Swapped in 14b, how much more will it take to get into 13s?

[_Madman_]

I've been running my car with all the current mods minus 14b and minus FPR/Walbro for some time, and the best 1/8mi times I was able to get was 9.5@79mph. With 1.52 multiplier for 1/4mi, which seems to be the average multiplier for 13.5-14.5 FWD cars, the results should be around 14.44 1/4mi.

But that's way, way slow...

I'm hoping my times will improve with 14b, 9.4 in 1/8mi is what I hope for, but this is still way to far for 13.9 1/4mi times. In order to do that I would need around 9.2 1/8 mi times, which seems impossible to tell the truth...

What does it takes to get full interior FWD DSM to get 13.9 or better 1/4mi times? 16G and 680cc injectors + tune? WTF

 

[91stocker]

Whats your 60ft look like? Its all about the 60. You probably just need some seat time. My buddy just got done laying down some 1.9's in his fwd on street tires about two weeks ago.

 

[11secDSM]

A local friend of mine went 12.2 in a mildly modded 1g FWD w/ 14b. You have plenty to get there. Get your tune dialed in and get some seat time.

 

[_Madman_]

No idea, the track we use is only 1/8mi, and they don't have 60' time measurement.

But I guess it's around 2.2 - 2.5, like for all FWD DSMs.

A local friend of mine went 12.2 in a mildly modded 1g FWD w/ 14b. You have plenty to get there. Get your tune dialed in and get some seat time.

That would take 8 sec 1/8 mi times flat... Guys with AWD and 16G cannot reach that here...

Sorry for me sounding so pessimistic, but after all the money dumped in, all the practice, I still see no way how to get into 13s

 

[my dreamt dsm]

I've seen 14b's with stock 2g stuff do flat 15's and 16g's with 600+ injectors and tune on safc do good solid mid 13's.
Even seen a member on here with a t25 do low 13's on his gsx so sky's the limit really. Depends on how gifted your foot and motor is.

 

[Arthris]

You can do it. I went 13.2 on my 14b with stock parts other than tuning solution. Tune for 11.2's afr and run 18 or so punds of boost and tune for as much timing as you can. Of course you will need to work on ## 60ft times. ## car will want to spin like no other. As long as you have ## tune dialed in all it will take is seat time to dial in ## launch.

 

[_Madman_]

I have no idea how to improve the 60' time...

I already have the Quaife, which helps a lot, and I only loose like a half car length to RWD cars, but anything more and it spins

Or do I have to spin it in 1st? I try to minimize the spinning to a few feet max.

 

[EclipseOwner95]

No idea, the track we use is only 1/8mi, and they don't have 60' time measurement.

But I guess it's around 2.2 - 2.5, like for all FWD DSMs.



That would take 8 sec 1/8 mi times flat... Guys with AWD and 16G cannot reach that here...

Sorry for me sounding so pessimistic, but after all the money dumped in, all the practice, I still see no way how to get into 13s

I agree, 12.2 in a 14b FWD thats " mildly " modded, please.


You should be able to get your 60's down to 2.0 if you get some more seat time. A few friends of mine with decent tires can cut 1.9's.

Get your 60" down and you'll easily do 13's.

 

[fonzi90Tsi]

Local guy here in a laser gets 13.7s with a 16g and evo 56/s and a 190. Only tuning is the first gen safc.

 

[my dreamt dsm]

I would suggest two step or anti lag with great sticky street tires.

 

[11secDSM]

Guys with AWD and 16G cannot reach that here...

I went 11.8 on a 16g. It's doable. You just need to work on your setup. Tune and driving are crucial.

 

[91stocker]

I have no idea how to improve the 60' time...

I already have the Quaife, which helps a lot, and I only loose like a half car length to RWD cars, but anything more and it spins

Or do I have to spin it in 1st? I try to minimize the spinning to a few feet max.

