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420A 420a turbo e-manage ultimate

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
So I have some questions about the greddy e-manage ultimate. I've been searching for literal hours on the thing trying to understand it and if it will work with my application. The reason I'm considering a piggy back for now is because the car runs pig rich at idle and if I adjust fuel pressure down for it to run not as lean you can't Rev it. I just want to enjoy the car this next summer coming up, boost is at 10 pounds, 250cc injectors, and a fuel management unit that let's you adjust rising rate and idle. So that's why I'm looking for a piggy back I've got nothing crazy I just dont want a rich idle I've changed my oil 3 times now in maybe 15 miles its been driven. Thanks for any and all replies.

I forgot to add I'd like to go ms one day when I'm ready to really pump her up, for now I'd like to cruise it on nice days. My main focus is getting the body work done by the end of winter.
 

BLACK'98DSM

Proven Member
3,507
1,232
Feb 9, 2019
Alabama
250cc injectors with 10 pounds of boost? What other modifications to the engine? You're probably maxing out those injectors when you're heavy on the throttle. Do you have a wideband gauge? Or are you just guessing it's running rich?
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
Yss wideband, fuel pressure, oil pressure, and boost gauge. Engine is fully built with a 320lph fuel pump. I'm just at a loss for the rich idle.

I'm pretty stumped to be honest if I turn fuel pressure down to 20psi at idle runs nice and is at about 13 13.4 but I can't Rev it up it pops and leans out. If I set fuel pressure at about 35psi it's pig rich but I can Rev it up. So I'm assuming I'm fighting the stock ecu with my fmu. It's a game I can't win.
 

dustyboner

DSM Wiseman
1,944
1,061
Mar 13, 2016
abq, New_Mexico
people used to use the emanage alot back in the day. Its a way better option than a sFMU.

so at stock fuel pressure the ecu can compensate for a 250cc injector.
250cc is just slightly bigger than the stock one.
stock is something like a 240cc
stock fuel pressure is 47-50psi

if your car can't idle on a 250 injector with the fuel pressure at 47-50psi. something is wrong.
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
What do you guys think of the e manage? I was reading alot of emanage questions in the forums but most were asked back in 2005 so I'm not real sure what people think of it now days. So to my knowledge my fuel pressure should be about 45psi? It's stupid rich even at 35psi and I don't think it's the sfmu because I bought another one to rule that out. I can try swapping the stock injectors in again and see if anything changes.
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
I had 380cc and it was the same thing going on so maybe ill throw the stocks back in and see. I'm just not sure, that's why I was hoping to buy an adjustable fuel pressure regulator and then just run a piggy back for my application.

So if I had the base fuel pressure at its correct setting and say I use an e-manage to tone it down at idle what would you guys suggest? Or am I just putting a bandaid on a problem I may have?
 

pauleyman

DSM Wiseman
7,999
2,605
Nov 19, 2011
oklahoma city, Oklahoma
I had 380cc and it was the same thing going on so maybe ill throw the stocks back in and see. I'm just not sure, that's why I was hoping to buy an adjustable fuel pressure regulator and then just run a piggy back for my application.
Hang on a min....you have a 320lph fuel pump but everything else stock?
If so i question the fuel pressure numbers you have. More info please.
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
I'm using my sfmu I can adjust rising rate and idle fuel pressure, it's a 14:1. I didn't think the pump being quite a bit bigger would give me issues since I can adjust base fuel pressure.

My car is a 95 auto just to let everyone know just in case there's a difference between the years.
 

pauleyman

DSM Wiseman
7,999
2,605
Nov 19, 2011
oklahoma city, Oklahoma
So youre running a boosted car on 250cc injectors and the only method of fuel control is a rising rate regulator correct?
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
Yes I can adjust idle and rising rate its just not working so I have to try something else that's why I asked about the e-manage. I know the safc doesn't work so I have very little piggy backs to choose from.
 

