Ecu+ ?

[Dyncaus]

Well from what I have read, the Random misfire error occurs after doing a 6-bolt swap. The reason is because the 6-bolt doesn't have a crank angle sensor like the 7-bolt does. Therefore you have to use the cam angle sensor for both readings, which provides a rather inaccurate reading for the crank. Many 2G ecu's are sensitive about the crank sensor and when it gets the signal from the cam sensor it thinks something is wrong and throws out a random misfire code when the car is not really misfiring. It goes into safe mode and shuts down one or two cylinders which causes the car to run horribly. If there were some way ECU+ could fix this then it would solve a whole lot of problems for people who have done the 1G in a 2G swap. If anyone else knows more about the random misfire problem, ring in, that is just what I have read about it.

 

[tlcoll1]

Well from what I have read, the Random misfire error occurs after doing a 6-bolt swap. The reason is because the 6-bolt doesn't have a crank angle sensor like the 7-bolt does. Therefore you have to use the cam angle sensor for both readings, which provides a rather inaccurate reading for the crank. Many 2G ecu's are sensitive about the crank sensor and when it gets the signal from the cam sensor it thinks something is wrong and throws out a random misfire code when the car is not really misfiring. It goes into safe mode and shuts down one or two cylinders which causes the car to run horribly. If there were some way ECU+ could fix this then it would solve a whole lot of problems for people who have done the 1G in a 2G swap. If anyone else knows more about the random misfire problem, ring in, that is just what I have read about it.

I did some creative Googling on this topic, and I think I understand the issue. Correct me if I'm wrong.

The 1G, early 2G, late 2G and EVOs have, from an electrical perspective, the same crank sensor. All four, however, have different cam sensors (again, electrically - it really doesn't matter physically). It seems like the people with this problem are using a 1G cam sensor to talk to the 2G ECU.

If this is what's going on, then there's good news. The ECU+ already (somewhat accidently) will take care of this. The ECU+ regenerates both the cam and crank angle sensor signals (and slides them around to adjust timing), and you can independently select which input and output cam sensors it will receive/generate. So the answer should be you just plug in the new motor , plug in the ECU+, and tell it to expect a 1G cam sensor on the input and to generate a 2G (early or late, as you wish) cam sensor. From there, the 2G ECU won't know anything funny is going on.

The reason, BTW, that I put this feature in is that a) I wanted to support multiple cars, and b) my '95 Eclipse has a '97 cam sensor.

Tom

 

[Blk_99gst]

I had some other good points I made in another ecu+ thread that I would like to bring here too:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?p=981585#post981585

Talking about if the ecu+ can read 2g knock:

This is my number one feature request, and high on my to-do list.

First let me quote yourself:

Unfortunately, the ECU+ can't turn off the CEL checks, since it runs externally to the stock ECU - it doesn't have access to the stock ECU internals.

Good luck trying to come up with a knock algorithm to try and "guess" what the 2g ecu is seeing for knock. Since you say it yourself, you can't see inside the chip, so any knock count number you would produce is not the true knock count the ecu is using. Let's equate it to someone who hooks up their safc to monitor o2 voltage. That's O.K (actually not really), but what's better is to use a pocketlogger to see the ACTUAL o2 voltage the ecu is using for it's calculations.

Which brings up another key point. Since you are "outside" the ecu you are missing some other KEY parameters that the pocketlogger (who reads actual ecu values) can provide, short and long term fuel trims. 2g (and 1g) use these religously to tune for idle. Even if you connect a wideband ($450) to your unit to try and tune idle, you still can't since the ecu uses the trims to cycle normally. The wideband could be reading 14.7 but the trims to provide that 14.7 a/f ratio could be way off.

Don't get me wrong, I applaud you for making something new, and it has many good things like high sample rate and lots of tuning points, but it misses key features like CEL clearing and the fuel trim values. Also more and more people are using the maft+pocketlogger combo for logging and fuel adjustment. (Although I personally don't like the maft tuning capabilites). When it comes down to it, if I'm going to spend more than a few hundred for a safc and a pocketlogger, then I'm going all the way and getting dsm link where you can see ACTUAL ecu knock count. With that value alone, you don't need a wideband or anything.

