new engine wont start

[canonize-ryda]

Cranks but won't quite get there. Has a new ecu. Has an old gas tank that had no gas in it so i put about a gallon of 91 in it. i can see smoke come out of the muffler when cranking. My boost raises to around 4 when cranking. I can smell old gas smell when i crank it(face next to the motor). All fuses are okay, all connections connected, but my thermo sensor blade broke so i just wrapped the wire on it(hope that will work). I pulled the plugs(i have new wires) and they were black so i cleaned them up with a wire brush and regapped them. And still no start. Manifold has a crack in it and it smokes a little as well. Besides all the what can i check? how can i check for fuel pressure easily? And anything you guys can think of that will help? I planned on getting more gas for it just in case its not enough, i also planned on maybe replacing the plugs completely. Thanks for any help

 

[canonize-ryda]

Timing is still aligned from what i can see when i check. I have not checked compression, easy way to check compression without spending much money? Thanks

 

[SpoollinAwd]

Just go get a compression tool at local auto parts store you may be able to rent it not much at all.

 

[Anubis_4_99]

i bought my very nice compression tester for $45 at autozone, has dual threads on it for different spark plug sizes, and attachments for others

i would imagine you could pick up a cheapo one for under $30, and im fairly certain that they do rent them out. the charge you for it as a security deposit then give your cash back when you return it

 

[canonize-ryda]

K looks like i'm off for a compression tester tomorrow. So do i just turn it over with just the plug hole im testing out? Sorry i've never done a test before and i've done 3 motor swaps....

 

[miguelmcv]

Take the plug off and install the compression tester, Crank it and check the compression.
Put the plug back and take the other plug off and repeat the process till you do all four.

 

[SpoollinAwd]

I usually warm engine up I know u cant do it just take all plugs out and put the tool in one by one crank 4 times let me know your results.

 

[canonize-ryda]

Will get the tool after work here in a few hours..But i will post them...

 

[arrowhead]

Take the plug off and install the compression tester, Crank it and check the compression.
Put the plug back and take the other plug off and repeat the process till you do all four.

NO, that is not the way you do a comp. test.

What you are looking for in a comp test is evenness, in a no start condition like you have it does not matter that your engine is cold.

Take all 4 plugs out keep them in order and find a way to keep your throttle open
disable your ignition so you do not get any sparks, crank engine over for at least 3 complete revolutions

 

[canonize-ryda]

Would just disconnecting the plugs wires work to eliminate spark? And floor the pedal to open throttle?

 

[Dhan]

Would just disconnecting the plugs wires work to eliminate spark? And floor the pedal to open throttle?

That's what I do. I remove all four wires from the plugs and move them out of the way. They will still spark, but they won't harm anything. Make sure to mark them or have notes, so you put them back on the correct plugs.

Take out the first plug and screw in the hose to the first spark plug seat. Then crank the engine and let it go for three to five revolutions. Take a note of what number you get and repeat for the remaining three cylinders.

Like stated above, you're looking for evenness. Also take note, your numbers will be a bit lower then normal, as you're doing the test 'cold'.

This is your run of the mill tester. Hose with a gauge.

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In this article, the guy goes into some detail. Not all will apply to your case.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-420a-specific/258957-compression-test.html


Post the results. Also, double check all your vacuum lines. Have you checked your idle switch sing a voltmeter? It should be at .48-.52V If that's off, it won't start.

 

[99vipereater]

Would just disconnecting the plugs wires work to eliminate spark? And floor the pedal to open throttle?

Or you could just pull the plug off the coil pack! That's alot easier and you won't shock the shot out of yourself. Also disconnect either the fuel pump under the rear seat or pull the MPI relay.

 

[canonize-ryda]

Wheres my idle switch? I swapped this engine in exactly how it was in the other car and connected everything up in my car. I can't rent a tester from o-rielly's so i'm going to have to call napa. Unless i can make a home tester out of a ac compression tester or something i can't afford 55 for a tester atm. Here in a few i'm going to check to make sure the fuel pump is working. Then i'm going to check if its sparking. Then on friday i'll buy a tester and test it if it isn't fixed by then. Thanks for all the help guys

 

[Dhan]

This is the idle switch on a '90. You loosen these two screws to adjust it, after you test it. To test if it's set right, you use a voltmeter on the #19 and #24 wires on the ECU harness.

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But, if you swapped the motor w/o touching anything, I don't think this is your problem.



Sounds like you've got a good plan going though. Checking the four main points the engine needs is always a good start (fuel, spark, compression, and timing).

$55 for a tester is a bit much. It'll probably last a lifetime though. Here's a tester on Amazon for $25 Amazon.com: Actron CP7826 Compression Tester: Automotive
So there are deals out there. Harbor Freight's got them for like $20 too. They have a fuel pressure tester kit that works great as well (if you don't already have one).

