Ostrich users:

[silicosys4]

So now that i've spent a ton of money on ECMlink, i keep running into references to Ostrich, and the various other tuning programs available... Ds-map, jackal, tunerpro, werewolf... The reason i didn't look into the Ostrich option was that the person doing my tune wasn't familiar at all with Ostrich, or any of the affiliated programs, and recommended Link. Now as i read, it is sounding like a lot of people are putting Ostrich ahead of Link, but no one is giving specifics about why they prefer one over the other, other than price. Yes, Ostrich seems to be cheaper than link. Is it as capable?

So is there anybody who has run both on relatively the same setup, and can give insight as to where the shortcomings of each lie? Perhaps even give logs of each...dyno runs...etc..
Also, is there anybody who knows any professional tuners using Ostrich over Link? As it stands now it seems to be a 100% backyard home tuner thing....Which isn't saying its inferior, it just doesn't seem to have industry backing as yet.
Who's running what times and numbers at the tracks, and with what mods, with Ostrich? I think its time for all you Ostrich users to strut a little!

 

[Palmetto_TSi]

try the ds-map website. The guy that writes that program is a DSMer. There is a forum on the site that can answer a lot of those questions for you. I have only noticed one mention of ostrich type programs on here before. 91stocker made mention of it in a previous thread: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/396330-tuning.html

 

[silicosys4]

I have been to their website, but I'm asking the members here whether or not they use it, and what they think of it. I'm sure if i go to the ds-map forum it will be a lot of rave reviews, just like at the ecmlink forum.

 

[Palmetto_TSi]

yes but they can point you to tuners that use it... which I believe was one of your questions. Those tuners can answer any question you may have because chances are, they have also dealt with ecmlink. Plus I gave you the name of someone and a link to a thread. Try sending 91stocker a PM... he is actually online right now.

 

[silicosys4]

Ok, well, I'll have to try that, in the meantime, anyone else on here even use Ostrich?

 

[91stocker]

Ds-map, jackal, and werewolf are all the same thing. Jackal with all the updates is now $20. Werewolf is the newest project with a few people using it now. More info at DS-MAP - Index

Tunerpro has a few people working with it over on DSM ECU. Tunerpro requires a pretty healthy knowledge programming and pc's in general but i hear good things.

Ive ran Jackal on my 5 speed car, just set it up on my new auto car. Got my first logs on the auto this past weekend, hope to get to some wot tuning soon.

Personally i would never tune a 1g with anything else. I love the ui and how it even feels tailor made for the dsm. If your tuner cant tune fuel and timing maps id find a new tuner .

It logs as fast as the ecu allows, no lift shift, studder box, anti lag, extra solenoid control for nitrous or alchy injection.

There are quite a few members using it, theres a thread in the drag forums of a guy on street tires and a holset running 10's tuned with dsmap.

I cant compare v3 and dsmap since ive never used v3 but i can say dsmap has been tuning speed density for years.

As far as backing, ostrich is being used on many many platforms (gm, ford, honda, nissan,and ofcourse dsm) and has been around for quite a while. Ostrich itself is just an ecu emulator which allows you to tune on the fly with the right software, such as Jackal, etc.

 

[silicosys4]

Its hard to bring any honest discussion to the table regarding supporting vendors on this website, but i won't go there. I have no idea why the guy who's tuning my car doesn't know Jackal, werewolf, or tunerpro, but i have the feeling he's a standalone/dsmlink kind of guy, I'm sure if he put some time and effort into it he'd be able to pick it up quick... I know he's want me to pay for him to learn it to put it on my car for me though, so no thanks there. It seems i'll have to look a little harder into this, it seems to have a lot of possibilities once you get over the fact that is about 300$ cheaper than DSMlink.

 

[91stocker]

Dont pay to have it installed. You can do it yourself in an afternoon.

Heres a good write up.
Complete How-To

Its the standard ve,timing, fuel maps. If he can tune aem he can use this with ease.