EDIT: Another cool feature about the pocketlogger is that it can be used on multiple cars. I can't tell you how many free dinners I've gotten from other eclipse friends for logging their cars. And I've cleared CEL's on lots of OBDII cars, bmw's, eclipses, vw's, etc. That's something both dsmlink or the ecu+ can't do (help your other eclipse friends out...)

 

[oddrob]

How many people are having troubles with a random misfire code? I have never had that trouble doing a 6-bolt in a 2g unless occasionally with 272 or bigger cams. Just curious. I've been running the ECU+ for almost a year now and will say it is a great tuning tool that fills a perfect niche, most of which have been discussed here already. Thats the great part about America, theres always plenty of options for everyone. And there will always be people who love or hate every single option and want more.

 

[Dyncaus]

Well on the yahoo 1gina2g group, there are a of posts about the random misfire problem. I have found a few on here as well while searching around. I think its one of those things where sometimes the ECU doesn't like it and sometimes the ECU doesn't car, but my car is so awesome that it died from crankwalk and then had the random misfire problem as well. I guess I am just lucky.

 

[Blk_99gst]

I'm moving our ecu+ coversation from another thread:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?p=981585#post981585
...to this real ecu+ thread

Everyone I know of including myself purchased our safc's off ebay. You can get new, used, safcI, safcII. safcI which will still do the job well; one is going for $199 with no bids. And safcII new unit have a buy it now at 268.

Well, I definitely can't compete, price-wise, with used Super AFCs, especially the cheesy first generation models. On the $268 price for the new one, that sure sounds like a bunch of 'em "fell off of a truck!"

Good luck trying to come up with a knock algorithm to try and "guess" what the 2g ecu is seeing for knock. Since you say it yourself, you can't see inside the chip, so any knock count number you would produce is not the true knock count the ecu is using. Let's equate it to someone who hooks up their safc to monitor o2 voltage. That's O.K (actually not really), but what's better is to use a pocketlogger to see the ACTUAL o2 voltage the ecu is using for it's calculations.

I understand your point, but I don't agree with your conclusions. In the ECU+, I'll (soon) be looking at the real knock sensor, just like the stock ECU does. So I won't be guessing at knock, I'll know exactly what it is, and there's a good chance I'll be able to come up with an equivalent to that "knock sum" number inside the stock ECU that's pretty darn close. And since the knock sum is such a low resolution value, I may well be able to better detect the onset of knock than the stock ECU, in which case it'll be easier to tune.

FYI - some other folks have asked me about adding a "knock reduction" feature to the ECU+, where it could manipulate the knock signal to the stock ECU. This would "fool" the stock ECU into thinking it had less knock than the sensor reads, to eliminate the "phantom knock" problem that some 1G owners have.

Which brings up another key point. Since you are "outside" the ecu you are missing some other KEY parameters that the pocketlogger (who reads actual ecu values) can provide, short and long term fuel trims. 2g (and 1g) use these religously to tune for idle. Even if you connect a wideband ($450) to your unit to try and tune idle, you still can't since the ecu uses the trims to cycle normally. The wideband could be reading 14.7 but the trims to provide that 14.7 a/f ratio could be way off.

Again, I think we disagree. It seems to me that religiously tuning for zero fuel trims is missing the big picture. The fuel trims are in the stock ECU for a reason, and they compensate for normal wear and tear on the fuel system. If you picked a random good-running stock DSM out of a parking lot, and checked the fuel trims, you'd probably find them to be non-zero, because maybe the injectors are a little clogged, or weren't perfect from the factory. I believe that if you keep the fuel trims reasonably small then you're probably fine, and the stock ECU will do its job just like it was designed. If your fuel trims are way out of whack, you'll be able to see that (at idle and cruising) with the front O2 pegged in either direction. At that point, you know you have some tuning to do.

I'm exaggerating here, but when you refill the gas tank, do you double-check and re-adjust the fuel trims for zero? A bad batch of gas could well move them from zero, couldn't it?

Also, the wideband isn't really used for setting up idle. You use it in WOT conditions to ensure that you're not running lean, since the car's stock O2 sensor isn't accurate enough to tell you so. Some people like to use EGTs for this purpose, but I think the wideband is a better (though more expensive) solution.

