Timing marks way off, but runs/pulls ok

[TSIturbo91]

Ok, well while doing a preliminary check of the timing belt and after reading many threads on timing I noticed my cam gears are off. Took a picture to let it say a thousand words. It starts and runs. Bought it from a back yard mechanic and have been fixing his work ever since. Now I am wondering if it could be for the intake side and someone just made it work.

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Also has anyone ever seen this with a timing belt?

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[danielbo91]

Hey that belt needs to be change already is about to snap on you i would change all the timing conponents.. water pump,tensionier pulley, idler pulley,haudralic tensioner, balance shaft belt and balance shaft tensionier pulley. The reason you timing is off is because your haudralic tensionier is bad..

 

[Justin_l_]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say oil pan bolt. There is one short one you need to put in the correct spot or that happens.

As for timing being off, recently my timing jumped 3 teeth, and still ran and pulled good, but kept getting knock via link. Started troubleshooting and found CAS cranked all the way one way and then timing marks off.

Either way I would replace you timing components and check your oil pan bolts.

 

[NOSLO2PT0]

There are two sets of timing marks on the cam gears. When the engine is at TDC, they are both at 3o'clock and 9o'clock. Your timing "appears" to be ok, but without putting the engine at TDC and seeing where the timing marks are, there is no way to tell. Plus, that belt looks awfully loose.

 

[DSM1G90]

Dowel pins aren't at the 12:00 position and how can you say that it's way out of time?

The EXH mark that has the pointer on it is NOT to be used in the timing since the mark almost 180* from it is what you want. the INT mark is one of the marks needed with th dowel pin straight up.

Get those dowel marks at the top, match up the two inner marks on each sprocket then report back on how the timing alignment on all pulley marks are.

That chewed up section on the belt is caused by a screw end poking into the belt somewhere. Better find that screw and get it retracted so the next belt doesn't get all chewed up like that.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Well First off thanks for the quick response. Just an update, I have not had the time to get into the shop and work but I did take a min to crank it over a bit till the dowels were at 12 o'clock, and was unaware the the cam gears had a notch at both sides. Q: how bad is it to accidentally turn the timing belt the wrong direction? It was only till the marks lined up. But I saw in the hayns manual to not do that. I figure it's more for the sake of the belt and timing but thought I'd ask. I will be getting a timing component kit from JNZ Tuning I just had a son about a month and a half ago, so I must save up for it. And while I love my car, my son comes first, then the car.

when I get the parts and chance to make progress I will repost. Thanks all

 

[99 gst spyder]

TDC the motor. Verify in vfaq.com. You'll have to get TDC inorder to know exactly where the teeth's lines up, not only that, the dowel pins, crank sprocket, and oil sprocket also should be align.

 

[XiKeiyaZI]

Those gears are in time... there are 2 (two) timing notches per cam gear.... align the engine so that the cam gear dowels are at the 12:00 position and then check the notches. You'll see that there are, indeed, two notches that will be close to each other at the inside of the cam gears. Never go by the outside.

As for that belt - the wrong oil pan bolt was put in. You need to remove it (usually just below and to the right of the crank t-belt teeth) and put a shorter one in.

 

[95TalonOwner]

All of the timing marks only line up every 6 revolutions of the crankshaft, you have not rotated it enough yet.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Ok well I have ordered a BSE kit from STM and a lower gasket kit as well as a OEM timing belt, OEM pulleys, and OEM hydraulic tensioner. Also when pulling the crank pulley off it is hitting the unibody/frame. Even with the top motor mount off and lowering it as far as it could be. Now this time I am doing a BSE but next T-belt job I'd like to be able to get that pulley off easier. I removed the 4 bolt and the big one in the middle. Also it is not stuck on the sprocket thanks to some love taps with a dead blow rubber mallet. Thanks for all the help guys.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Just checking to see if anyone knows about the question I asked in the previous post. I have looked for an answer and found nothing. Crank pulley hit the unibody and won't clear it.