You don't know, by any chance, how the motor was running in the old car do you? I'm going to say the compression is probably fine, as you wouldn't have swapped this motor if it wasn't running right. It's probably a fuel or timing issue.

When you lined up the timing, was it completely spot on? Also, what plugs do you have?

 

[canonize-ryda]

It was running for the previous owner, reason for switching is his sychros on his tranny went out and we had another car with bent valves so we did the swap. He replaced the timing belt, water pump, alternator and a few other things. When i did the timing the cams wouldn't line up perfectly till i held it with a wrench and brought it into line with the other one, then i put the belt on and they stayed there. Its still lined up when i checked the cams from the top. I did check and the FPR has semi yellowish fuel coming out. fuel pump working and its got spark i just checked those out minutes ago. Maybe injectors? The injectors are out of the older engine that has been sitting. It has ngk plugs and they are the stock number 6's. I swapped in his ecu since my car was a California car. Maybe some more high octane gas and some Heat or fuel injector cleaner? I can't wait to get my first dsm running. So i thank everyone for helping me out.

 

[Dhan]

The exhaust cam will want to rotate counter-clockwise and not stay dead center. That's normal.

Sounds silly, but are the wires in the correct order from the coil pack to the plugs?

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[canonize-ryda]

Yea they are and i just put a gallon more of 91 and some heet in. I pulled the plugs after cranking a little and there was unburnt gas on them. Is this mean i may need new plugs? i say these plugs were straight black before i wire brushed them. Maybe there not sparking? My plugs are sparking pretty nicely. Besides a compression check i'm at the end of my rope of things to try. Can i hold my palm over the hole and see if it creates any pressure?

And it was the exhaust cam that wouldn't line up.

Could i use a different car fuel filter for a short while?(I still have an old one in.)

 

[Dhan]

Well they'll be a little wet from cranking it. You're sure it's gas, and not oil or coolant? Too much gas and they'll short out and not spark of course, it sounds like you have spark though.

Someone else will probably beat me to it with more advice and/or solutions, but let me give it some thought and I'll post another idea

Sounds like you're really close. Maybe the compression test will shed some light.

 

[arrowhead]

Would just disconnecting the plugs wires work to eliminate spark? And floor the pedal to open throttle?

Again, NO you must get all plugs out your engine will turn faster so it can get some air to compress if not you will not get proper readings.

 

[canonize-ryda]

Would my turbo elbow hooked into the boost solenoid then into the wastegate have anything to do with it? And i can hear my BOV i think when trying to start it. These injectors could have been sitting for up to 5 years, maybe i swap in some newer ones i have sitting around? Is there a plug that i can clip into a computer and have it tell me whats wrong? I am going to go crazy figuring this out. Maybe i have no compression..........SAD all that work for nothing...

 

[miguelmcv]

Check this out.
It has some good information.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-miscellaneous/217951-how-diagnose-no-start.html

 

[canonize-ryda]

Already tried most of that besides a compression test. I checked it when i was searching. Good stuff though thanks.

 

[Tyeler18]

Plugs are cheap. If theyre old replace them. I put a new clutch in my old 93 N/T parts car. It ran fine prior to the clutch, afterwards it wouldn't start. Pulled the plugs and they were black. Put new plugs in and she fired on the first crank and runs great to this day.

You also need more than just 2 gallons of gas in an empty tank. I'd put at minimum 5 gallons of premium in and see how she does. Get back to us from there.

I had a nasty no start to solve on my 1g when I bought it, I literally went through everything before figuring it out. If you need any info don't be afraid to hit me with a PM.

 

[Chazz1978]

Theres only a few things for a no start situation. Fuel, fire, and compression. Yes I would take all the plugs out for test. if you have a running car you dont want to test it running. If you pulled the fuel line return off the rail you got fuel good. You said you have spark right ok good. Now you need to check compression.

 

[canonize-ryda]

O yeah the plugs are as old as the injectors. I may buy some cheapest ones i can find just to get her started. I'm running very budget right now. Figured she be running since i have actually drove in this car like 4 years ago. They sat and now they wont start.

I drained the other gallon i put in to put a more cleaner gallon in. So yea i'd agree that i need more gas. I have a van that wont start up if it doesn't have at least 2 gallons or more in it.

And i do always have newer injectors i can try, but it would at least fire i would think with almost any injector. I have a job today for cash so i may go get more gas and try that first. Thanks

Also should i hear my bov recirculating? Cause when and if i pump the gas it makes that noise. Just i have people who work on big blocks tell me it sounds like some kind of air backfire, but neither have ever driven a turbo car before. So i think there just full of shit.