Don't get me wrong, I applaud you for making something new,

No offense taken. I enjoy these types of debates.

and it has many good things like high sample rate and lots of tuning points, but it misses key features like CEL clearing and the fuel trim values.

With the CEL clearing, I guess I tend to wonder if maybe it's not better to attack the source of the CEL than to just turn it off. Seems kind-of hacky to me.
Quote:
Also more and more people are using the maft+pocketlogger combo for logging and fuel adjustment.

The MAFT functionality is on my radar as well. Hopefully, it'll be free.

When it comes down to it, if I'm going to spend more than a few hundred for a safc and a pocketlogger, then I'm going all the way and getting dsm link where you can see ACTUAL ecu knock count. With that value alone, you don't need a wideband or anything.

Well, two things on this...

1. The DSMlink is $645 for most folks, plus the cost ($150 or so, it says on the DSMlink site) if you don't have a 2G-95 ECU, so there's definitely a non-trivial price difference between the DSMlink and some of the other combinations.

2. You can't really know what your air/fuel ratio is without a wideband. Instead, with the DSMlink, you're just counting on it doing the right thing in using knock to retard timing. These aren't exactly the same thing.

Tom

 

[Blk_99gst]

I understand your point, but I don't agree with your conclusions. In the ECU+, I'll (soon) be looking at the real knock sensor, just like the stock ECU does. So I won't be guessing at knock, I'll know exactly what it is, and there's a good chance I'll be able to come up with an equivalent to that "knock sum" number inside the stock ECU that's pretty darn close. And since the knock sum is such a low resolution value, I may well be able to better detect the onset of knock than the stock ECU, in which case it'll be easier to tune.

You're still going to try and come up with a number that you think the ecu is seeing. I believe the ecu takes lots of things into account when determining to pull timing, knock count, throttle position, airflow, air temp. Yes you have all these signals and wires available too. It's pretty much known that for 0-3 counts of knock ecu advances timing, 3-7 timing stays the same, and above 7 timing gets pulled. So I think it's going to be hard if not impossible for you to say that the at xxxx rpm the ecu is seeing 6 counts of knock. I would trust an external device's knock value as much as I would trust the o2 blue wire mod voltage on a safc (which is a very bad thing to do). If anything, I don't want to tap the knock wire to the ecu; you can potentically cause problems with the knock siganl the ecu is seeing, causing knock that isn't there to be detected, or knock that is there not to be detected.
Also, how would your method be any different then the knock functionality on the safc2. We all know that doesn't work for dsm's. Sure you can hook it up and it will give you some knock value counts, but they don't mean anything.

FYI - some other folks have asked me about adding a "knock reduction" feature to the ECU+, where it could manipulate the knock signal to the stock ECU. This would "fool" the stock ECU into thinking it had less knock than the sensor reads, to eliminate the "phantom knock" problem that some 1G owners have.

That's just a REALLY bad idea. There's a cause for real knock or phantom knock, and the fix is not to alter the signal to the ecu. The fix is better tuning to eliminate real knock, or not running so rich which usually produces phantom knock.
Read this thread:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=121144
And you'll see someone more about how it's a bad idea to alter the knock sensor signal.

And if you give people the option to do it, then you will get some idiots who will say "Hey my car goes faster and I get better timing advance if I just reduce this knock value a little."

I believe that if you keep the fuel trims reasonably small then you're probably fine, and the stock ECU will do its job just like it was designed. If your fuel trims are way out of whack, you'll be able to see that (at idle and cruising) with the front O2 pegged in either direction. At that point, you know you have some tuning to do.

You have to remember who your users are. It's a lot easier to tell the average joe with a pocketlogger to tune your low settings so the long term fuel trim value equals zero, plus or minus a few. People can do that. But telling them to tune by just looking at how the front o2 sensor is oscillating; that's not going to cut it. So if your fuel trims are pegged at +25 (too lean, ecu is having to add 25% more fuel), then you might see the o2 voltage not oscillating and hovering around 0V. For one you'll get a CEL for bad fuel trims, but then using your method you'll adjust them to where the o2 sensor is oscillating again, but that might only bring fuel trims down to +20; which is still way out of wack in my opinion.

