Supercharger modification

[Seamus]

We have one of the best audi repair shops in the midwest. And have installed a lot of tjrbo kits on cars. First off, your 02 a6 4.2 actually has very little in common with the 4.2 in the s4. So many things are not compatible between them what so ever. Understand too that even as an 02 that Audi has a very complex set of interconnected modules throughout the car. Onviously bolting on boost is mechanically no different than on any other car. Other than the fact that the 4.2 front cover is litter ally buried in the nose. There will be no possible way to mount and drive a roots or screw type blower. The a6 4.2 actually has a longer clip than the 6 cyl cars to accommodate that motor.you can't fit a blower snout under the front bumper! Haba look under your hood.It will take much more than a simple ecu flash to her the car to run and drive properly. The Tranny module for exame is going to shit itself when it sees boost and estimates torque output. your not going to be are to send her off to Apr or her a bench flash. You're going to need someone who writes code for bosch motronic. There is so much to go Into I can't even start here. Rather then asking on here with a bunch of peoplE who mean well but don't know whay they are talking about, I would find your local Audi specialist, and get an estimate on whatit is going to take.

 

[mercaholik]

Well keeping the bottle full and at the right pressure. Tuning is still key, colder plugs, possibly a fuel pump, bap, or fmu(not preferred) depending on stock pumps capabilities. All this is needed with any forced induction method chosen. Add oxygen gotta add fuel right, I know you can run a wet nitrous kit but it's gotta be direct port or you can have mixture or distribution problems. I still vote for turbo, even though a centrifugal super charger would be cool. Turbo is better on gas off boost too.

 

[mercaholik]

That's what I'm talking about, I really think your biggest obstacle will be the computer, you can always lie to it and use interceptors so it never sees boost, use some kind of safc, and some kind of way to raise fuel pressure, and a wide band.

 

[mercaholik]

True I don't know what I'm talking about with Audi's and didn't mean to make it seem like I did. Though I did mention tuning was gonna be his biggest obstacle and just touched on the basics of boosting an n/a motor cause I wasn't sure about the o.p's knowledge. Im not saying the comment was directed at me, but I was just trying to be involved in his little venture. I like the diy mentality and love that sweet 4.2 noise so I think you should still go for it. Still good info Seamus I have no knowledge of Audi platforms.

 

[Seamus]

That's what I'm talking about, I really think your biggest obstacle will be the computer, you can always lie to it and use interceptors so it never sees boost, use some kind of safc, and some kind of way to raise fuel pressure, and a wide band.

The fmu's and stuff you recommended won't work on that car. Too many systems are monitoring these values. Its not a matter or tricking the main ECU's Airflow reading or somthing. BTW that car already has a wideband. Where do you think these cheap wide bands wehave now originated. Before Audi introduced and OEM wideband, they cost big bucks. Like I suggested above you really need to speak with a
Specialist VAG shop. I'm not a teCH, I do finance. So I definatly don't have all the answers. The 02 a6 was an update and introduced a whole next generation of complexity to their systems.

 

[mercaholik]

Really those are old school hack ways to tune anyway and I did put its not preferred, I guess I should have put not possible. Or really I guess I shouldn't have even replied, but being it's dsm tuners and he knew that, it was just a friendly discussion.

 

[duwackerTSi69]

I know the s4 4.2 is different in so many ways. There's a few companies out there who make a SC kit my timing belt engine. The S4 is a chain motor. And my car has the 2006 and up S line front end. I have more room between my engine and radiator then it did from the factory. My hood, that's another question to address for fitment, when the time comes, or if it comes. And yes, your right, their are too many electronics monitoring every aspect of my car then I can count. So tricking something is gonna happen. My mentality is.... If Apr or the other companies can get it to be fooled and work flawlessly, then I can, with a lot of help. Or even having my ecu sent off will suffice of need be.

We have one of the best audi repair shops in the midwest. And have installed a lot of tjrbo kits on cars. First off, your 02 a6 4.2 actually has very little in common with the 4.2 in the s4. So many things are not compatible between them what so ever. Understand too that even as an 02 that Audi has a very complex set of interconnected modules throughout the car. Onviously bolting on boost is mechanically no different than on any other car. Other than the fact that the 4.2 front cover is litter ally buried in the nose. There will be no possible way to mount and drive a roots or screw type blower. The a6 4.2 actually has a longer clip than the 6 cyl cars to accommodate that motor.you can't fit a blower snout under the front bumper! Haba look under your hood.It will take much more than a simple ecu flash to her the car to run and drive properly. The Tranny module for exame is going to shit itself when it sees boost and estimates torque output. your not going to be are to send her off to Apr or her a bench flash. You're going to need someone who writes code for bosch motronic. There is so much to go Into I can't even start here. Rather then asking on here with a bunch of peoplE who mean well but don't know whay they are talking about, I would find your local Audi specialist, and get an estimate on whatit is going to take.

 

[Seamus]

I know the s4 4.2 is different in so many ways. There's a few companies out there who make a SC kit my timing belt engine. The S4 is a chain motor. And my car has the 2006 and up S line front end. I have more room between my engine and radiator then it did from the factory. My hood, that's another question to address for fitment, when the time comes, or if it comes. And yes, your right, their are too many electronics monitoring every aspect of my car then I can count. So tricking something is gonna happen. My mentality is.... If Apr or the other companies can get it to be fooled and work flawlessly, then I can, with a lot of help. Or even having my ecu sent off will suffice of need be.

