recipe for 110-120 traps

[14.5 drift]

I have an eclipse gsx automatic, but because it's an auto I dont get the 60 times that the manuels do. I decided to focus on the top end. I will get some thing like a 3.0 60', so i will need to make it up in the long end of the track. Now I dont want to be digging into the block just yet, so I guess i am lookin for 400-450 at the crank/300-350 at the wheels. I know some people are getting this much power out of the 16g, but Ive noticed there dyno charts look like shit. Just a big lump in the middle, so i think i want a bigger turbo that flows a bit better in the upper rpm. From the turbo to injectors feel free to give your recipe to high traps.

 

[kpt4321]

Why you so informative and so cranky. Like it is too much bother to post but your obligated to flex you vast pool of information.

Actually, that is very close to the way it is.

I'm crank because you are not asking an specific question; to make matters worse, you are asking a whole bunch of non-specific questions at once. Instead of doing this, do some research and then ask smaller more specific questions. It's impossible to answer the kind of question you asked here, but something smaller and more specific would not have been a problem.

Don't ask us what a 20g flows, go look it up. Then once you know more about a 20g, you can ask a more specific question.

Don't ask us for a "recipe" for high trap speeds, recipies are absurd. There is a tuning guide here, and there are a million and one posts telling you what works, and what doesn't, not to mention lots and lots of dyno results.

Don't say you want to trap between 110 and 120. Decide exactly what you want to do, to a couple mph.

After reading some stuff and comparing flow charts of intake manifolds it seems the manifold is largely responsible for top end drop off, not just the turbo. i hadn't really considered that before.

Good job. You're on the right track, you just need to take this approach to more aspects.

 

[kpt4321]

And i think you didnt read that you have to multipy that by 1.17 to get the true whp.

"True" horsepower? DO NOT fall into that trap!

The 17% correction factor is used to compare dyno dynamics results to dynojet results. It's very debatable that the dyno dynamics numbers are far closer to your true wheel horsepower rate.

 

[NewB2dsm]

"True" horsepower? DO NOT fall into that trap!

The 17% correction factor is used to compare dyno dynamics results to dynojet results. It's very debatable that the dyno dynamics numbers are far closer to your true wheel horsepower rate.

im not but when people say oh only 258hp with race gas and 24psi it gets anoying. And i trapped 107mph on pump gas. No way thats only 246awhp. Dyno dynamics read low, but are VERY good for tuning. the 1.17 was giving by dyno dynamics to convert its numbers to a dynojet or a mustang dyno. The owner of this dyno calls it the heart breaker. I really dont care what the whp is as long as its tuned good. But i dont like people being misunderstood that it seems low for the mods. That make anysence?

 

[boostedinaz]

im not but when people say oh only 258hp with race gas and 24psi it gets anoying. And i trapped 107mph on pump gas. No way thats only 246awhp. Dyno dynamics read low, but are VERY good for tuning. the 1.17 was giving by dyno dynamics to convert its numbers to a dynojet or a mustang dyno. The owner of this dyno calls it the heart breaker. I really dont care what the whp is as long as its tuned good. But i dont like people being misunderstood that it seems low for the mods. That make anysence?

Who cars what they think. You know what yo car does and thats all that matters. So many people are worried what other think instead of just being themselves. If I said I think you car is ghey you should sell it are you going to???? No. So dont worry about it. I bet all the people that mock those numbers arent close to having them on there car so screw them.

Michael

 

[NewB2dsm]

Who cars what they think. You know what yo car does and thats all that matters. So many people are worried what other think instead of just being themselves. If I said I think you car is ghey you should sell it are you going to???? No. So dont worry about it. I bet all the people that mock those numbers arent close to having them on there car so screw them.

Michael

your right 100%, in person i tell them they car race a 246awhp car or a 290awhp either way does not matter to me. But over the internet its different. I just think people see the mods and the race gas and think either im a moron and have a crappy running car or somthing. But either way who cares.

 

[14.5 drift]

rather presumptious of you. I could actually care less about dynojet readings, mustang dyno and dyno dynamics are the only ones I take as truth. If you tied me down I could spin a free moving drum.

But in rebutle to kpt's comments, I was actually hoping that by leaving a window more than one person would give there view point on how to do it. Maybe you could say with experience under your belt that x is the way to go, then some body else could say Y is the way to go and then I could review and contrast each methods in my very own thread. Why even bother with some thing you think is a problem, it shouldn't be your problem? I was hopin people that love to talk about cars would be on this car forum, not people who hate to.