Also, the wideband isn't really used for setting up idle. You use it in WOT conditions to ensure that you're not running lean, since the car's stock O2 sensor isn't accurate enough to tell you so. Some people like to use EGTs for this purpose, but I think the wideband is a better (though more expensive) solution.

Yes, I know, I have a wideband. In my example I was trying to say how you could use the wideband to try and help the ecu+ to tune idle/fuel trims. Just like if the front o2 sensor wasn't oscillating, the wideband could read something other than the ideal 14.7 at idle.

No offense taken. I enjoy these types of debates.

So do I... I like talking electrical/tuning/ecu stuff.

With the CEL clearing, I guess I tend to wonder if maybe it's not better to attack the source of the CEL than to just turn it off. Seems kind-of hacky to me.

I TOTALLY agree. But you still need a method to pull the code first. Funny how you mention just clearing the CEL code is kind of hacky. I feel the same way about a knock reduction feature, a hack method instead of fixing the real knock causing problem.

The MAFT functionality is on my radar as well. Hopefully, it'll be free.

Really? How would do that. I guess you could make a gm maf to eclipse maf connector, then your device hold constant the temp and baro wires. Then you need to convert the gm signal to the karmen hz signal taking into account constant temp and baro values. I'm sure there's a lot more to it, and I doubt Mike at fullthrottlespeed is going to give out his code for free.

2. You can't really know what your air/fuel ratio is without a wideband. Instead, with the DSMlink, you're just counting on it doing the right thing in using knock to retard timing. These aren't exactly the same thing.

I think if I had dsmlink and could see my 2g knock count, then I wouldn't need my wideband. Tuning via knock is the best thing. Tuning via a wideband is good, but if I tune for 11.5, I could still be getting excessive knock and not know about it.

 

[tlcoll1]

Wow, long thread.

You're still going to try and come up with a number that you think the ecu is seeing.

We'll see. I think I can do it, and I'm pretty big on quality, so if my estimate of knock isn't anything like the stock ECU's, I won't ship it. I hate to get into a long discussion on this since though I haven't completed the feature yet.

I would trust an external device's knock value as much as I would trust the o2 blue wire mod voltage on a safc (which is a very bad thing to do). If anything, I don't want to tap the knock wire to the ecu; you can potentically cause problems with the knock siganl the ecu is seeing, causing knock that isn't there to be detected, or knock that is there not to be detected.

Sure, it's certainly possible to mess up the knock signal, but again, if I can't do it right, then I won't do it. I think you're overestimating how tough it is to look at the knock signal, though.

Also, how would your method be any different then the knock functionality on the safc2. We all know that doesn't work for dsm's. Sure you can hook it up and it will give you some knock value counts, but they don't mean anything.

I can't speak to that, since I have no idea how the Super AFC does, or doesn't do, knock sensing.

And you'll see someone more about how it's a bad idea to alter the knock sensor signal.

And if you give people the option to do it, then you will get some idiots who will say "Hey my car goes faster and I get better timing advance if I just reduce this knock value a little."

I definitely have to balance what people want vs what they should have. Realistically, any engine management doohickie is giving the average guy an easy way to blow up their motor.

With that said, though, I know some other products provide this functionality. It depends on how conservative you think the stock ECU is with respect to knock as to whether it's a good idea or not.

Also, the folks with this "phantom knock" problem believe that it's a real non-problem. As I understand it (and I haven't really looked into it), these guys are seeing "knock" that certainly isn't real engine knock, so they're looking for a way to fool the ECU into not picking up on junk. I don't think any are advocating disabling the knock sensor.

About the MAFT - again, I haven't actually implemented this functionality yet, so I don't want to get into a big discussion on it. It did seem like something I could do though, which would add more value to the ECU+. And as with the other features, if I can't do it properly, I won't do it.

Tom

 

[Velo7825]

I guess I'm really not understanding how you can tune your vehicle accuratly with this unit. You can't see knock (in the current version). The stock O2 sensor is not accurate enough to tune WOT, just cruise and idle. A WIDEBAND 02 IS AN EXTRA $350, the plus side is that the ecu+ can log it.

