Timing marks way off, but runs/pulls ok

[TSIturbo91]

Ok, well while doing a preliminary check of the timing belt and after reading many threads on timing I noticed my cam gears are off. Took a picture to let it say a thousand words. It starts and runs. Bought it from a back yard mechanic and have been fixing his work ever since. Now I am wondering if it could be for the intake side and someone just made it work.

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Also has anyone ever seen this with a timing belt?

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[Lofty]

Parts dino is good stuff.

Make sure to go all oem on timing components and get a new waterpump. I don't go OEM with my waterpumps, and never really have an issue, as long as you buy it from like extremepsi or partsdino and it's a topline.

You should be okay with most gaskets as long as it's not a cork oil pan gasket



Check the gear clearances in the oil pump with feeler gauges. It tells you the clearances somewhere. (My haynes) It's really just two gears. If you do end up doing balance shaft elimination make sure to properly block of the oil feed holes on the block with new bearings and properly time everything following the vfaq!!!

Hand rotate it over when you are done just to be safe!

 

[TSIturbo91]

Thank you for the tip on the cork gasket Lofty. My kit from partsdino came with a cork one and I was thinking I would be better off with the Loctite RTV than the cork. I will be sure to check the specs on the oil pump.

 

[pauleyman]

Next time don't remove the 4 bolts and the crank bolt all at the same time. Remove the 4 bolts, remove the balancer then remove the crank bolt. You probably won't have an issue with the balancer and the sprocket being stuck together. I'm amazed anything under that cover lasted as long as it has. If I recall correctly that balance belt tensioner won't even spin when installed like that. You have alot of work to do. I cruised through the posts, did anybody mention to check the oil pan bolts concerning that groove in the main belt?

 

[awdjosh]

Jeeze...I literally 'd at the first pic and question and thought to self...(both dowels are up???). Then the post of the block....that is the dirtiest 4g I've ever seen, you need to just pull it out and eliminate this BS and replace oil pump, water pump, all pulleys and tensioner. Crap I'd just take it apart and do a full stock rebuild with fresh rings and bearings and let the machine shop clean and hot tank everything. A full rebuild at my pro builder would be around 1100 including all new timing crap.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Yea, I saved this car from a back yard mechanic that had it. If I knew his skills were the reason he work out of the back yard I could have passed it up. But now that I have it it get all the TLC I can spare. I will be degreasing it and continuing work. Also will be getting a block to build a new motor for a drop in to reduce down time. But for now I just need my car back ### the girlfriend wants hers back.

Thank you for the tip on the crank pulley. That was the part that had me at a stand still for a while.

 

[DSSA]

Just a note, but that Timing Belt Tensioner either was changed way back in pre-1995, or is the original that came with the car.

 

[TSIturbo91]

I just want to make sure this won't cause a problem. If I degrease the timing side and spray it down to clean it up it should not cause any issues right? I don't have a steamer yet so I was hoping this would be fine.

 

[XiKeiyaZI]

Nope. Just cover anything you think you could damage.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Ok, it's been a while but I haven't had the time to get into my garage and lacked money due to some other issues. But I have to move and my car needs to come with me. Right now its torn all the way down for the timing job. I'm a few replacement parts away but need to get it as close to done as I can.

So to speed this up, can I just cut the balance shaft a few times to get it out? I know I'll have to be careful not to get metal debris in the oil and coolant areas. I'm just not sure if someone knows a reason it shouldn't be done.

 

[NOSLO2PT0]

Cutting the balance shaft belt doesn't hurt anything. Just eliminates the front shaft from turning. Basically turns it into dead weight.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Cutting the balance shaft belt doesn't hurt anything. Just eliminates the front shaft from turning. Basically turns it into dead weight.

I'm planning on the BS delete. I have new OEM bearings but I'm really short on time and figure if I don't have to lower my motor I could speed things up. Belt was in a wad and half shredded at bottom of timing case. I have heard once of someone cutting the shaft a couple times but that doesn't mean it's a good idea. Thought I'd do my homework on it but couldn't find the same thread.

