Resolved Rear main seal OK?

[Mech Addict]

Hey all,
I’ve wrestled the tranny out (to replace w/ a rebuilt one) and now can look at the rear main seal. It looks decent to me, but would like to hear thoughts of more veteran dsm-ers. Relatedly, I read a few different methods about removing flywheel bolts, but once I took the clutch off, it seemed this way was simplest. Socket on a regular 1/2 breaker bar and it wasn’t bad at all. I have no impact tools, in case anyone thinks that is easier (and it likely would be!). I’m using the RTM crank/wheel hub holder tool, but any length of flat stock roughly this size would work about as well. One more reason to buy this handy piece, though. (Thanks, RTM!). I’ll admit that this works on my OEM flywheel, and might not for aftermarket.

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[DSMPT]

It's not leaking but I recommend to replace it while the transmission is dropped. You won't regret it but you may regret if you don't replace it.
You don't want to drop the transmission again just for replacing the seal.

 

[Mech Addict]

Yes, that’s exactly the debate I’m having with myself. One extra detail is that I’ll likely pull the motor for a full rebuild in a year or two, and likely put, maybe 5k miles in that time? I’m also discovering a bit of oil on the front side, so may need to replace one or more seals with that. Did the tbelts last year. Honestly I’d also like to pull the pan, look around, perhaps plastigauge the mains, but this makes every repair approach infinity…
So all that said, I guess on a 1-10, with 1 being “don’t give it a 2nd thought”, and 10 being “don’t dare even start it up”, whare does this fall?
if the photo isn’t clear, there is a hint of shiny on the bottom of the lip, and the rest of the black is really just clutch dust.

 

[pauleyman]

None of us can make the decision for you. It's leaking now. How long before it's a big issue? Who knows. How many miles on it?
In other news I see you made the tool work but that's not how it was designed. Its made to bolt to the crank on the timing belt side.

 

[97egl]

Don't kid yourself that you'll rebuild it in a year or two.... your a DSM'er unless we rebuild to upgrade internals or for a blown up engine nobody is doin rebuilds. Hell you can barely get most guys to change their timing belts


But in all seriousness I would probably replace it now if I were you. You never know what curveballs life might throw at you and you may not have the time to rebuild the engine in a year or two but still want to drive the car and if you ain't changed the seal and your drivin around on an oil lubricated clutch your not gonna have a good time.

 

[Mech Addict]

I believe it’s the original, so 97k mi. If it could be changed like the later 7 bolt engine style, I likely would have ordered one with all the other trans & clutch parts; no biggie. Having to remove the pan means, among other things that I will need to remove and reinstall the turbo oil return line. Last time I did that took 3 tries (maybe 4?), and ultimately required doubling the gasket to have it not leak. Hoping to avoid that for this particular repair, as I have to get the new flywheel, clutch, trans, all other stuff that had to be removed for access, and then planning to do all Ujoints, swap in a rebuilt diff, rear axle boots.
Sort of a major affair, for me anyway. Wanted to do this in July, but got delayed, and my barely heated garage gets colder every day. Tradeoffs….

I do know that the flat bar tool is for holding the belt end of the crank, but that requires removing the pulley (and belts). Also not a huge deal, but jamming it in there held every nicely to loosen the flywheel bolts. I read up on a few different methods to keep the flywheel from turning, but at least with the oem flywheel this worked great. Had it off in 5/10 min.

So if I were to ignore the crank seal for now, and it leaked, is it likely to foul the clutch?

Appreciate all the advise. I’ll have to drink on it and decide tomorrow.

I’m really not one to let things go when given the chance, (plowed around $10k into this resto so far) but was hoping for a “no worries, it’ll go 2 years-easy” kind of answer.
Every repair on one thing seems to lead to three others. It’s been leas of a car, more of a garage sculpture so far…

 

[97egl]

Appreciate all the advise. I’ll have to drink on it and decide tomorrow. I’m really not one to let things go when given the chance, ( plowed around $10k into this resto so far) but was hoping for a “no worries, it’ll go 2 years-easy” kind of answer. Every repair on one thing seems to lead to three others. It’s been leas of a car, more of a garage sculpture so far…

It'll probably be fine for 2 years. Do you use high mileage oil? If you don't that'll be to your advantage because if a leak starts and you switch to high mileage oil the oil will swell the seals a bit and maybe slow/stop the leak. If you're already on high mileage oil you won't have that advantage.

Also had to include this just because of the jackstand comment

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[pauleyman]

It's been awhile for me. How is this any different than a 7bolt. I don't recall taking the pan off last time I did one on a six bolt. 7 bolt either for that matter.

 

[DSMPT]

It's been awhile for me. How is this any different than a 7bolt. I don't recall taking the pan off last time I did one on a six bolt. 7 bolt either for that matter.

No need to remove the oil pan. But on a 6 bolt, the seal is inside the seal case, so it requires to remove the seal case and need a new gasket.

 

[pauleyman]

No need to remove the oil pan. But on a 6 bolt, the seal is inside the seal case, so it requires to remove the seal case and need a new gasket.

Yes I remember. 7 bolt is external if I recall. But still no oil pan removal. Just the case.

 

[Mech Addict]

So that seal retainer can be removed with the pan left in? There appears to be two pan bolts that actually thread up into the retainer. I would have thought that upsetting that section of the pan sealing surface would call for removing it entirely to put it back together properly. Plus, how much of a pita to get the retainer off with the pan in place? If that’s an option then I’ll order the parts today.

 

[AWD-Tony]

I have replaced the rear main without removing the pan. Just put rtv on both surfaces. When you slide the rear main back on, there’s a little wiggle room to push the rear main upwards before lining up the dowel pins.

 

[shellhouse]

With 97k mi, I'll be that guy and say "if it ain't broke don't fix it". But since it's a question, maybe you should for peace of mind?

 

[Mech Addict]

Thanks for the input from all. I think I’ll proceed to order the RMS and gasket, and replace it without pulling the pan this time. Part of my reason is that I’ve currently got all the stuff required to swap out my tranny scattered around the garage, and the longer it takes chasing more rabbits, the more chance I forget where something goes, etc on the work I set out to do in the first place.
based on some minor (for now) oil drips I’m going to have to do the front case in the near future, too, and will have to pull the pan for that. I’d rather do that as a discrete, separate endeavor, and not have all those pieces scattered around with what is already there now.
I’m marking this one resolved, but sure I’ll have more questions as I move forward.