The only real way to tune with just the ecu+ is by looking at ?? Timing, fuel trims (which are (extrapolated)? and not the ecu fuel trims) and air flow.

Am I missing somthing? Yes you can get more power out of your engine, but can you actually "tune" your engine to run correctly. Maybe its more of not understanding the limitations of piggyback systems, but really is this the same way people tune with an afc+logger combo?

Is it really as simple as adjusting the fuel (within your injectors limits) adjusting the boost and timing to get a smooth timing curve to maximize power?

EDIT: Also with all the new features you hope to add (no promises ) will they just be software upgrades or will I have to send in my unit for a new one? Will the upgrades be free for the lifetime of the product?

 

[HighPSI TSi Guy]

just like AFC... if you want to see knock, use a pocketlogger for now

 

[tigerstalon]

just like AFC... if you want to see knock, use a pocketlogger for now

Yeah, if you've got a 1G.

If you've got a 2G, you can't look at knock with a pocketlogger. So, you're basically left with timing and O2 values to tune WOT, both of which can be logged with ECU+.

 

[tlcoll1]

I guess I'm really not understanding how you can tune your vehicle accuratly with this unit. You can't see knock (in the current version). The stock O2 sensor is not accurate enough to tune WOT, just cruise and idle. A WIDEBAND 02 IS AN EXTRA $350, the plus side is that the ecu+ can log it.

You can't see knock now, but since you can see timing, you're still ok. Remember that the real reason you want to see knock is so you can know that the stock ECU is pulling (or will be pulling) timing. With the ECU+, you can see it actually pulling timing, and that's an indication that you're getting knock.

I understand that it's better to see knock starting to occur, but in the end, you really only care about timing.

Also, it's interesting that different people seem to tune different ways. The EVO guys love to use the wideband, so I added support for that. For the best tuning, you'd be able to see knock and wideband AFR, but right now I can't log knock.

Am I missing somthing? Yes you can get more power out of your engine, but can you actually "tune" your engine to run correctly. Maybe its more of not understanding the limitations of piggyback systems, but really is this the same way people tune with an afc+logger combo?

Basically. The ECU+ also gives you much better ability to see how you're doing. With the AFC+PocketLOGGER combo, you just log knock and try to keep it low. With the ECU+, you log a run, then can look at lots of information to see how you did. And then you can use the dyno capability to see if your change picked up HP.

EDIT: Also with all the new features you hope to add (no promises ) will they just be software upgrades or will I have to send in my unit for a new one? Will the upgrades be free for the lifetime of the product?

If an update is software-only, it'll be free. Most features will be that way, I guess, but knock logging in particular is going to add hardware to make it work.

Tom

 

[Blk_99gst]

You can't see knock (in the current version).

Very few tuning devices can see knock. For 1g cars, a 1g/obdI pocketlogger can view/log ecu knock count. For 2g cars, only dsmlink can view/log the real ecu knock count.

The only real way to tune with just the ecu+ is by looking at ?? Timing, fuel trims (which are (extrapolated)? and not the ecu fuel trims) and air flow.

I don't know how he's calculating timing advance, tapping off some wire maybe. Ecu+ is probaby tapping the o2 sensor so you can log o2 voltage at wide open throttle, but tapping the o2 line is just a bad ida in my opinion (see below cut and past section). He can't see the ecu fuel trims, and he doesn't have extrapolated values for them, so tuning the low settings are very difficult in my opinion. And airflow is useless to log.

Am I missing somthing? Yes you can get more power out of your engine, but can you actually "tune" your engine to run correctly. Maybe its more of not understanding the limitations of piggyback systems, but really is this the same way people tune with an afc+logger combo?

Yes to really tune your engine, it would be ideal to see knock count or use an expensive wideband. But the majority of use do it by using timing advance and o2 voltage at WOT (although this can't be trusted much). A pocketlogger can see the ACTUAL ecu values for the settings, plus ACTUAL fuel trim values to tune the low throttle settings. The ecu+ can only tap certain wires (possibly can't the voltage on those wires, see cut and past below), so it can probably get timing advance and o2 votage too.