You've just got to peddle it. Slowly roll on the throttle all through first. Its sort of a "feel" thing. Some people can do it, some cant.

 

[_Madman_]

I would suggest two step or anti lag with great sticky street tires.

I use 215/45R17 Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 2 up front, which seem to be pretty sticky. At least car doesn't spin in 2nd gear at all, it's all foot down once out of 1st.

In 1st I do have to keep it under control all the time... I can launch at around 2500-3000RPMs without too much wheel spin, and I do have to keep it under control all the way through 1st.

Don't know if it's better to go up to 6200RPMs in 1st, fighting the wheelspin, or shift to 2nd to get the traction under control.

What is the shift point for the 14b by the way? It should be higher than 6200RPM of T25, or not?

 

[my dreamt dsm]

Do you mean where the turbo dies down?
I remember it's somewhere around 6k rpm. But if other members could chime it to concur.

 

[_Madman_]

Do you mean where the turbo dies down?
I remember it's somewhere around 6k rpm. But if other members could chime it to concur.

I don't know if it's the point where turbo dies down, or where the shift will throw you back into best power band.

I have seen all sorts of talks, but I have no idea whats the right way. Aside from fact it's definitely not the Fast and Furious style, redlining every gear

For T25 it was ~6200RPMs where it was better to shift than to keep going, 14B (especially with 7cm hotside) seems to be a lot stronger on top end, so this is probably no longer true.

 

[MHuddy1213]

hmmm does anyone know where the small 16g with 6cm turbine housing starts to die out just curious sorry to get off subject?

 

[JusMX141]

That would take 8 sec 1/8 mi times flat... Guys with AWD and 16G cannot reach that here...(

The 1/8th mile is going to be rough in a FWD regardless because of the lousy 60fts. A FWD relies on the last 660ft of a 1/4 mile pass in order to put together a decent run. TalonDave's very first turbo car was a FWD Laser and he only made it to 13.1 on a SBR G50 before getting an AWD and never looking back. FWD's are fun on the street but can't get moving quick enough at the track to prove themselves worthwhile the majority of the time.

Ten years ago my buddy Stryker ran a 12.6 @ 108 off the street in his AWD 1G with a bone stock engine straight down to the cams, Supra sidemount, Big 16G @ 18psi, FIC 550's, 190 in the tank, and tuning with an AFC-I relying only on what his palm logger and narrowband/EGT gauges were telling him. Things were a lot different back then as far as tuning was concerned, but it still took good driving to get down the track in a respectable time.

 

[Steve93Talon]

I agree, 12.2 in a 14b FWD thats " mildly " modded, please.

Chris was referring to my car. My best time was actually 12.47 @ 114.8 with a 1.93 60'. Full mod list is in my profile, but my head/cams/intake mani are stock. Basically just V3/SD, full 3", FMIC, 255/1000s (stock FPR), 2600/4puck. I was running E85 and spiking to around 24psi then dropping to 16ish by 6k. The car was originally AWD, though it does have some weight reduction. Probably around 2600 lbs with me in it as it sits.

The key is traction, period. Get a set of slicks, or at minimum a set of Hoosier drag radials/QTPs. Even full weight, with pump gas and n average tune, you should easily make enough power for your goals. Getting it off the line is going to make or break it.

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[EclipseOwner95]

Chris was referring to my car. My best time was actually 12.47 @ 114.8 with a 1.93 60'. Full mod list is in my profile, but my head/cams/intake mani are stock. Basically just V3/SD, full 3", FMIC, 255/1000s (stock FPR), 2600/4puck. I was running E85 and spiking to around 24psi then dropping to 16ish by 6k. The car was originally AWD, though it does have some weight reduction. Probably around 2600 lbs with me in it as it sits.

The key is traction, period. Get a set of slicks, or at minimum a set of Hoosier drag radials/QTPs. Even full weight, with pump gas and n average tune, you should easily make enough power for your goals. Getting it off the line is going to make or break it.