 

[Colt4G63 also]

You're still going to need to have a straight shot at the opening to get the bearing installer tool to slide into the block, so it seems like it would be faster to just lower the block and pull the shaft in one piece.

That way you will also eliminate the risk of putting metal shavings into your engine.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Good deal, thanks for the input. I would have hated to go through all the trouble of what I thought would save me time only to have to do it the right way.

 

[Red 2g GSX]

Dude, clean up your engine / bay!

This kind of neglect is why DSM's have such a bad rep for being unreliable

 

[TSIturbo91]

Dude, I saved this car from the guy that gives them bad reps. He put the water pump in and did the timing belt before I got it. But put the oil pan bolts back in wrong, didn't gasket the pump right, didn't change the hydraulic tensioner, put pulleys in backwards and when I got near 10,000 miles this is what I had waiting for me. The car ran fine. Slight idle surge in the cold but otherwise my biggest problem was transfer case and blow-by.

I opened this up and was pissed I bought it from a d-bag that didn't know what he was doing and clearly didn't take pride in his work. He's got a rep as a good mechanic and nice guy. Seeing his work I know why he would finish last.(Bahahaha) I had no reason to expect this mess though. And I'm a master detailer of 12 years. I've detailed SRT-10's a Mercedes Benz CL 55 and even a GT 40, so this is more embarrassing for me than you can imagine. By the way I didn't post this in a clean engine bay thread because I know it's a mess. When I get a new steamer this will look much different. But I went and got a 2 year degree for HVAC and cash has been in short supply just finishing school and being a new father and what not. So thanks for the 2 cents.

 

[Colt4G63 also]

Good deal, thanks for the input. I would have hated to go through all the trouble of what I thought would save me time only to have to do it the right way.

This is the tool for pressing/driving the BS bearings into the block:

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As you can see it's pretty long; you need to have a straight shot into the bores.

Ps. If you have to go looking for one to rent, it's most commonly known as a cam bearing installation tool.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Once again thank you. Its nice to get helpful tips such as that. Will probably rent one due to my tight budget. I have to move out of the place I've been renting very soon so I'm feeling very rushed on this.

 

[Red 2g GSX]

I opened this up and was pissed I bought it from a d-bag that didn't know what he was doing and clearly didn't take pride in his work..

Good, glad your aware.

But yes, there are two (maybe three I can't remember) short oil pan bolts that MUST go into the front case.

Good luck!

 

[bryanwheat]

I noticed some talk of an oil pan gasket earlier in the thread. Do yourself a favor and throw it in the trash. These engines were designed to use no gasket. If you look at the rails on the pan you will see why. They have a recessed line all the way around to hold the rtv. If it used a gasket the area would be raised to dig into the gasket. A bead of permatex ultra grey rtv will seal it the correct way if you do it correctly.

 

[TSIturbo91]

I noticed some talk of an oil pan gasket earlier in the thread. Do yourself a favor and throw it in the trash. These engines were designed to use no gasket. If you look at the rails on the pan you will see why. They have a recessed line all the way around to hold the rtv. If it used a gasket the area would be raised to dig into the gasket. A bead of permatex ultra grey rtv will seal it the correct way if you do it correctly.

I plan on using the aviation approved RTV i have. Never had a leak with it. But being that it resist jet fuel I would expect it to.

 

[bryanwheat]

Sounds like it should work good. Something that i always reccomend is having both surfaces as clean as possible. I run a scraper on both, than take a razor blade and clean the groove in the pan. From there wipe both surfaces with acetone until the rag is clean after wiping. From there apply a bead or rtv, install and torque the bolt. You don't want to let it sit and skin over or else the rtv won't contour to the other mating surface.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Just picked up a steam cleaner. My father and I got to chatting and he helped me afford the one I was trying to get when I got my tax refund. Back in business! Spent over an hour with break cleaner and rags and was just making a fire hazard and push crap around. Hate not having the right tool. Knife to a gun fight.

Steam cleaner did a better job then I thought. A before and after shot.