Is it really as simple as adjusting the fuel (within your injectors limits) adjusting the boost and timing to get a smooth timing curve to maximize power?

If you read the many tuning guides that are out there, then yes, you adjust boost and lean things out while trying to acheive a smooth timing curve from say 8deg to 18deg at the top of the gear (this would be for a 2g car).


TAPPING ECU WIRES:
Most voltmeters don't impose any effect on a circuit
because they are in the millions of ohms of resistance
range. If you want to meausure a the voltage of a low
resistance circuit this high resistance voltmeter is
not neccessary, and perhaps that was the design of the
AFC's blue wire mod. I'm not sure what that wire is
supposed to be used for anyway. For the o2 sensor, too
much current flows through the AFC, essentially
putting a load on the o2 sensor itself.

You might see a variation between the pocketlogger and
the afc, but more importantly, you will see a huge
difference if you put a switch on the blue wire. on
Watch the logger, and toggle the switch. Your o2's
will suddenly jump up to where they are supposed to
be. On my 420a NT talon the blue wire dropped the o2's
from .98 to .92 and caused the car to run extremely
rich in closed loop mode (with SAFC zeroed out).

 

[tlcoll1]

Very few tuning devices can see knock.

Blk_99gst is my arch nemesis. He makes sure that no positive discussion of the ECU+ is allowed to stand unchallenged.

I don't know how he's calculating timing advance, tapping off some wire maybe.

Correct. "He" is tapping a wire to read the actual engine timing. Because the ECU+ is outside of the engine, it reads the true timing value (when the spark occurs). Not sure why this is a problem...

Ecu+ is probaby tapping the o2 sensor so you can log o2 voltage at wide open throttle, but tapping the o2 line is just a bad ida in my opinion (see below cut and past section).

I think we've been over this in this thread, but the ECU+ does this "right," and it's really not fair to raise doubts in people's minds about this, just because the AFC circuitry stinks.

BTW, the first part of your cut 'n paste is accurate from an electrical point of view, but the second part sounds like more hot air to me. If the NT cars are anything like the turbo cars, they're not going to use the absolute voltage of the O2 sensor anyway. They're going to set some high (maybe 0.7 volts) and low (maybe 0.3 volts) threshold, and verify that the O2 voltage swings past those threshold voltages as the ECU adjusts the fuel flow in closed loop mode. 0.92 to 0.98 volts is probably within the manufacturing tolerance of the O2 sensor, so the stock ECU certainly isn't going to depend on that minute of a voltage change to modify how the car runs. That's just crazy.

BTW, one thing came up in another thread that I'd like to comment on here. When you buy a product, you're counting on the designer to do the right thing for your car, and to not screw anything up. This applies to software as well as hardware. So when you buy a product that does "only" software mods, you also need to worry that those mods don't corrupt some other section of code, or overwrite some random memory value, or take out a piece of important code to "make room" for the modifications in the EPROM. My point is that if you're going to be paranoid about what the ECU+ will do to the O2 sensor voltage, then you should also be paranoid that the DSMLink won't accidently recalibrate your fuel tables at 6534 RPM and 93.78 degree air temperature due to a bug, or that the PocketLOGGER won't rewrite some stored value in the ECU by accident, causing your car not to run or to permanently fail emissions testing. My point is that if you're going to worry about whether the ECU+ loads down the stock O2 sensor, then there's a million other things to worry about in every possible product you buy.

At least I'm here, and willing to answer questions. Where's the eManage and Super AFC designers?

Tom

 

[JiveMasterT]

slightly off topic, but is there an external knock logger you can get for 2g cars? if so, then why wouldnt you just get one of those and the ECU+ and be done?

 

[Blk_99gst]

slightly off topic, but is there an external knock logger you can get for 2g cars?

Nope, they don't exist. That is the holy grail!!! The safcII has a knock counter in it, but it does not work on the dsm cars.

The only way to see real 2g ecu knock count is to shell out the big bucks and get dsmlink.

But knock count isn't everything. In my opinion, a wideband device (like the LM-1) coupled with a pocketlogger to read real 2g ecu timing, would be as powerful as seeing knock count. That can be had for LM-1=$450 (what I spent) and 2g pocketlogger=$180, total of $630 which is WAY cheaper than dsmlink would cost you.