But yea i agree with you on the price. If you have an eprom, moates will socket your ecu for $25. You can find ostrich set ups for $100 sometimes even with the sensors. Those are really the only purchases you need to make. The sensors are $19 and $35 new. You can hard wire them or buy the full throttle maf adapter to make it completely plug and play. Besides you would need all of that to run link anyway.

 

[big_d]

I guess it really comes down to preference. I have used Jackal for two years now. I enjoy using it, and support is there from the ds-map forums. I have also tuned with link, and there is great support on the link forums too. The problem is people suggesting a tuning option without having any personal experience with the software. Just don't be that clown that preaches about some software, but has never plugged the laptop in by himself.

Regardless of which path you choose, keep your mind open to other options.

 

[silicosys4]

has anyone used both an ostrich and link on the same car with the same build?

 

[91stocker]

Ha i see what ya did there snowborder714...truth too much for this thread eh? Kind of point proven there...

I guess it really comes down to preference. I have used Jackal for two years now. I enjoy using it, and support is there from the ds-map forums. I have also tuned with link, and there is great support on the link forums too. The problem is people suggesting a tuning option without having any personal experience with the software. Just don't be that clown that preaches about some software, but has never plugged the laptop in by himself.

Regardless of which path you choose, keep your mind open to other options.

Well said

 

[snowborder714]

Ha i see what ya did there snowborder714...truth too much for this thread eh? Kind of point proven there...

It didn't provide any technical help, and was unnecessary.

 

[91stocker]

has anyone used both an ostrich and link on the same car with the same build?

What would be the point of that? They are fairly similar, enough so that i dont see any gains in either direction since they do the same thing. Well only v3 anyway. The only difference is the cost and preference i guess. A big decider for me was the fact that i would be supporting true dsm'ers. A few guys that have supported the dsm crowd with no monetary drive whatsoever. Offering one of the best tuning options a 1g can have for free, for years. Only recently have they started to charge anything at all. Newest version of Jackal is still only $20, basically free. Those guys need there own month, like black history month but dsmap month haha. They dont get the credit or respect they deserve imo.

It didn't provide any technical help, and was unnecessary.

Man you guys swarming this thread eh. 2 min reaction time haha. Its no biggy anyway, close enough haha.

 

[LandoAWD]

Ha i see what ya did there snowborder714...truth too much for this thread eh? Kind of point proven there...

It was antagonistic and you know it. Feel free to report any of the posts that you mentioned, and they will be handled. We'll be doing the same going "the other way" as well; your post proved THAT point.

Play nice, everyone.

 

[Chaosweaver]

So... How about that dsmap?

 

[Joeb_1]

The ostrich is the most common over here in the uk, everyone loves it.
There's a website called geekmapped ran in the uk which is hugely popular and has loads of ostrich base maps and setup info.

 

[XiKeiyaZI]

Jesus Christ - Now I recall one of the reasons I stopped being so active. Anywho...

I've personally ran both Ostrich and Link. Here's the breakdown -

Link - Link is a superb example of engine management. It offers everything from sparkly little knobs to brilliant coloring. Link offers the ability to Tune, right down to Injector Deadtime, Tip-In, adjust for additional displacement, and timing. Along with this, it also allows you to monitor your engine in real time. Want to test out solenoids? No problem. Do them individually. How about install a 1G Cas on a 2Ga without a misfire code? No problem. You can take a car above and beyond anything you'd like with relative ease with Link. The forums offer great support, ECMtuning has excellent customer service, it's a well known name, and it has a very modest learning curve.

Downside : Well, it'll empty your pockets about $600.

Verdict : I currently use Link and will not be replacing it. Being able to raise my care from 200ish HP to where it is now with a simple swap of a tune is great. Also, being able to go "Why do I have a CEL?" and simply power up the laptop and check Link - Then clear the Codes is great.

