this list:

AGP t3/t4 Turbo Kit - But maybe an FP Green or something....not to sure.

Ross 1g .020 over 8.5:1 pistons with rings and pins
Eagle Connecting Rods
HKS 272 Exhaust Cam Shaft
HKS 272 Intake Cam Shaft
HKS Adjustable Cam Gear (2)
1G Unorthodox SS Kit (crank, alt, water pump)
ARP Head Studs
ARP Main Studs
SI Dual Valve Springs and Manly Titanium Rainters
Balance Shaft Eliminator Kit
ARP Rod Bolts
Greddy Type-S Blow Off Valve
Mitsu multi-layer head gasket


It's already got an Extreme PSI FMIC, walboro 255lph, Apex'i S-AFC and TT. It also has a Big 16G, but eh, it's not gonna get me where I want. I'm gonna buy a motor out of a FWD TSI at a local yard, strip it down, and build it, then do the swap over a weekend after it's built. 3" RNR TurboBack exhaust is also there, no o2 eliminator. Ported manifold, and stock 02 housing. 550cc RC Injectors.

I'm trying to determine what other parts I'm gonna end up looking for. I'll probably run at the track exhaust-less, just port out the o2 really heavily and jus let it dump there. I'm not sure what the advantage of a stroker would be, but I was told to look for a 2.3L or so stroker, and build with that. I'll either heavily port and plumb a stock intake manifold for direct port, or look at a decent intake manifold already pre-plumbed. Head work is gonna involve the valves and such I mentioned above, as well as a good port and polish.

Any suggestions please be kind enough to leave a reply. Also, this is a serious post....Motor's already been purchased.

 

[Colossus]

53 views, no comments?

 

[SoSprayMe]

Hullo buddy I know you're not trying to be a newbie by asking a "which parts do I need for 324987whp" sort of question. But a person looking to get 600whp out of a DSM will have to know enough about the motor and relative parts to not have to ask that question. My honest suggest is to pick up a book by Hugh McInness(check the spelling) on Turbocharging, and another book by Alexander Graham Bell(really) called Forced Induction Performance Tuning it is about 600 pages of total reading but you will be a more learned turbo tuner. I made the same suggestion to a friend of mine and he's move onto asking newbie questions to asking questions that I have to think about to answer. By the list you have in your initial post it looks like you're a Slowboy/AGP fan. I am a SBR Block/Head fan and AGP turbos are serious. Best of luck.

Good day,

 

[dsmturboawd]

corky bell has a book also.

why are you giong to run a green on a built motor? :laugh:

 

[gritsak]

if you are shooting for that much HP dont bother trying to port and plumb the stock mani...just get an aftermarket (magnus, BJ's, forrester..not sure which ones offer DP setups)

also remember the stock tranny isnt gonna take that much power

add a good clutch and maybe a scatter shield

decide on if you are gonna stroke it before you choose your turbo. and why even think about a green with that setup? ide go with a FP 3065 or a full garrett (big t3 or smaller t4)

 

[Colossus]

yeah. I kinda decided to lower the overall expectation to somewhere around 500whp started looken around and figured 600 was a bit out of my range compared to some of the other cars I've seen. Not to many with 600, but quite a few more with 5.

My tranny is a sheperd rebuilt one, and I've got an unused ACT 2600 clutch that was going in my TSI before someone rearended it doing 40.

I'll have to go by barnes and nobles and check up on those books, I haven't heard of them before. But hey, if it's good reading .

I'm not to sure why I chose a green, . I thought I typed fp3052? Maybe it was me haven a crossing train of thought or something while I Was typen. But yeah, I was looken at an fp3052, or go the extra 100ish and grab a 3062. So, in the end, I'll prolly end up with a 3062. I started looken at the FP turbo's since I had spoken to a few people about them Vs t3/t4's, and they all agreed to go with something a bit bigger, and the fp3062 is what they recommended.

Turbo's is something I've had a hard time working with. I understand how they work, how to build one, etc. etc. It's just the fact that there are so many out there, with so many different names, it's hard to keep them in order of biggest to smallest, and which flows the least and the most. I'm getting there though!

The stroker is pretty exspensive, so I'm not to sure which direction I'll be going. Of course when you're building a tough motor, money shouldn't be a problem, but when you think about it, it does come down to quite a bit to go the stroker route Vs knife-edged and lightened. I was also told that haven a lightened flywheel and a lightened/knife edged crank, I'd end up with a pretty tought time getten it to idle well and to drive as a daily driver.

I haven't purchased any parts yet, I'm still trying to get a price of the damn junkyard. These people can't do shit for ya anymore in my area...

What size stroker would you guys recommended? 2.2? 2.3? I found a 2.2L on DSS, but I haven't crossed anywhere with a 2.3L kit yet.

 

[SoSprayMe]

Slowboy Racing has a 2.4L stroker but I dont think its necessary. Im a fan of twin-entry turbo technology. But finding a twin-exit manifold and twin-entry turbine housing is tough for DSMs.... There's always spray.

Those books are damn good reading, especially the Forced Induction Performance Tuning one, 475 or so pages but butt loads of information.

