Spyder Random fuel cut? 97 GST

[edayrick]

Hello, I am normally just an avid, curious reader but am inevitably running into issues with my 2G GST Spyder.

I was on a passionate drive and did a pretty strong pull (4.5-5.5k rpm). Upon letting off the gas pedal I realized it wasn't running anymore. Cranked it and it would barely start up; not enough for the rpm needle to move.

It seemed that at the moment it died that there was enough fuel to barely get the car to spin over, but now that it's at my home it just cranks. No start.

I had a fuel pump for the car that I was eventually going to put in. I put it in tonight to no avail. Maybe the injectors themselves are bad or my fuel pressure is bad. I did notice however - the fuel pump wiring harness itself did not receive any voltage unless I was cranking the car. Perhaps a faulty fuel pump relay? Tried looking for it to no avail since previous owner did some wild wiring work in the center console

I'll be diagnosing spark tomorrow. Plugs were just changed but perhaps since the ignition coils are aftermarket, the plugs fouled early.

Saw some other speculations like ignition switch, crankshaft positioning sensor, ecu wiring, throttle body, IAC, etc.

Too many possibilities and I wanted some insight from the community. Anything helps significantly. Thank you

- Shaun

1997 Eclipse GS-T Spyder

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[steve]

I did notice however - the fuel pump wiring harness itself did not receive any voltage unless I was cranking the car. Perhaps a faulty fuel pump relay?

That's correct. the ECU turns the fuel pump on when it sees pulses from the Crank Position Sensor (it might be the Cam Position Sensor) telling it the engine is turning. This is a safety feature, you don't want fuel being pumped after the engine stops for any reason.

Did you hear any unusual noises when this happened. Sometimes it's as simple as a intercooler pipe popping off, other times it more serious like a timing belt slipping.

 

[delta448]

I agree with Steve. The fuel pump and relay are unlikely to be the problem.

Unfortunately, the most likely reason is the timing belt slipping.

Verify you have spark, then check the physical timing marks.

Beautiful cars btw, an MR2 is on my bucket list.

 

[steve]

I have a Mk1 MR2, the GSX replaced it rather than a Mk2 due to the insurance difference because of the "back seats" in the Eclipse. I used the MR2 as a trade-in but went back two days later and got it back.

 

[pauleyman]

I agree. Fuel isn't likely the problem. Check more obvious stuff first. I will concur with Steve. Look for IC pipes first then more serious stuff. Suddenly running eough or dying are typically indicative of a mechanical failure. Clip came off, pipe came off, belt slipped. Electrical problems frequently present themselves as dont start or run at all with the exception of some ignition stuff. Cracked coil, old spark plugs/wires etc.

 

[edayrick]

That's correct. the ECU turns the fuel pump on when it sees pulses from the Crank Position Sensor (it might be the Cam Position Sensor) telling it the engine is turning. This is a safety feature, you don't want fuel being pumped after the engine stops for any reason.

Did you hear any unusual noises when this happened. Sometimes it's as simple as a intercooler pipe popping off, other times it more serious like a timing belt slipping.

Unfortunately no I didn't hear any suspicious noises. When the car stopped running it was still in gear. It was capable of being in gear since I was moving 30-40mph as it was dying. Dash was off but engine was still spinning . As soon as I was back in neutral, it died fully though.

I'll go ahead and check on my intercooler piping later tonight. Thank you so much for the insight; Frankly I would love to do a timing job on my DSM haha

I agree. Fuel isn't likely the problem. Check more obvious stuff first. I will concur with Steve. Look for IC pipes first then more serious stuff. Suddenly running eough or dying are typically indicative of a mechanical failure. Clip came off, pipe came off, belt slipped. Electrical problems frequently present themselves as dont start or run at all with the exception of some ignition stuff. Cracked coil, old spark plugs/wires etc.

Im so thankful for everyone's knowledge on this. I'll diagnose the spark tonight and then check up on any broken intercooler piping. Afterwards I'll check on the dreaded timing marks. Hopefully that isn't an issue, but of course I bought the car knowing something would come up eventually haha.

 

[pauleyman]

Im so thankful for everyone's knowledge on this. I'll diagnose the spark tonight and then check up on any broken intercooler piping. Afterwards I'll check on the dreaded timing marks. Hopefully that isn't an issue, but of course I bought the car knowing something would come up eventually haha.

Every car i own that has a timing belt if I don't get documentation that it has been changed its the first thing I do.

 

[steve]

Dash was off but engine was still spinning .

I must have missed this information first time. Did the dash come back alive once you turned the key off and back on?
What does it do now? Does the CEL turn on for 5 seconds when you turn the key on and then go off?

 

[edayrick]

I must have missed this information first time. Did the dash come back alive once you turned the key off and back on?
What does it do now? Does the CEL turn on for 5 seconds when you turn the key on and then go off?

Completely my fault for not specifying; it was late at night. Dash comes back alive, but no start. CEL turns on when key is in "on" position, and then turns off after 5 seconds, so no codes. Im able to use everything electronically. As of right now it's just in a crank no start condition. Hope that helps you understand the situation the car's in.

 

[pauleyman]

Anybody else suspect a short? Lets review what we know. ECU is powering on. That's good. Car cranks so you have battery power. Dash off is the big clue. You had NO power at all correct? Yes engine was still spinning because it's mechanically connected to the drivetrain. It wasn't running, was merely spinning because the wheels were dragging it along. Explains your statement it stopped spinning when in neutral. So. that brings us to why the car won't start. I would inspect wiring, battery and harness in the engine bay. See if something rubbed through possibly causing damage with another component. This includes the battery and connections themselves. There is cause an effect somewhere it appears. If the above statements are true there was a power loss of some sort.

 

[delta448]

When I read "dash turns off" I assumed that what was meant was that the dash was dropping the tach display and lighting up all the battery and charging warning lights that you get when the engine stalls. I didn't ever imagine that you had an electrical issue bad enough to lose all electrical power to the instrument cluster and/or ECU.

So maybe not the timing belt here.

 

[edayrick]

When I read "dash turns off" I assumed that what was meant was that the dash was dropping the tach display and lighting up all the battery and charging warning lights that you get when the engine stalls. I didn't ever imagine that you had an electrical issue bad enough to lose all electrical power to the instrument cluster and/or ECU.

So maybe not the timing belt here.

That's troubling. You're right though. I guess it wasn't exactly like the car stalled, as the whole dash went out as it occurred. Granted, I never noticed until i realized my gas pedal wasn't responding anymore. Once i felt no gas response i instinctively took the key out as the car was moving and tried starting it back up while i was still in motion. Perhaps my memory's vivid because I was more so concerned of getting out of the situation safely, but i remember my dash had no lights on until i took the key out and put it back into the on position.

 

[delta448]

Pulling the key out with the vehicle in motion is pretty dangerous. You're lucky you didn't turn the wheel enough to click into the steering wheel lock.

I think you need to investigate the ignition switch by the sound of this. If you were able to restore power by cycling the lock cylinder that's where I'd start looking.