Ostrich : Ostrich is a great program in it's own way. It offers the ability to HEX edit the code for your ECU (your eprom is replaced by the actual Ostrich unit), thus allowing you to program in things like 2Step and Anti-Lag. You can adjust fuel maps, timing maps, set injector sizes, deadtimes, and so on.

Downside : There is not a lot of support. Virtually no one knows much about it in the DSM world as it is outweighed by Link, Evoflash, and AEM Stand alones. The learning curve is thus incredibly steep. As of the last I checked, you can, to some degree, log for a 1G, but it's not 2G friendly.

Verdict : Though I was able to get a nice gain in my vehicle using Ostrich, I hated the available interfaces. It was ridiculously hard to find much information on it, I didn't get to do 20% of what I wanted, and in the end I turned around and sold it without a second thought. Not to mention that Unlike link, you can't simply interface it with a new program, cable, or mod in your car. You have to judge and sort of guess, hoping you have it right.


The only other engine management I would even remotely suggest looking into is ECU+. I'm sure a few guys around here know what that is. It's pretty much Link ... but it's not.

There are several different tuning options out there and we each have our own preferences. However, I was one of those " God, Link is stupid expensive. Why should I not look into other options?" I now know why - It's easy, it's effective, and it produces great results.

 

[91stocker]

Jesus Christ - Now I recall one of the reasons I stopped being so active. Anywho...

I've personally ran both Ostrich and Link. Here's the breakdown -

Link - Link is a superb example of engine management. It offers everything from sparkly little knobs to brilliant coloring. Link offers the ability to Tune, right down to Injector Deadtime, Tip-In, adjust for additional displacement, and timing. Along with this, it also allows you to monitor your engine in real time. Want to test out solenoids? No problem. Do them individually. How about install a 1G Cas on a 2Ga without a misfire code? No problem. You can take a car above and beyond anything you'd like with relative ease with Link. The forums offer great support, ECMtuning has excellent customer service, it's a well known name, and it has a very modest learning curve.

Downside : Well, it'll empty your pockets about $600.

Verdict : I currently use Link and will not be replacing it. Being able to raise my care from 200ish HP to where it is now with a simple swap of a tune is great. Also, being able to go "Why do I have a CEL?" and simply power up the laptop and check Link - Then clear the Codes is great.

Ostrich : Ostrich is a great program in it's own way. It offers the ability to HEX edit the code for your ECU (your eprom is replaced by the actual Ostrich unit), thus allowing you to program in things like 2Step and Anti-Lag. You can adjust fuel maps, timing maps, set injector sizes, deadtimes, and so on.

Downside : There is not a lot of support. Virtually no one knows much about it in the DSM world as it is outweighed by Link, Evoflash, and AEM Stand alones. The learning curve is thus incredibly steep. As of the last I checked, you can, to some degree, log for a 1G, but it's not 2G friendly.

Verdict : Though I was able to get a nice gain in my vehicle using Ostrich, I hated the available interfaces. It was ridiculously hard to find much information on it, I didn't get to do 20% of what I wanted, and in the end I turned around and sold it without a second thought. Not to mention that Unlike link, you can't simply interface it with a new program, cable, or mod in your car. You have to judge and sort of guess, hoping you have it right.


The only other engine management I would even remotely suggest looking into is ECU+. I'm sure a few guys around here know what that is. It's pretty much Link ... but it's not.

There are several different tuning options out there and we each have our own preferences. However, I was one of those " God, Link is stupid expensive. Why should I not look into other options?" I now know why - It's easy, it's effective, and it produces great results.

What software did you use with ostrich? And was this on your 2g??? Also hes asking about ostrich, not link. You basically just turned this into another link vs dsmap thread.

 

[XiKeiyaZI]

What software did you use with ostrich?

Mostly I used TunerPro.

And was this on your 2g??? Also hes asking about ostrich, not link. You basically just turned this into another link vs dsmap thread.

You should probably read the last 2 or so lines of the original post.

Now as i read, it is sounding like a lot of people are putting Ostrich ahead of Link, but no one is giving specifics about why they prefer one over the other, other than price. Yes, Ostrich seems to be cheaper than link. Is it as capable?