DSMPT

DSM Wiseman
2,002
1,553
Jun 12, 2014
Japan / Mexico, Arizona
What do you guys think of the e manage?
e-manage and e-manage ultimate are 2 different things. The e-manage ultimate is newer and much better with more features. I think greddy still sell option parts. But I am not so sure if it works well on a 420a.
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
Dang I don't want to just send it and get one. I meant the ultimate I'd like to try that out but if it isn't going to work well on the 420a what options do I have. I wish I knew more about tuning. I'll run the car on 8psi if I have to I just want to enjoy it.
 

pauleyman

DSM Wiseman
7,999
2,605
Nov 19, 2011
oklahoma city, Oklahoma
Has this car ever ran in its present form? First things first. If it wont even idle something else is wrong and that needs to be fixed. I would try the stock injectors.
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
Has been sitting since 2009 with no engine and it runs and idles perfect its just a really rich idle that I'm not comfortable with. I will try stock injectors and go from there in boost it pulls nice and afr are good just a really fat idle.
 

dustyboner

DSM Wiseman
1,944
1,061
Mar 13, 2016
abq, New_Mexico
stock injectors flow 235cc @ 43.5psi
Stock injectors flow 250cc @ 50psi

14:1 is too high. if you were on stock injectors @ 50psi and you ran 5psi boost
your fuel system would be at 120psi or 115psi if you accounted for the pressure differential.
I wouldn't run more than 5psi on a 12:1 rate.

are you still running the FPR on the rail?
Is your fuel pump rated for high pressure? Have you done a fuel pump rewire?

are you running a vortech SFMU or some other trusted brand?

If its some chinese knockoff that could be causing problems. Just like with the knock off BOVs. The whole point of a BOV is to keep compressor surge from damaging the turbo. A knock off BOV might work for a little while but eventually you will start getting compressor surge. Same kinda shit with all the knock off stuff.
like wastegates, injectors, FPR, turbos.....

here is the manual for the vortech sfmu

take a look here
for a guide on setting up the fuel system for a turbod 95

You can find a bunch more info from the links HERE

You must be logged in to view this image or video.
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
I'm just going to have to go through my whole setup fuel wise. I have good fuel flow its just at idle where I'm rich the sfmu is a spa turbo one it states it can go all the way to 14:1 I've adjusted it accordingly pulls nice at 10 psi plenty of fuel. I'll just have to start fresh and just run low boost on stock injectors for now. Thanks for all the help and input. It always sucks starting over been on this thing for a couple years now.
 

Echo-Eclipse

Probationary Member
11
18
Nov 22, 2019
tulsa, Oklahoma
I'm just going to have to go through my whole setup fuel wise. I have good fuel flow its just at idle where I'm rich the sfmu is a spa turbo one it states it can go all the way to 14:1 I've adjusted it accordingly pulls nice at 10 psi plenty of fuel. I'll just have to start fresh and just run low boost on stock injectors for now. Thanks for all the help and input. It always sucks starting over been on this thing for a couple years now.
somthing id seriously look into, is getting megasquirt, look up Cody Kenyon via FB, hes a vendor and has lots of info on it. going with your engine build looks like youve spent the money on the engine, why cheap out with a sfmu? I had a buddy that ran into this same issue your having and never got it figured out. Not only will MS be evrything you need to manage fuel, but timing as well, and has lots of support in the 420a world. Best of luck man.
 

jesse12345

Supporting Member
262
159
Jul 30, 2014
Down the block, Minnesota
I definitely want to run megasquirt and honestly that's probably the route I'm going to next. I'm just very inexperienced with tuning and what not I just don't want to blow up all my hard work. So in a sense I guess I'm just a little nervous but everyone is right why cheap out on the tuning when my engine can handle the power now. I just don't want to dive into it and then either break something from being inexperienced, or never finish the process since I'm not the greatest at wiring. Thank you to everyone for all the replies if it wasn't for you guys I'd still be staring at a shell I dug out of the junkyard.
 

Echo-Eclipse

Probationary Member
11
18
Nov 22, 2019
tulsa, Oklahoma
I definitely want to run megasquirt and honestly that's probably the route I'm going to next. I'm just very inexperienced with tuning and what not I just don't want to blow up all my hard work. So in a sense I guess I'm just a little nervous but everyone is right why cheap out on the tuning when my engine can handle the power now. I just don't want to dive into it and then either break something from being inexperienced, or never finish the process since I'm not the greatest at wiring. Thank you to everyone for all the replies if it wasn't for you guys I'd still be staring at a shell I dug out of the junkyard.
my 420a was my first MS build, and ive asked cody probably a hundred "stupid" questions. But for the inexperienced all one can do is ask and research. TBH i kinda felt spoon fed through it, so if i can do it, so can you LOL Good Luck!
 
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