 

[xyexz]

Unless your 1g has had some serious side impact it should clear it, besides the big bolt in the center and the other 4 smaller bolts holding the harmonic pulley on there is a dowel pin that helps in putting the pulley back on how it's supposed to, might have to rotate the crank so that dowel is at the top/bottom.

If you do the above you should be able to swivel it out through the bottom, I've done it many times.

 

[TSIturbo91]

I'm used to work in a auto body shop and checked for damage. No frame issues. The pulley seems to want to come off and then it hits the unibody. It almost seems like the crank sprocket has come out some causing it not to clear. Tried to push it back on and it won't go back on all the way.

 

[NOSLO2PT0]

Remove timing side motor mount, drop engine as far as it will go. Crank pulley should come right off. Plenty of room to clear.

 

[GIRman67]

without removing the bottom crossmember it can stop just a hair too high for the pulley. that's with 2g's though. Did you get the entire timing kit from STM that incluses the timing components and BSE or did you buy them seperately. I've had to do the timing on my car the Jay racing timing kit is a god send, it's worth the cash

 

[Lofty]

All of the timing marks only line up every 6 revolutions of the crankshaft, you have not rotated it enough yet.

Not true for JUST cam timing.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Even with the top motor mount off and lowering it as far as it could be. Now this time I am doing a BSE but next T-belt job I'd like to be able to get that pulley off easier. I removed the 4 bolt and the big one in the middle. Also it is not stuck on the sprocket thanks to some love taps with a dead blow rubber mallet. Thanks for all the help guys.

I indicated that the top motor mount by timing case was taken off. It dropped a tiny bit but not enough. Will have pictures of the problem tomorrow.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Well I got into the shop today and was able to wiggle the crank pulley off and this is the result. I found out what was causing the crank pulley to get stuck. The pulley and sprocket came off stuck together. The hydraulic tensioner is shot. The Balance Shaft Belt was self eliminated, and spared the timing belt. THANK GOD I'm not sure where I have been leaking coolent but now im guessing it's in this area some where. The over all picture is it over heated last winter when it hit -33*F and was over heating on the way home. Babied it as mush as I could but with no heat i was more focused on getting home safely. Been garaged till summer which I drove it like 10 miles to check if it still ran. When trying to get it back on the road I found the timing belt in bad shape and figured while in there and working I'd do the water pump, BSE, and timing belt. Now I'm not sure if it would be easier to just yank it out or to just deal with the "nature of the beast" and just fix it in the car. Lastly the lower timing cover was chewed threw by pulleys and belts. Is that from any know reason or just poor installation of the previous abuser.

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[Indian]

That is a horrible oil leak...I wouldn't doubt it's been leaking for years. You're going to need more than just a timing belt kit,I'm also surprised your alternator hasn't died yet. Your tensioner pulley for the balance shaft belt is also backwards, the lip should be against the case. That's probably why it failed, plus all the coolant and oil on the belt.

 

[LandSpeed-DSM]

Holy hell, thats a mess.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Yea, I have been in school and not able to devote as much time and money as I can now. So I'm playing catch up on all the things gone wrong. I have a complete lower gasket kit to fix what I can while doing this repair.

 

[XiKeiyaZI]

Oil pump. Water pump. Bse kit. New tensioner, pulley, and belts of course. Also be sure to use the short oil pan bolts under the timing belt. Also check your cam seals while you're at it.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Well I have everything but an oil pump. Timing belt kit from JNZ, BSE from STM, and Gates water pump. Oil pressure was fine. If there is no mechanical issues with the oil pump. Then a good cleaning and new seals should be ok for a DD?

 

[JusMX141]

Change your cam seals and the valve cover gasket while the timing belt is off. That's where that oil mess is coming from. Actually, verify that the valve cover isn't cracked as well.

Water pump is clearly leaking coolant- it needs replaced. Count on spending $400-$500 on all new timing components, water pump, a good valve cover gasket, and cam seals.

 

[TSIturbo91]

Thanks JusMX141 for the advice. And the valve cover gasket is not in great shape. I got the lower gasket kit from parts dino. Has anyone had good or bad experience with their product? As said it's a DD and stock set up so I'm not worried about top of the line just yet.