Good luck,

 

[1gTURD]

Originally posted by SoSprayMe

Those books are damn good reading, especially the Forced Induction Performance Tuning one, 475 or so pages but butt loads of information.

Good luck,

464 pages with the index to be exact!!



anyways if your building your own motor be prepared to pay a machine shop alot of money if you want it done right.

bored, and allign hone (to run the rod bolts)
tumbled
tanked
decked
all kinds of cleaning .
other stuff

buschur race shortblocks or sbr blocks are a good way to start... already balanced and blueprinted not that much price wise either... between 2000-3000 dollars not to mention they are already very expierienced with 4g63's obviously. Can you say the same for "Joe Schmoe's machine shop" up the street? What im trying to say is, i know of a few local machine shops around my way that have been known to mess up a thing or 2 or shortcut a thing or 2 wether its a 302 ford roller v8 or a 4g63.
Good Luck and read up all you can before you even buy spark plugs for your project... it WILL help

 

[dsmturboawd]

Originally posted by Colossus
I'm not to sure why I chose a green, . I thought I typed fp3052? Maybe it was me haven a crossing train of thought or something while I Was typen. But yeah, I was looken at an fp3052, or go the extra 100ish and grab a 3062. So, in the end, I'll prolly end up with a 3062. I started looken at the FP turbo's since I had spoken to a few people about them Vs t3/t4's, and they all agreed to go with something a bit bigger, and the fp3062 is what they recommended.

no such thing as a 3062.

you need to research turbos alot. 3052 or a green would be silly on a built motor.

 

[SoSprayMe]

Originally posted by dsmturboawd
no such thing as a 3062.

you need to research turbos alot. 3052 or a green would be silly on a built motor.

Not true. If its a properly BUILT 95piston/1G "Big Rod" build would be complimented nicely by a Green/Red/52. And an FP3052 is a respectable turbo.

 

[dsmturboawd]

i didnt know stock rods and pistons equaled a BUILT motor.

Green/Red/52

i love how you put green, red, and 52 in the same catergory.

 

[SoSprayMe]

Originally posted by dsmturboawd
i didnt know stock rods and pistons equaled a BUILT motor.



i love how you put green, red, and 52 in the same catergory.

Are you saying it's not? A bored, tanked, and decked block with stronger then stock pistons and rods certainly is a built motor. No where did I say it was a 900whp capable motor, but it is built none the less.

I am glad I could amuse you with my Green/Red/52 comment. Each of the three turbos are extremely capable turbos. A Green can put down 11.20s all day. A Red can blast an occasional mid 10, but it can also put down a high 12. With an exception of the gutted full blown Pruven race car that ran a 9, the Green isn't a far cry from the Red. And I don't care to read up your take on the FP3052, I know it is a sick turbo. It can put down over 600hp which is very impressive. So thanks again for remaining a fan.

Regards,

 

[spoolinawddsm]

Originally posted by SoSprayMe
Are you saying it's not? A bored, tanked, and decked block with stronger then stock pistons and rods certainly is a built motor. No where did I say it was a 900whp capable motor, but it is built none the less.

I am glad I could amuse you with my Green/Red/52 comment. Each of the three turbos are extremely capable turbos. A Green can put down 11.20s all day. A Red can blast an occasional mid 10, but it can also put down a high 12. With an exception of the gutted full blown Pruven race car that ran a 9, the Green isn't a far cry from the Red. And I don't care to read up your take on the FP3052, I know it is a sick turbo. It can put down over 600hp which is very impressive. So thanks again for remaining a fan.

Regards,

since when did a bored, tanked, and decked block mean it was built?

correct, stronger pistons and rods qualify it as a built motor. however, you are referring to stock 95 pistons and stock 1g rods. that is not "built". are you confused as to what a built motor actually is?

the turbos are capable of impressive #'s but they are by no means the same. a red isnt really comparable to a green or a 3052. perhaps you could expain to us how it is.

 

[SoSprayMe]

Originally posted by spoolinawddsm
since when did a bored, tanked, and decked block mean it was built?

correct, stronger pistons and rods qualify it as a built motor. however, you are referring to stock 95 pistons and stock 1g rods. that is not "built". are you confused as to what a built motor actually is?

the turbos are capable of impressive #'s but they are by no means the same. a red isnt really comparable to a green or a 3052. perhaps you could expain to us how it is.

Thanks. Never said they were the same, what I said was they weren't too far from each other. As for why I say this, re-read my previous post and you will see why. And as far as the built motor, I don't like repeating myself. But I will do it this once.

If I take a block have it bored(not for displacement), tanked, and decked then I put in stronger then stock pistons and stronger then stock rods you now have a stronger then stock block. Do you not? No where did I say it was a 900whp capable motor, but it is built none the less.

Thanks,

 

[dsmturboawd]

If I take a block have it bored(not for displacement), tanked, and decked then I put in stronger then stock pistons and stronger then stock rods you now have a stronger then stock block. Do you not? No where did I say it was a 900whp capable motor, but it is built none the less.

you clearly said that a motor with 1g rods and 95 pistons was a built motor.