To further back up the comparing of the two - I've used those two tuning solutions in the same vehicle. if you'd like, I can post all of my tuning solution experience.

 

[LandoAWD]

I'll clean this in the morning. This is an Ostrich based thread. Kei's comparison of the two was asked by the OP, so that information will remain. PM an objection if you have one.

No more about Link unless it specifically relates to the OPs question of who's run both.

 

[-red97rum-]

The ostrich is a great little device! It also opens up a few really good options for tuning your car. I personally use my ostrich to run Jackal and have been for probably more than a couple years now. It works great and you can change anything you want in your tune on the fly. Like has been mentioned, the support and resources for using an Ostrich are a little harder to find which really attributes to the so called learning curve. To me it was really easy once I figured out exactly how to interpret my logs and navigate the software. Both solutions are very capable of making big power.

You already have EcmLink so why are you worried about using anything else? It's not like you can sell Link now and switch without losing money.. So you might as well use it and and have a fun fast car

 

[91stocker]

Mostly I used TunerPro.


You should probably read the last 2 or so lines of the original post.


To further back up the comparing of the two - I've used those two tuning solutions in the same vehicle. if you'd like, I can post all of my tuning solution experience.

Reason for my questions are, you compared ostrich to link which you can not do. You can compare cables to cables since ostrich is only an emulator. Your comparison should have been tunerpro vs link since that was your experience. Which is also off topic by the way.

Kei's comparison of the two was asked by the OP, so that information will remain.

But as i said above his comparison made absolutely no sense. He compared link(which is software and a cable) to ostrich which is an emulator(no software, just a cable)

His comparison should have been tunerpro vs link since that was his experience. Also would have made a little more sense.

 

[XiKeiyaZI]

Reason for my questions are, you compared ostrich to link which you can not do. You can compare cables to cables since ostrich is only an emulator. Your comparison should have been tunerpro vs link since that was your experience. Which is also off topic by the way.



But as i said above his comparison made absolutely no sense. He compared link(which is software and a cable) to ostrich which is an emulator(no software, just a cable)

His comparison should have been tunerpro vs link since that was his experience. Also would have made a little more sense.

Sorry Lando, and Brian.

Based on this, you've obviously never laid a hand on Ostrich, probably not even Link - Judging. Let me break it down for you and anyone else interested in what it is and how it functions.

Ostrich - Ostrich is a small device which is linked to via a USB cable. This device is basically an EPROM in itself. It's base function - Store data. This data just so happens to be the very files you would find on your EPROM device if you were to pull it out and break it down. How does the Ostrich device interface with your ECU? There is a ribbon, much like one you would find in an older PC. This cable runs to a plug which is shaped like a stock EPROM chip. Considering you have an appropriately socketed EPROM (Keep in mind that the Ostrich unit is usable on multi-platforms, not specifically DSMs), it simply plugs into the place that a stock EPROM chip would plug into. When you turn on the key to kick power to the ECU, the Ostrich unit feeds information into the ECU and acts as an EPROM unit. What's so great about this? You can access, change information, and monitor information while the vehicle is running. That's right - Tune on the go.

Now, just to clarify - Tunerpro is simply a Utility used to Edit those Definitions and Bins which are the heart and soul of your car. These contain your maps, timing, injector information, and much much more. It's what your car looks at for data. Tunerpro is what I had the most experience with using. It is SIMPLY a FREE software which allows you to edit/log this information. While Ostrich doesn't need a software installed to use it, you have to have a software to edit/upload/download/monitor what's going on with the Ostrich Unit. It's much like a Flashable Black box ECU and you using Evoflash to flash information onto it. Same concept.

TunerPro -

TunerPro RT v5 covers all of the capabilities of the V4 software, as well as many new features including support for the Quarterhorse with Ford A9L and T4M0 datalogging. Advanced ADX configuration and plug-in support opens new doors for communications flexibility.