Not tryen to be flamatory either, just curious.

 

[boostedinaz]

rather presumptious of you. I could actually care less about dynojet readings, mustang dyno and dyno dynamics are the only ones I take as truth. If you tied me down I could spin a free moving drum.

But in rebutle to kpt's comments, I was actually hoping that by leaving a window more than one person would give there view point on how to do it. Maybe you could say with experience under your belt that x is the way to go, then some body else could say Y is the way to go and then I could review and contrast each methods in my very own thread. Why even bother with some thing you think is a problem, it shouldn't be your problem? I was hopin people that love to talk about cars would be on this car forum, not people who hate to.

Not tryen to be flamatory either, just curious.

Searching would have given you a better comparison than asking. Like Kyle said you need a goal so that you can try to obtain it. You just gave us a range that will take 2 differant setups to otain. we all like taling about ars that is why we ar here, but we also have alot of people that ask general questions that cant be answered and that gets annoying at times for those of us who have been through it. Searching will yeild great results on any situation you can dream off. These cars have been arounf for more than ten years, nothing is new and eveything has been tried.

Michael

 

[14.5 drift]

Okay, Okay, okay, give me recipes for 115 traps. PLEASE?

 

[kpt4321]

Okay, Okay, okay, give me recipes for 115 traps. PLEASE?

Don't ask us for a "recipe" for high trap speeds, recipies are absurd. There is a tuning guide here, and there are a million and one posts telling you what works, and what doesn't, not to mention lots and lots of dyno results.

115 mph traps? Sure. Bigger turbo. FMIC. Exhaust Intake pipe. Bigger injectors. Bigger pump. Maybe an AFPR. Fuel Control.

Does that really help? Nah.

 

[VRMAN]

Recipe for 115mph traps:

Intake filter+2.75" intake pipe
2.5" UICP
Upgraded SMIC or FMIC
PTE 50 Trim turbo
264/264 Camshafts
3" Turbo-back exhaust
Centerforce DF Clutch
660cc injectors
SAFC
Blitz DD BOV
190lph fuel pump
AFPR



That should net you 115mph traps on with a good tune. This is PURELY a suggestion. Im sure people have trapped 115mph on a S16G with stock IC on a FWD, hence the DSMtuners real gurus telling you these recipes are crap. But you asked for one and I just gave it to you. Go buy those parts today.

 

[98RedGs]

115 mph traps? Sure. Bigger turbo. FMIC. Exhaust Intake pipe. Bigger injectors. Bigger pump. Maybe an AFPR. Fuel Control.

Does that really help? Nah.

(to the thread starter)
Maybe you should do a little more research into your own setup and post what you would like to get or what you feel like would yield the times your wanting from your car. What KP is basically telling is this: If you ask vague questions about a setup, you will get very very vague answers to your questions. Post what kind of setup you feel you should get to get you where your wanting to be and maybe kpt will supply you with any additional information you need.


Goodluck guys.

 

[14.5 drift]

Okay. Will post 21 be good enough for 115 traps in a 4 speed auto?

 

[VRMAN]

, you don't seem to get it

Add to list if you have an automatic:

*Translab shift kit
*Tranny cooler
*3400rpm stall converter

Plan on nuking a few trannies. Also, you have the slowest trap speed platform, 2G AWD ATX is not the easiest thing to make fast. My previous suggestions, coupled with the newly added and running race gas and high boost should get you 115mph traps. All depends on the tuning.

Why are you interested so much in trap speeds? With AWD you should want to hit the strip or light-to-light races, not freeway. If you want any help with the car, we only live maybe 1 hour from each other.

Good luck to you

 

[14.5 drift]

Why are you interested so much in trap speeds? With AWD you should want to hit the strip or light-to-light races, not freeway.

Actually because of the trans, I figured that tq brake a bunch of times would be the end of my trans, so i decided F that, I will make more power in the top tomake up for the loss down low. Different strokes is all. BTW when the cars all done (some time end of this year) I'll pick you up for a beer and a test run




Not exactly in that order

 

[VRMAN]

Sure thing, bring it by so I can slap you around on the freeway. :laugh:

Honestly, add those tranny upgrades or it really isn't going to be effective to spend $$ on power mods. I would still be of the mindset that stoplight races are for you or else be happy with something like 108 trap speeds. Thats C5 territory man.