 

[1gTURD]

anything other than stock ... to me... is considered "built" as in "built for higher hp #'s than stock". Each person may have a different idea on what "built" means. For instance people put "vented to atmosphere" as a mod on their "mod list" or better yet "future mods". to me these dont pertain to "mods" just the same as maybe either of you two clowns consider a 1g/2g piston motor not "built"

by raising the compression (2g pistons) and using 1g rods that back up a descent amount of power you are building a motor for a higher hp application. And we disagree why and how?? Granted its not much but the 1st "stage" in dsm motor building nonetheless. Even tho they are both stock parts it means nothing. When people put together (aka build) a turbo kit on a honda from scratch and they use a garrett t3 turbo that comes stock on a ford does this mean this kit isnt built because it came stock on a ford?? Also i consider almost any kind of machine work a type of building too it cost money and its done to support power and / or true up surfaces for re-BUILDING a motor. is machining 1g rods to fit 2g pistons an OEM engine rebuilding operation?? No, its not. Also I would like to hear your idea of a "built motor" dsmturboawd and spoolinawddsm. Just out of curiosity.

 

[1gTURD]

also i would like to hear everyones idea of these two :

1.) engine BUILDING
2.) engine ASSEMBLING

it seems there far too many #2's out there to me... any thoughts or flames against me?

Thanks in advance
Dante

 

[dsmturboawd]

generally, if you have aftermarket rods and pistons in your motor, you refer to it as "built".

a motor with stock 1g rods and stock 95 pistons is a reassembled motor. there is nothing "built" about it.

 

[1gTURD]

Originally posted by dsmturboawd
generally, if you have aftermarket rods and pistons in your motor, you refer to it as "built".

a motor with stock 1g rods and stock 95 pistons is a reassembled motor. there is nothing "built" about it.

as for your first statement yes, i see it as built. Built for not much power and as far as i am concerned 2 g pistons on 1g rods arent worth 2 shlts and a handshake. But its built. There is an idea behind building a 1g/95 piston motor. The idea is to support or make more power than that of a stock engine. You are thereby BUILDING a motor to support more power than stock. I am not a fan of the 2g and 1g rod mix having ruined one of those already. I find the crower/ross setup much more supportable to the bottle and 60 trim feeding them.

QUOTE]Originally posted by dsmturboawd
generally, if you have aftermarket rods and pistons in your motor, you refer to it as "built".
[/QUOTE]

so what you are saying is nothing is "built" unless it has the name of some fancy aftermarket manufacturer stamped on the side of it???
I disagree. Is my intercooler piping setup not built because its welded 2 3/4 aluminum rather than some junk 2 1/4 inch piping with "dejon" stamped on the side?

Originally posted by dsmturboawd


a motor with stock 1g rods and stock 95 pistons is a reassembled motor. there is nothing "built" about it.

exactly how can you "REassemble" a motor with parts that dont come together from the factory?? theres nothing "re" about it.

Please reply as I am very confused.

Thanks ahead of time

 

[dsmturboawd]

There is an idea behind building a 1g/95 piston motor.......

....You are thereby BUILDING a motor to support more power than stock.

strength is in the rods, thats why im putting a motor with the 1g 2g combo in the same boat as a stock motor.

i guess there's too many variables though, you just gotta look at each motor and decide for yourself if its a built motor or whatnot.

last i checked, 1g rods and 2g pistons came from the factory. i just feel that if you modify stock parts of a motor and put them back in, that doesnt qualify it as being built. thats all.

this is a dumb argument on personal opinons.

 

[SoSprayMe]

Originally posted by dsmturboawd
strength is in the rods, thats why im putting a motor with the 1g 2g combo in the same boat as a stock motor.

i guess there's too many variables though, you just gotta look at each motor and decide for yourself if its a built motor or whatnot.

last i checked, 1g rods and 2g pistons came from the factory. i just feel that if you modify stock parts of a motor and put them back in, that doesnt qualify it as being built. thats all.

this is a dumb argument on personal opinons.

We finaly agree on something. This is a rediculous argument. I don't understand why a person who is willing to spend 1200$ for a turbo would settle for a Green when you can get an FP3052 or 3065. Not my car so I guess not my problem.

Best of luck on your car,

 

[1gTURD]

Originally posted by dsmturboawd


this is a dumb argument on personal opinons.

we agree!!! Im through with this... It helps no one and takes up space.

To each, his/her own!

 

[Tevenor]

I am glad everyone is hunky dory now. I am glad everyone had their little say and we clarified everything. Now can we get back to topic before I have to close the thread?

 

[GeneralChaos]

dang that got out of hand.

anyway man im kinda in the same situation as you if you seen my other thread.

hoping for 500hp, just trying to make sure I dont buy stuff I dont need. gets confusing.

 

[boostmaster123]

There are also other things to think about on a 500+hp motor besides turbo selection. Tuning is probably one of the most important if not THE most important and its probably not a good idea to use that AFC you got..i would think about maybe an AEM EMS or some kind of standalone.

just my .02

P.S. good luck with the project and i hope it works out