Crankwalked a BRAND NEW 6 Bolt?

[97Gb]

Hey DSMTuners,

Less than 100 miles on the engine and 2 oil changes already.. and it is toast.

I need some of your thoughts.. this is gonna be a wordy one because I've been fighting this car for two years, THOUSANDS of dollars, and 3 different mechanics...

1997 Eagle Talon with a 6bolt swap.
Bought my car back. Long story short, it was my old high-school car, sold it to a dude and made him promise that if he wanted to sell it to call me first.
Engine was blown after I sold it him. Seller replaced it in his garage but could never get it running.

Upgraded the engine harness to an OHM Harness (this is important for later). Because the OEM harness was spliced and diced.

First mechanic installed the OHM harness and did some awesome upgrades (IGN Ignition Coils, 1300cc injectors, FP Black Turbo, QUARTERMASTER TWIN DISC CLUTCH, etc). First mechanic gave up on it. Couldn't get it running and recommended a known DSM guy locally, but more of a works out of a shop he has at his house...

Second mechanic. Couldn't get it running. Would not touch the harness because it is brand new. Tried quite a few tricks to get it started. Including cranking the fuel pressure up to 90 PSI (he couldn't get the fuel pump to stay primed long enough to see what the fuel pressure was at... this may be important). Second mechanic recommends a rebuild because he doesn't know if anything is right with this engine so we need to start fresh.
Rebuilds engine properly. Send it to get decked. Fire rings. Manly rods. The full 9 yards.
Installs new engine... same thing. Won't start.

The mains were .0026
The rods were .0025
Piston ring gap:
22 top
24 bottom

Second mechanic gives up on me. Tells me to take it somewhere else. Doesn't charge me for a bunch of labor.. being a nice guy..

Third mechanic. Figured out within literally 2 hours that the OHM Harness was pinned wrong and the 1 and 4 wires were swapped and was causing it to kinda wanna start but not really. BAM car is running. Fuel pressure was insane at 90psi. Does oil change because fuel might be in the oil. Third mechanic thinks that second mechanic washed out the cylinders and might need a ring job, but we are going to let it ride and see because we just need to get this car going correctly... he even fixed the rear main seal that the second mechanic installed with bolts that were too long and cracked the housing.. does oil change AGAIN because why not. THIS IS IMPORTANT TO NOTE.

Third mechanic is AWESOME. Buttons the car up. Talks with remote tuner to get a start and semi drivable tune put on it.

Done. Or so I thought...

I get the car home. Get on a call with the tuner and sending logs back and forth. But we cant seem to figure out why it keeps stalling while driving when I push the clutch in......... I never got the car into boost. The tuner and I never got that far with the tune THIS IS IMPORTANT.

I break out the dial indicator to measure the end play of the crank... pulling on the crank seems fine... push on the crank... THUD! a literal thud. I have it on video.

I send that to the THIRD mechanic wondering what happened and he said, "You need to talk to your engine builder. It's walked and that thrust bearing is GONE."

Second mechanic says, "everything was within tolerance when I was done with it. You've had another mechanic work on it and 'opened up the engine' by replacing the rear main seal and also the other mechanic used Motul 10w40 break-in oil (came up in conversation) and I use VR1 20w50 because of the loose clearances on the engine. I will not warranty the engine at all."

Sooo... do I have any ground to be pissed at the rebuild/second mechanic? Do I have any ground to ask him to rebuild it for free? I even suggested a split of parts and labor and he said HELL NO. Second Mechanic says recent thrust bearings have been terrible quality and breaking easily (which isn't my fault).

I just want my car running... I am a fair person... im tired and ready to give up...

 

[biglady112]

Not the answer you are going to want to hear but, it sounds like you need to learn to work on your own car. Then no one could be blamed but, you.

As someone who does quality side work, I am on their side. When it leaves my hands, you are on your own. Especially if you have everyone’s hands in the cookie jar.

A 7 bolt 4G63 is not the only engine that can have a thrust bearing failure. Any engine with a thrust bearing can have excessive end play. SBC’s, H series Hondas, 2JZ’s are all quite common to walk.

Plain and simple, don’t want problems, leave the car stock.

Let me guess, there is no pedal stop for your fancy multiplate clutch?

 

[97Gb]

Not the answer you are going to want to hear but, it sounds like you need to learn to work on your own car. Then no one could be blamed but, you.

As someone who does quality side work, I am on their side. When it leaves my hands, you are on your own. Especially if you have everyone’s hands in the cookie jar.

A 7 bolt 4G63 is not the only engine that can have a thrust bearing failure. Any engine with a thrust bearing can have excessive end play. SBC’s, H series Hondas, 2JZ’s are all quite common to walk.

Plain and simple, don’t want problems, leave the car stock.

Let me guess, there is no pedal stop for your fancy multiplate clutch?

To be honest, me working on it myself wasn't really part of the equation and neither was leaving it stock. Plenty of people do full out racecars builds and pay mechanics/shops to do them. So I'm not really sure why you are saying that in your reply.

