Multiple oil drain plug replacements

[ShockDSM]

Hello community! Lost the pass to my old account and forgot the email so here I am all young and probationary.. Just recently bought a 1990 gsx 5 speed that was not running, seized calipers flat tires and had been sitting for 3 years. So far I have purchased a ton of used and new parts for it but have been focusing on the maintenence. (Including $500 at stm on a kevlar/mitsu component timing kit with waterpump.) I changed the oil in it to Casterol GTX 5w30 and got her some new NGK plugs and wires and a bottle of seafoam later and she's running pretty well and driving well now that I fixed the tires and brakes. I even sanded her down and rattlecanned the car as I plan to wrap it anway. (Looks 100 times better now.) Anyway, my problem is that after driving it to work I noticed the drain plug was leaking pretty badly. So I bought a new one with a built in rubber seal at O'rileys and put that in and it still leaked bad. I then thought it was the pan but after closer inspection. The plug was still the only thing leaking. The rubber seal was junk and came apart where it connected to the plug. So I drained the oil again and got some copper crush washers that were size m14 that the erraogant older dick at O'rileys assured me would work, smugly smiling at me like I was a complete f***ing idot for even asking even though I voiced that the crush washer was larger than the original and wiggled around the plug a little bit if you shook it. (Not like the original mitsu washer that actually threads on to the plug. I put the stock plug with the new crush washer in torqued to 25 ft/lb and sure enough it still leaked tonight. Tomorrow I have stm sending me some mitsu ones, I'm afraid they might leak too as this is my 4th attempt. Stock bolt threads look okay after wire wheeling it. Do I need to replace it with mitsu plug? Oil pan surface is flat and I have cleaned it with brake clean and sand paper with the hole plugged with a little paper shop towell. Thanks for reading my long story and let me know what you guys come up with. Teflon tape maybe an idea at base of plug before crush washer goes on? Thanks again! -Rob

 

[Nate355RS]

The threads aren't tapered and arent designed to seal. Keeping the oil in is the job of the gasket, so if it's leaking that likely your problem. Teflon tape might work if you put it on thick enough. If you're worried the new bolts and gasket will still leak, a little RTV on both sides of the gasket should help.

 

[chrysler kid]

Teflon tape should work. I'm using a generic autozone magnetic plug no leaks.

 

[TSiAWD666]

Get the right gasket and get yourself a Fumoto drain valve so you don't have to deal with gaskets again. So much nicer, and you don't have to risk getting your hand covered in oil either during changes. Only mod I would make is roughly a 1/2" slot cut into the threads vertically (when the valve is upright in its normal installed position) to make sure you get as much oil out as possible as when installed.

 

[ShockDSM]

So I ordered a new Mitsu crush washer (was told its very soft unlike the copper ones at the auto parts store) and a new Mitsu bolt and I am going to try that. If it doesn't work, Ill try the teflon take and a fumoto valve. That looks like the way to go with this kind of problem anyways. That way I wont have to take it out every oil change and risk springing a leak again. Right now I have a black plastic like material flat gasket/washer in there with an advanced auto parts m14x1.50 drain plug and it's leaking about 1 drop every 8 seconds when the car is warm. Probably coming out a LOT more when under boost.

 

[TSiAWD666]

You would use the mitsu gasket with the fumoto valve.

 

[ShockDSM]

Alright guys, time for an update! Well, I used the Mitsu crush washer with the oem bolt and its leaking way worse than it was with the plastic type material flat gasket. With the flat black plastic one it leaked about 1 drip every 15 seconds with a hot motor. Now I am at work with a FAT 1x1 sqft. puddle under my car from just driving it here this morning. I am considering a Fumoto drain valve or an oversized piggyback plug but I have heard the oversized plugs are hard to get threaded in straight and can go in crooked and F shit up worse. With the Fumoto oil drain valve, I plan to drain the oil completely, spray the pan down completely with brake clean (including the hole) and wipe the hole out with paper towel until i can get the hole nice and dry. Then I plan on using some Permatex high temp thread sealant on the threads of the valve, and use the gasket that it comes with but put a light coating of Ultra black or "The right stuff" grey Permatex on both sides of the Fumoto gasket right before installation. I will then install the Fumoto drain valve and let the thread sealant and the RTV dry for a full 24 hours. I pray to god this works because I am FED UP with this. I'm about ready to pull the pan next but I'm so afraid to snap some of the bolts that go into the block, the bolts are SO rusted and rounded looking. Thought about using teflon tape for the oil drain bolt but dont wanna get a piece of it in my oil and teflon tape isn't really for sealing straight cut threads, its for tapered threads. Anyways let me know if you have any recommendations. Thanks! -Rob

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[chrysler kid]

Your threads are stripped, see if they have an oversized drain plug at your local auto parts store.