Again, let me know if you need anything.

 

[kpt4321]

Recipe for 115mph traps:

Intake filter+2.75" intake pipe
2.5" UICP
Upgraded SMIC or FMIC
PTE 50 Trim turbo
264/264 Camshafts
3" Turbo-back exhaust
Centerforce DF Clutch
660cc injectors
SAFC
Blitz DD BOV
190lph fuel pump
AFPR



That should net you 115mph traps on with a good tune. This is PURELY a suggestion. Im sure people have trapped 115mph on a S16G with stock IC on a FWD, hence the DSMtuners real gurus telling you these recipes are crap. But you asked for one and I just gave it to you. Go buy those parts today.

VRMAN is 100% right, but let's use his post to make a point.

The fact of the matter is, this is one of about 300 different setups that will rn thos times. I can think of some parts that would be better than the ones he listed, and some parts that would be worse. However, in the end all of these different setups will work.

You need to concentrate on chocing what parts you need, and what the options are. For example, you might decide you want a turbo that can support 400 whp.

Then, you can ask more specific questions about that particular pat, to decide what will work best for you.

 

[midnght]

Make a list of what you want and we will toss in things to help get you there. You have to give a base for us to start giving you a direction. Start off with a turbo choice and add from there. It is the heart of your build-up (besides the block itself) and will decide were and how fast you reach your goal.

 

[VRMAN]

14.5,

Honestly be very thankful you got this much help. Your same 'type' of question is asked here 6 times a day, hence the crankiness. Seems everyone has genuinely tried to help, I hope you put this info to use. Would hate to see the car stock for 2 years and then sold.

 

[14.5 drift]

vrman, shift kit is in the mail. The last couple times at wot there was some slippage between 2-3, but thats a hole nother story. And about selecting a turbo, it's very hard to do, and i also didn't want to be one of the threads about x turbo vs x turbo, so any ways. As of yesterday i wanted the fp2544, but as of today I want the fp3052. I really can't come to a solid decision. I think if I end up with the 25 I will regret not having a more powerful top end, and if I get the 52 I will be upset with the lag. I flip flop on these 2 once or twice a week. Wich one would you guys put on my car?

 

[midnght]

..... if I get the 52 I will be upset with the lag. ....

If this is the sole reasoning behind your choice you need to go with the 52. Lag is soooo way overrated.

I would say it is right up there with CrankWalk.


If you are even hesitant about not getting enough power then you will regret going smaller.

 

[VRMAN]

I'll resist the urge to recommend a turbo that you didn't specify. Of those two I would go with the FP2544. Honestly, if you are daily driving this and new to the tuning side of things, this will be a better turbo for you. Good spool up for AWD and better top end than a big28 sounds like it will fit your goals.

To ordering the shift kit. Now that you picked up one, best to pick up all. You don't want to pull that tranny more than once, trust me. If you are putting in the shift kit, get the alto end-clutch and tranny cooler. Than you have phase 1 of your project completed and you went about it the right way. Preventative maintenance first, enjoy end result later.

Let me know when you are selecting other projects and I'll give you my experience with it or my recommendation.

VRMAN

 

[14.5 drift]

I'll resist the urge to recommend a turbo that you didn't specify.

by all means, what did you have in mind? Spool up? Lbs min?

 

[VRMAN]

SBR2G20G for easy installation.

PTE 50Trim for good pump gas performance and top end.

 

[14.5 drift]

I dont think so, i would definatly take the 3052 over either of those turbos. It out flows them both by a great deal and spool up is comparible or better than a 50 trim, 20g spool up out of the question, doesn't the 50 trim need a new manifold and 02 dump to fit? hehe nice try though.

 

[VRMAN]

Hey thats up to you man, Im just saying there are always great theories to daily driving a big turbo but when it comes down to shitty 91 octane, automatic tranny and such, you may have ended up making better power and less chance of breaking things with a slightly smaller snail and better tuning.

The 50trim does NOT require its own manny or any of that non-sense and is $950
Not big enough? The 56trim is the same price, more power.

2g20g will bolt up to your 7 bolt fine and also make good power. Not trying to start any real debate, get what will make you happy. I just think you need to research a little more first. Also, you have quite a bit of supporting mod purchasing to do first.