 

[tmizer]

Tom, simple 1G wiring question, will I be able to plug my Pocketlooger into the diagnostic port with ECU+ wired in? The image of the pigtails of the wiring harness lead me to this assumption, but I'm just checking... which if I had a DB9 serial port switch box, I could theoretically switch a single Palmpilot between the diagnostic port cable and the ECU+ cable?

UPS is delivering ECU+ today, woo hoo! All this and wideband too, I am one happy camper (...now if the engine will just hold together... )

 

[LightningGSX]

This may have been covered already but, altering cam and crank signals to alter timing, will also alter fuel injection timing, injecting fuel at the wrong times.Which can lead to a few problems, namely injecting fuel on to a closed valve, causing atomization problems and puddling.

 

[HighPSI TSi Guy]

Tom, simple 1G wiring question, will I be able to plug my Pocketlooger into the diagnostic port with ECU+ wired in? The image of the pigtails of the wiring harness lead me to this assumption, but I'm just checking... which if I had a DB9 serial port switch box, I could theoretically switch a single Palmpilot between the diagnostic port cable and the ECU+ cable?

UPS is delivering ECU+ today, woo hoo! All this and wideband too, I am one happy camper (...now if the engine will just hold together... )

be sure to let us know how it does

 

[Velo7825]

tmizer: what wideband kit did you go with, I found the PLX kit for $308 but thats the cheapest kit I can find.

I still think for 750 this is a good setup. I'll be very happy if the continued support for this product makes it even better. I'm first on the backorder list so it won't be long till my unit arrives. I will be tuning without the wideband untill I can get the extra chedder together, so I can give impressions of tuning with just the ecu+.

 

[tlcoll1]

Tom, simple 1G wiring question, will I be able to plug my Pocketlooger into the diagnostic port with ECU+ wired in? The image of the pigtails of the wiring harness lead me to this assumption, but I'm just checking... which if I had a DB9 serial port switch box, I could theoretically switch a single Palmpilot between the diagnostic port cable and the ECU+ cable?

You are correct. Both can be plugged in simultaneously (say with a laptop on the ECU+, and a Palm for the PocketLOGGER), or you could switch between the two.

Tom

 

[tmizer]

Velo, I went with the PLX M250 (Bosch) with a narrowband gauge converter...so the idiot light Autometer AF gauge would for once be useful. Was thinking of the M300, but jeez, with all the extra guages, a Palmpilot AND a laptop (per Ecu+jivemasterTom), the last thing I want is my woman saying, "how much money has this moneypit sucked in now??!?!"

Tom, how convenient the EVO8 ECU wiring is the same as the 2Gs! Nice, very nice documentation, btw. The dyno analysis feature looks smart, and thanks for looking out for us A/T guys since our auto gear/final drive ratios are a bit different. Like the way the cursor is sync'd to the horizontal time scale on all graphs. Nice feature. Guess I better get that Sensym pressure chip and a 20Watt resistor (for the PLX) from Digikey ordered.

 

[Velo7825]

tmizer: ya thats the same one I think I will buy. But why do you need a Sensym pressure chip and a 20Watt resistor?

 

[tmizer]

The resistor is to load the O2 heater line, thus avoiding a CEL code, thus enabling use of PLX's Bosch LSU4 wideband sensor in place of our stock narrowband. The PLX blackbox has a "simulated" narrowband output to feed our ECU.

The Sensym ASCX30 is a $57 sensor that will enable ECU+ to log boost.

 

[tigerstalon]

This may have been covered already but, altering cam and crank signals to alter timing, will also alter fuel injection timing, injecting fuel at the wrong times.Which can lead to a few problems, namely injecting fuel on to a closed valve, causing atomization problems and puddling.

I think that this may not be an issue. With injector duty cycles at values such as 40%-80% under medium to heavy load, the injector will spend plenty of time spraying at a closed intake valve. Now, if you mess with the signal to change timing at idle and the injector duty cycle is only something like 3%-15%, then yes that could be a problem. But, if you're changing timing at idle, maybe you should consider changing the base timing instead of altering the signal to change timing.