 

[jakk220]

I would have to say if the threads are stripped I would just replace the oil pan and drain plug. Just soak those bolts in pb blaster for a few days and then try to take them out. If the break off then you will just have to drill and tap.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Replace the pan. And while your at it stop using 5w30 and use 10w30. I use 20w50 in mh race motor

 

[Chumpaumpalumpa]

I use 20w-50 as well. DSMs like at least 10w-30. Thicker oil could help with the leak too.

 

[ShockDSM]

Here are some pictures of the oil pan drain hole flange. After a closer look today it seems a bit warped but it still looks like it should seal to me with having a rubber or metal (crush) washer gasket around the bolt. I really don't want to drop the pan if I don't have to so hopefully I can get this fumoto drain valve to seal with permatex thread seal and some ultra black on both sides of the gasket that it comes with. Let me know if you guys have any other ideas such as maybe a flat piece of metal over the hole and hammering it a little to try and flatten the surface out a little? Thanks

 

[ShockDSM]

Welp, I said F it. I figured I would try the fumoto oil valve with ultra black (highest oil resistance) RTV on both sides of the gasket and a ring of permatex high temp thread sealant around the center of the threads of the valve. Before I put her in I let the oil drain overnight, lowered the car a little to keep the residual oil down in the pan and away from the hole. Then, I cleaned the surface of the pan and drain hole with tons of fresh paper towell and brake clean, then alcohol and let dry. Pics attached, fingers crossed!

 

[chrysler kid]

Threads look fine on the pan, is it possible the leak is coming down the pan and collecting on the drain bolt? It looks like there is oil on your axle above the drain bolt but it's hard to tell

5W30 Is thin for the 4g63. My theory is the motors have too much crank case pressure for thin oils, but fact is the car is much happier running 15w40 rotella. Even with brand new seals and fresh rtv I had small leaks on synthetic 5w30. Never made the drain bolt leak though

 

[ShockDSM]

No the pan is bone dry. Cept for a small amount leaking out of the oil return from the turbo side of the return line. It's forsure the drain plug but hopefully this fix will work. Rtv is out drying in the garage. I've been running the heater for 15 mins at a time to keep the RTV warm so it can dry. As for the oil, I chose 5w30 cause that's what I read michigan dsmer use in the winter. I've got a bottle of Lucas oil stabilizer in there too so that's making my oil a little bit heavier.c I'll switch to 10 or 15 or, 30 or 40.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Good luck, if replace that pan anyway since it looks effin nasty and badly rusted. Thats just me though, new pans come with new plug. Or get a new used pan thag looks better.

 

[ShockDSM]

Thanks, this whole car is pretty effin nasty and badly rusted . STM has brand new aluminum oil pans from spectre that they sell for $90, same pan on auto parts online website i see for $60 so maybe I'll pick one up. Just didn't really wanna do an oil pan job. Have done one before on a 1g awd and they pretty much suck on your back under the car. Although I already have a ss oil pan bolt set from stm so might as well do it if this doesn't work.

 

[GST with PSI]

The Spectra oil pan (not to be confused with Spectre, who also manufacture oil pans) is the typical parts store brand. It's a quality unit, and I've personally used a few of them.

FYI, It's made of steel, not aluminum.

http://www.streettunedmotorsports.com/parts/dsm_oil_pan_6_bolt_4g63.htm

 

[ShockDSM]

My bad GST, Jon from STM told me that it was aluminum, and yes Spectra is the correct name. Here's the same pan for $59 and some change.
www.rockauto.com

 

[Turboterd]

We're you able to get that drain valve to seal with the rtv?
I might put that valve in on my car, drain plugs leaks slightly too.

Have you seen our checked for any cracks around the drain hole? I wonder if the pitted surface is allowing it to trickle past the seal/crush gasket.

 

[ShockDSM]

So far I have had the front end of the car way up in the air on jack/stands to let the remaining oil tilt back in the pan. It's been 72 hours and I'm about to fill her up tonight and check for leaks. But the rtv and thread sealant should be cured by now completely and the valve and seal around it look really good, so I'm hoping it's going to hold! The valve is sweet dude I recommend it so far and when installed with the gasket it comes with (composite nylon) the valve sits at roughly 1:30 o'clock which is nice it's Not upside down and not going to hit anything I run over. Might put a mini hose clamp over the valve to keep the lever from ever turning and letting the oil out as added safety measure, however the lever is real stiff to turn already and feels very safe and sound.