1G 1st gear popout problem

[TAMA_player]

I have some issues with the first gear, is difficult to engage, i mean i need to hold it and then engage clutch, if i not hold the stick in 1st position it just pop out.
When the gear is engaged it holds fine as far as the engine is accelerating, if you decelerate the gear pops out.

Is a 2 years old Jack's transmissions value pkg.

The trans was running fine but we had a huge crash in a race. The car is repaired and running fine now, but we have this trans issue.

Which parts do you guys think i need to buy to repair the trans?


I don't know anything about transmissions, they are just black boxes for me.

Thank you in advance.

 

[kchaazz]

First thing I would do is, without the motor running, pull the shifter boot up and shift into 1st gear and see if the shifter is moving all the way to the stop (The rubber piece, perpendicular to the shift lever should come to rest against the body of the shifter base assembly.) If not, you need to examine your shifter bushings for slop, both at the transmission side of the cables and within the shifter. If all this checks out, see if the cables are in need of adustment. These are just the easy things to check out before cracking the tranny open...

 

[mikej84]

I know for a fact the cables are known to stretch maybe the throw out bearing was bumped out of whack

 

[TAMA_player]

I know for a fact the cables are known to stretch maybe the throw out bearing was bumped out of whack

Seems not, the tranny was pulled apart twice, and every time we check that throw out bearing and clutch assembly.

Also all the gears shift as normal, only 1st is having this issue.

First thing I would do is, without the motor running, pull the shifter boot up and shift into 1st gear and see if the shifter is moving all the way to the stop (The rubber piece, perpendicular to the shift lever should come to rest against the body of the shifter base assembly.) If not, you need to examine your shifter bushings for slop, both at the transmission side of the cables and within the shifter. If all this checks out, see if the cables are in need of adustment. These are just the easy things to check out before cracking the tranny open...

Ok seems a good starting point, i will recheck this in detail as soon as i get home today

 

[gst96spyderman]

Had same issue a few years back.. ended up having to replace TOB. Guys running with a little bit of HP like you seem to go towards SHEP Trannies and replaceing 1st and 2nd gear with ones from EVOs. I'm assuming your running 350+ hp based on your mod info, so maybe its time to upgrade the tranny?

 

[TAMA_player]

First thing I would do is, without the motor running, pull the shifter boot up and shift into 1st gear and see if the shifter is moving all the way to the stop (The rubber piece, perpendicular to the shift lever should come to rest against the body of the shifter base assembly.) If not, you need to examine your shifter bushings for slop, both at the transmission side of the cables and within the shifter. If all this checks out, see if the cables are in need of adustment. These are just the easy things to check out before cracking the tranny open...

Okay yesterday in the night i checked the travel. As you said the lever isnt going all the way to get full in, so i made adjustments to the shifter, to get full travel on 1st. Then i drive the car and now 2nd isnt engaging as well, was late night and i adjust 1st and 2nd to the "middle". Today in the morning, traveling to workplace i missed some 1st, and 2nd, not a big deal, but seems that She just wants "more" travel in there. I checked the lever and it have like 1~2 mm of freeplay. I dont know if it is normal?
Modify the shifter to have more travel is easy, but i dont know if is the correct way to get rid of the problem.

Had same issue a few years back.. ended up having to replace TOB. Guys running with a little bit of HP like you seem to go towards SHEP Trannies and replaceing 1st and 2nd gear with ones from EVOs. I'm assuming your running 350+ hp based on your mod info, so maybe its time to upgrade the tranny?

I have all dsm gears, is a jack transsmisions Value trans, it have 4 spyder gears, and double syncro 2nd gear, it supposed to be good for 400hps.