This highly configurable software supports MANY vehicles including GMOBD1, Ford, Nissan, BMW, Porsche, and others.

TunerProRT5 is fully functional immediately upon download free of charge. If you enjoy its functionality, you may purchase a license here.

Vehicle-specific BIN files can be edited using XDF definitions, while ADX files are used for datalogging. Native support for all Moates hardware including AutoProm, ALDU1, Burn2, Ostriches, Roadrunner, Quarterhorse, and Jaybird

The Ostrich Unit -

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Check it - It's Small. No software. That ribbon runs into your ECU.

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This is a blank Eprom Chip like what's found in your ECU. Ostrich emulates this.

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By Replacing it like this ...

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All of the information you would normally find on that little black chip can be uploaded to the Ostrich Unit, allowing it to be readily accessed, edited, and removed. That is Ostrich's SOUL DESIGN. It's YOUR job to have access to a Program to do this as well as take the time to learn how to do it.



Link - Link is, as stated, a chip, a cable, and software. The Link installation process has you replace your stock Eprom chip with it's specially made rewritable/editable chip which also includes more RAM for better speed. The cable given allows you to interface via your OBD(II) port to your ECU and tune from there. The reason the Cable for Link is considered Special is because it has hardware built into it to decipher the information from the ECU into usable and readable format for you/your computer and the reverse. That's it. Unlike Ostrich, you feed through your OBD(II) plug whereas with Ostrich you have a direct USB link from your laptop to the device. If there is something wrong with your OBD(II) port then you're in for some work trying to diagnose it.


Now, keep in mind this is not a 'who's better' post. This is relevant information that was asked for. Seeing as how there is obviously a bit of confusion as to how Ostrich works, it's imperative that it be detailed for those curious about investing in it. This is simply a comparison as was asked for. No one is saying that either/or is better - Simply which does what, how they stack up against one another, and how it works. Don't fly off the handle simply because someone mentions a software name people. We all support what we wish and use which we find more practical. I've used various solutions. Ostrich was nice but just didn't have a few features I wanted. Does this mean that I don't like Ostrich? No. It's a lower budget tuning solution that works if you put the time and effort into it.

Hope this helps.

 

[tkelly27]

I could see someone with a 2g not being fond of the ostrich. The community that modifies binaries is mostly 1g based. The only info I've ever seen for 2g binaries was on Ceddy's page and he's moved on to flashing. If I had a 2g I would not consider the ostrich an option.

I've been using the ostrich so long I actually have the first version.

If you have a 1g and you ever plan on tuning different platforms the ostrich is a really great way to go. I have tuned my eagle, a nissan, and 3 different dodges with it. When I am done I read the binary off the ostrich and burn a chip. A chip burner is ~$50. Most everything that has a 28 pin eprom can be tuned with the ostrich. The process for doing so is much better defined for certain platforms vs. others.

There is some more freedom afforded with the ostrich. Not that you need more to have a car that runs well, but some of us really like to dig in. There is a guy on dsm-ecu forums describing the modifications he did to his binary to be more fuel efficient that goes way beyond just leaning out the tables.

I think it is telling that almost no one switches once they have picked one tuning option or the other. There are so many variables, I don't think you'll be able to see a power difference between any properly tuned system that can be attributed to how it was tuned.

 

[natertater]

I have been to their website, but I'm asking the members here whether or not they use it, and what they think of it. I'm sure if i go to the ds-map forum it will be a lot of rave reviews, just like at the ecmlink forum.

I use it, and like it a lot. I got the software back when it was free. Its pretty easy to use, but sometimes the guys on the site are too sarcastic, but after razzing you a bit, they will help out. Everything is pretty straight forward and button layout is good. they stopped with basic jackal, its final as is. i had some issues with my evo injectors and idle control, cold starts, etc. i switched to speed density and that has all went away. i dont have my tune nailed down yet, but no more surging idle, high idle when cold, thick black smoke, etc anymore.