E85 , V3, SD Conversion, and a hefty weight loss. Totally "mild"

Those are impressive numbers for a 14b though, and you can obviously handle your car getting a 1.9 60". Slicks? DRs?

 

[11secDSM]

E85 , V3, SD Conversion, and a hefty weight loss. Totally "mild"

Those are impressive numbers for a 14b though, and you can obviously handle your car getting a 1.9 60". Slicks? DRs?

Add up the total of those mods you listed. Under $1k. Oh so extravagant. Give me a break.

 

[EclipseOwner95]

Add up the total of those mods you listed. Under $1k. Oh so extravagant. Give me a break.

V3 , + SD conversion + Socketing = $750 , that's if your lucky enough to have an EPROM ECU, if your not, tack on another $150. So that's $900 right there.

And you act like that's all he has done... not sure what tires hes running, but you can tell in the picture they are not street tires, injectors, pump, full turbo back, CAI, aftermarket clutch, FMIC. Thats another $2000 right there if you buy quality parts. Not to mention getting the car down to 2400lbs , again, nothing MILD about that. $2750+ in mods ? Totally mild.

I can go gut my car, buy cams and a nitrous kit for under $1000 and trap 120+ on a 14b, is my car still mild?


Changing the air metering system, tuning on a laptop, and running ethanol couldn't be farther than mild, regardless of the price, last time I checked the word mild described the nature of the something, not its cost.

 

[11secDSM]

Bolt ons = mild

Sorry to see you've been a DSMer for so long and think these mods are hardcore. He said 2600 lbs. his car isn't gutted. It's got all panels inside. Slicks at te track don't make it something crazy either. E85 is run in DDs these days. Catch up. Laptop tuning and metering changes....I do that to peoples dailies all the time. Again, doesnt make it crazy considering its the norm now. Maybe in 2001 I'd say it was hardcore.

 

[boosted99_420]

heck on my old 2g i was babying it and ran 15.3 at 91 if i would have launched it i could have been in the high 13s but i had some basic mods done also like fmic, intake pipe, and ecmlink

 

[EclipseOwner95]

Bolt ons = mild

Sorry to see you've been a DSMer for so long and think these mods are hardcore. He said 2600 lbs. his car isn't gutted. It's got all panels inside. Slicks at te track don't make it something crazy either. E85 is run in DDs these days. Catch up. Laptop tuning and metering changes....I do that to peoples dailies all the time. Again, doesnt make it crazy considering its the norm now. Maybe in 2001 I'd say it was hardcore.

He said 2600lbs with him in it. Average weight for an adult male is 180. So the car weighs roughly 2400lbs.

Maybe in your area E85 is run in daily's but you can tell my state to "catch up" as the closest E85 pump is over 60 miles away, and its no where close to easily available to MOST people.

I didn't say they were hardcore, I said they weren't mild. Cat-back, fuel pump, and MBC is mild. Obviously you've been around the block before and maybe your perception of mild has changed, but to people new to the DSM scene, the mods you've mentioned are surely "hardcore" for newbies. Changing to SD is also FAR from the norm. Just like the average DSM'er doesn't have a set of slicks to throw on to go to the track.

My car is V3 & SD, making 500+ on a tired stock shortblock on pump, trust me I wish I had E85 in my area I'd shoot for 600 but sadly within the past 3 months they've closed 2 of the 3 E85 pumps, and now the only one left is way too far away for it to be worth it.

 

[11secDSM]

I'll give you that...the availability of E85 isn't the same everywhere. Even I drive 15 miles to get it. But, it's definitely worth it and doesn't take too much to be able to run it. Around here, SD is the norm. SD and GM MAF cars out number 1g/2g MAF cars. Catback/fuel pump/MBC cars truly are mild...I can't remember the last time I saw one though. I'm being serious too.

I understand your point though. Steve's car isn't too far beyond mild though. In terms of power adding mods, there really isn't too much done.