 

[kleenf4i]

I know for a fact the cables are known to stretch maybe the throw out bearing was bumped out of whack

+1, if the throwout bearing got messed up, it would be hard to shift into any gear, and you likely would hear some clunking in the clutch are. If its only 1st gear that being a pain I would lean twords the able adjustment like mike said.You can manually go through the gear selection on the tramsmission itself and see if it will shift into first without binding up. If it binds up trying to do it manually from the tranny, likey its internal.
You posted right before I got this out. Is the arm on the transmission bent by any chance?

 

[CleanPalms]

I realize this may be a stretch but.....

I'm not 100% sure about the setup of the engine bay of a 1g but I had a similar problem when I first purchased my 2g GSX. Every gear was perfectly fine except for 4th. I had to basically hold the shifter the entire time I was in this gear else it would pop itself into neutral. Turned out the problem was with a coolant hose that didn't have the correct bends in it. When I shifted the shift linkage (counter weight?) was squeezing the hose but because its rubber, it would pop out (but only in 4th). Replaced the hose with one that had the correct bends and I was on my way.

Please excuse me if my terminology is incorrect, I'm pretty new to this. If someone understands what I'm talking about and finds something wrong with my post, please correct it so the OP has a better understanding. Thanks.

 

[kleenf4i]

^ his problem was in the engine bay, not the linkage or the transmission itself. If something as small as a rubber hose can pop the transmission out of gear, it would be worthwile to check and make sure there is nothing in the engine bay that the linkage is binding up on.

 

[kchaazz]

Okay yesterday in the night i checked the travel. As you said the lever isnt going all the way to get full in, so i made adjustments to the shifter, to get full travel on 1st. Then i drive the car and now 2nd isnt engaging as well, was late night and i adjust 1st and 2nd to the "middle". Today in the morning, traveling to workplace i missed some 1st, and 2nd, not a big deal, but seems that She just wants "more" travel in there. I checked the lever and it have like 1~2 mm of freeplay. I dont know if it is normal?
Modify the shifter to have more travel is easy, but i dont know if is the correct way to get rid of the problem.



I have all dsm gears, is a jack transsmisions Value trans, it have 4 spyder gears, and double syncro 2nd gear, it supposed to be good for 400hps.

Crap, forgot to tell ya how to adjust the cables properly. Read this link Im posting thourougly and you should be able to correct the problem.
Shifter Adjustment

 

[c2ypt1c]

Check the cable bracket on the transmission. Sometimes the bolts work their way loose, allowing the cables to move slightly. In fact, I just had this happen to me, and my cable actually snapped. I thought I blew the transmission for a moment...

 

[TAMA_player]

Okay, all this replies makes sense to me, i have a lot of work to do!
Thank you guys today i will check everything is posted here.

 

[TAMA_player]

Okay i checked everything was posted here.
She needs more travel for the lever to get full in, also in 1st and 2nd.
This is because the lever have some backlash 1~2 mm, i checked and the backlash comes from inside the gear box.
For testing purposes i remove the rubber in the stopper (stick). And the issue almost dissapear, but i still need to hold in first gear a little to avoid popouts. But is a lot better!
I dont know wich is the next step here, we already open the box twice and nothing seems broken, bad or damaged.

 

[kchaazz]

One thing I will mention is that the VFAQ on adusting the cables isnt the same as the way its described in the factory service manual. Has it done this since you put the transmission in? I ask because of this:Shifter Differences, 90 and 91-94

Also, its important that you dont drive the car like this or you will destroy the 1st gear slider and the gear's engagment teeth for the slider because whats happening is that the slider isnt fully engaging the gear. Also, that VFAQ Im linking you to is a little off, or at least, in my case it was. Years back, I swapped a 91+ transmission into my 90 Talon. I followed their advice on swapping the brackets on the transmission, but it wasnt enough and I ended up with gears popping out the way you are now. My solution was to swap in the cables, brackets and shifter from a 91+ car and after that, she worked great, but I knew not to drive the car until I got that issue sorted, so I didnt end up with any transmission damage. So, my conclusion is this:

1. Your cables are badly worn and in need of replacement, or in need of "proper" adjustment (Look up the factory service manual or Haynes/Chilton's manual versions of cable adjustments and try adjusting the cables one more time before replacing them)or-
2. The bushings on the cable eyes at the transmission are badly worn and should be replaced, or-
3. Youve got a 90 style lever arm on your transmission, which is counter indicative of your issue of not having enough throw to engage gears because the 90 lever is shorter than the 91+, and when used in conjunction with a 91+ car like in your case, you should have too much throw.
4.After checking all this, if you cant find anything wrong, I would contact Jack's and ask what the issue is because Im sure they will know.

 

[kleenf4i]

^ great advice

 

[triston2469]

this is a great thread. I will have to make sure everything is good with mine as i have a hard time getting my tranny to go into third alot.

 

[TNOMUD]

My Car also has this issue with a New Jacks Trans. It worked perfectly for 300-400 miles and then developed this problem. I have heard that this is a common problem with Jacks Trannys and to avoid them.

This was on a DD, not a race car too.

 

[TAMA_player]

My Car also has this issue with a New Jacks Trans. It worked perfectly for 300-400 miles and then developed this problem. I have heard that this is a common problem with Jacks Trannys and to avoid them.

This was on a DD, not a race car too.

Do you alrady fix the problem? or the gear is still poping out?

 

[TNOMUD]

Do you alrady fix the problem? or the gear is still poping out?

Its still popping out, but the car has been parked for over a
Year until the last few weeks. I built a new motor and just
Havent had time to fool with it.

 

[E-townTalon]

Hey, just got my first dsm and having same issue. 3rd was sketchy and first didn't want to catch. Found that the bracket on transmission had 1 bolt rattled out and other loose. Got that cleaned up and now second is stubborn an reverse is barely there. Not to sure how to adjust my cables so looking for some pointers before I wreck something

 

[TAMA_player]

Well, in the end we open the transmission, and start figure what was bad.

Gears and syncros have normal wear, and seems that the input cluster needs more travel, so we add some shims under, this moves the shifter movement relationship to the gears.
Now the first gear gets fully in, and the gearbox is just like new.

And when i say "new" i mean that the first gear don't get in without grinding if the car is moving. Back in the day when the gearbox was new and installed this issue makes me wonder if they forgot to add a syncro to the 1st gear? i don't know... im not an expert.
But at least i can get in gear and the gear stays in

 

[volcomsnow245]

Hi, I am a certified manual transmission specialist. Sounds to me like you have internal issues with the transmission but knowing these cars it might possibly be a linkage issue. With the car parked try to put the car into first gear while slowly pushing the clutch down watching the pedal to see when it goes into 1st. You should not have to push the pedal to the floor with a properly functioning linkage. There's no way your missing a syncro because the input shaft would not connect with the gear.

 

[TAMA_player]

Hi, I am a certified manual transmission specialist. Sounds to me like you have internal issues with the transmission but knowing these cars it might possibly be a linkage issue. With the car parked try to put the car into first gear while slowly pushing the clutch down watching the pedal to see when it goes into 1st. You should not have to push the pedal to the floor with a properly functioning linkage. There's no way your missing a syncro because the input shaft would not connect with the gear.

Thank your for your reply.

Okay i tried this and with the car parked, i tried to get the car into 1st with the clutch not pressed, then slowly press the pedal.
Gear not get in at first, no grinding just not get it in.
When the pedal start to be pressed eventually the stick get sucked into 1st, no grinding, smooth as silk.

The issue with 1st gear is when the car is moving, 1st grinds every time.
also when the car is parked i need to wait 2 seconds after the clutch is pressed to move the stick into 1st and avoid grinding.

 

[TNOMUD]

UPDATE: turns out that the hub itself broke. Bought a Shep Stage 4.....no more issues.

 

[91talon91]

In my experiences its been a clutch or throw out bearing.