Putting on a new front end doesn't change the distance between the radiator and engine. And I am not talking about that space. I'm taking about how the front cover is tucked under the bumper skin it is so far forward. this isitterally a 30+ thousand dollar endeavor. Probay more. If someone makes a bolt on kit for your car it will without a doubt be the cheapest way to do it. If you think other wise, you have a long hard road ahead of you. BTW giac has done a lot of crazy stuff with euro car chips. Including making the 959 legal for america. You may look at them if you ever get that far. Also have driven all the common tines from various manufacturers, I lime the giac stuff the best anyways.

 

[duwackerTSi69]

I have more room bc this wasn't a bolt on swap. The body dimensions are way different like you said. I know this bc I did it to my own car when you say centrifugal sc, are you referring to the ones like a pro charger? I'm referring to the ones that bolt in place of the factory intake manifold.

 

[duwackerTSi69]

I'm not sure where your getting the 30k price range from but here is just one kit I found, and they use the factory ecu and I'm guessing with just a eprom chip and flash? I spoke with them a few months back and scoring to them, it works flawlessly with drivability issues.
http://www.motodyne.com/frames/audi_a6_ v8_powered.html

It can be done, and the only obstacle I see is my ecu. Fabbing up a rear mount turbo, wouldn't be hard at all. I have what we call, ingenuity. Lol.

 

[Seamus]

There is $10g for complete kit. Thats the way to go. Figure another 2 grand for install. that is cheap for a complete, well engineered bolt on setup that fits your uncommon car. Based on that kit price, I don't know why you think 30k for custom setup is unrealistic.

 

[duwackerTSi69]

You think I'm gonna pay someone to install all this stuff in my car, or even fab anything? Yea right. That may be your way of doing things, but I'm more then qualified,And able to do this myself. Just not the ecu part.

 

[duwackerTSi69]

When someone spend money like that on a kit, they're buying simplicity and easy peasy no brainer install. I can find a supercharger that is equivalent in size, hack it up and modify it to work for my engine, fab the ic piping and little stuff here and there for a $1k. Or even a turbo kit. I'll do all the fab work etc, and the only money I'll spend is material and my gauges etc. And even then, what ever route I take, my ecu is the problem. And ask these other c.f. sensors who make kits have solved the ecu flashing requirements problem so it can be done. Even if I have to pay $700 for it, so be it. That's their avg price oh seen for ecu mods. All of that doesn't even come close to $30k.

 

[mercaholik]

Exactly, if it can be done I'm sure you'll be able to do it. They said the gtr was un hackable and that was overcome, def keep us updated on what you end up doing, she's gonna be sweet either way. I hope I didn't insult you, it was late and I realize you know your shit, I was just trying to figure it out too. I here you on supercharger, it would be sweet. But I would want to intercool it, some new mustang engines come super charged and they upgrade them all the time, might be able to snag one cheap, they have intercooler under the super charger.

 

[duwackerTSi69]

No worries man. Yea they also said back in the day the 6 bolt bottom end couldn't handle much power, but what do you know. People push them to 450-500 hp with the appropriate tuning.Anyway IV been at this all day at work, and the only problem I see is the ecu and tuning. I called a few places and go figure, NONE of them wanted to flash my ecu unless I picked up their complete package. Go figure . There has to be options so maybe I'll go over the the Audi forum and see what options there is from the old school know it all's .
The factory equipped supercharger on the mustang can be had for $400 all over the net. I can take my manifold off, trace out the flanges, write a program and cnc mill them from some good quality aluminum plate. Cut the flanges off the mustang sc, make a bracket to hold it in its desired position on top the engine. Take some tubing and join the sc to my cnc flanges with tack welds. Remove the unit, and fully weld it up on a bench.do some porting and smoothing out, maybe more bracing for structural stability and viola. This are my intentions, and my original question to this thread. Will something like that, along those lines be good or even beneficial? I'm sure it would work, but maybe not to its full potential. But for maybe 5-7psi, I'm sure it'll be just fine. Thoughts???

 

[mercaholik]

You add some headers and maybe an x pipe and I think it would be pretty sick. Those new 5.0 coyote motors are dohc, and close to same air flow requirements as your 4.2 and I think you got the manifold figured out. Only issue might be hood clearance but you can measure that first. I like your spirit man, where there is a will there is a way. You'll wanna use your tps and maf so some custom fab work should solve it. Though turbo might be easier in that respect. I'm voting for a hx40 with a crossover tube connecting both exhausts. How about some engine bay pics, I'm curious how tight it is.

 

[mercaholik]

You can change pulley sizes too and I think l you motor revs higher so you will end up with some decent air flow and boost pressure with the right pulley. You can cnc a a bracket for the s/c drive pulley and buy a longer belt.

 

[duwackerTSi69]

I live in Texas and I really don't wanna put a turbo in my engine bay. If I go turbo, it'll be a rear mount design. And to be honest, going turbo would be soooo much less of a pain in the butt. Fab work wise anyway. And I never got the cfm/flow results from David Dsm yet. Hx40 pro would be nasty . For the sake of my motor, I'll want only 5-7psi. I said before of a max 10psi, but I changed my mind from my research today. 7psi should put me around 450hp-ish range.

 

[duwackerTSi69]

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

This is the only pic I have at the moment, I'm still at work.

 

[mercaholik]

I hear you and with some nice torque numbers down low. That's one good thing about roots/ twin screw super chargers they pump and fixed amount of air per rev so they add nice low speed torque. I'll see if I can dig up some air flow numbers on the stock mustang s/c.