I pay someone really good money to work on my car for me, they give up getting the brand new engine started and TELL ME to take it to another mechanic. I do what he says. And then he doesn't back up his build.

I'm going to get flamed for my reply to you because it looks like your a veteran on this site but your comments of "work on it yourself" and "keep it stock" have nothing to do with my post because neither of those were cards that were dealt.

 

[99dsmer4g63]

Is it a stock crank? What about the main cap fasteners are they stock?

-Daniel

 

[biglady112]

To be honest, me working on it myself wasn't really part of the equation and neither was leaving it stock... plenty of people do full out racecars builds and pay mechanics/shops to do them... so im not really sure why you are saying that in your reply.

I pay someone really good money to work on my car for me, they give up getting the brand new engine started and TELL ME to take it to another mechanic. I do what he says. And then he doesn't back up his build.

Im going to get flamed for my reply to you because it looks like your a veteran on this site... but your comments of "work on it yourself" and "keep it stock" have nothing to do with my post because neither of those were cards that were dealt.

I literally had to tell someone today what I am about to tell you. The amount of money you spend does not guarantee quality work and desired results.

Learn to work on it yourself and you will be less disappointed. When you have three different opinions, what makes you think any of them are qualified for said opinions and will lead you down the same path?

No offense but, kind of. Watch this video and you will see where I am coming from after doing this for some form of money for the past 26 years.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[97Gb]

Is it a stock crank? What about the main cap fasteners are they stock?

-Daniel

Crank is stock and it was turned/redone at the same time as the engine. Im not sure about the fasteners..

I literally had to tell someone today what I am about to tell you. The amount of money you spend does not guarantee quality work and desired results.

Learn to work on it yourself and you will be less disappointed. When you have three different opinions, what makes you think any of them are qualified for said opinions and will lead you down the same path?

No offense but, kind of. Watch this video and you will see where I am coming from after doing this for some form of money for the past 26 years.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

K..

Also he has had to redo his own work on three 4g63s in the last year... apparently im the last straw and he isn't going to redo them anymore.

I should be able to get fair work for fair pay. So please stop saying work on it yourself. You sound defensive.

 

[biglady112]

K..

Also he has had to redo his own work on three 4g63s in the last year... apparently im the last straw and he isn't going to redo them anymore.

I should be able to get fair work for fair pay. So please stop saying work on it yourself. You sound defensive.

Welcome to adulthood. What you expect and what reality is are not the same thing. Figure out how to fix it and move on. Nothing you say or complain about here is going to make some Joe Blow liable for his work.

I went through this in the late 90’s. That is why I learned to wire, build engines, plumb, weld and everything else. You simply cannot trust anyone but, yourself. I am a blue collar guy and cannot afford stupidity.

 

[99dsmer4g63]

I just ask about the crank because there was a similar post about this exact thing recently but seems it was blamed more on aftermarket crank and fasteners.

Didn’t know if you were in the same boat.

Good luck

-Daniel

 

[97Gb]

Welcome to adulthood. What you expect and what reality is are not the same thing. Figure out how to fix it and move on. Nothing you say or complain about here is going to make some Joe Blow liable for his work.

I went through this in the late 90’s. That is why I learned to wire, build engines, plumb, weld and everything else. You simply cannot trust anyone but, yourself. I am a blue collar guy and cannot afford stupidity.

Move on dude... sheeeeeeesh. Talk about a post hijack for no reason. Not offering anything beyond "learn to do it yourself and you won't be disappointed." Go do you. I'll do me. Byyye.

I just ask about the crank because there was a similar post about this exact thing recently but seems it was blamed more on aftermarket crank and fasteners.

Didn’t know if you were in the same boat.

Good luck

-Daniel

Gotcha. Thanks for checking! Just seems impossible. Less than 100 miles on the build. No boost through the engine yet... there HAD TO be a mistake putting it together.

 

[Mahreeoh17]

I would have to agree with the mechanic on this one. If he was the last one to touch it I'd say he's responsible, but the fact that one more person worked on it after him kinda washes his hands of it.

Move on dude... sheeeeeeesh. Talk about a post hijack for no reason. Not offering anything beyond "learn to do it yourself and you won't be disappointed." Go do you. I'll do me. Byyye.

Young man, your age is showing. Lol

 

[97Gb]

I would have to agree with the mechanic on this one. If he was the last one to touch it I'd say he's responsible, but the fact that one more person worked on it after him kinda washes his hands of it.

Young man, your age is showing. Lol

Lol.. im 35. Sorry. My millennial inner child starts to rear it's ugly head when it gets annoyed

My only thoughts to the point about a different mechanics touching it is, he gave me no choice and the third mechanic didn't open up the engine or do anything to touch the actual build.

I dont know. I guess I would feel terrible if I was the builder and the engine was toast in less than 100 miles.

 

[Drewpy Dawg]

I don’t think you have any recourse, but the second mechanic recommending a full rebuild because he couldn’t get it started and didn’t know if something was wrong sounds like a huge red flag to me.