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ECMlink 1G Won't Idle

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Stapl3

15+ Year Contributor
1,814
384
Oct 27, 2004
MI, Michigan
I've been spending fall and winter rebuilding the engine in my 92tsi. I just got it back together and it won't hold idle. Basically it starts, revs up to 2500-3000, then just dies about 2-3 seconds in.

6 bolt 2.0 8.5:1
hks 272s
evo 560cc injectors
93oct @ 37psi
virgin 2g maf
stock tb/manifold
new bosch o2 sensor
isc is good
tb and throttle closed switch is adjusted perfectly

I've played with 180'ing the cas and swapping the plug wires. I've also played with the BISS. It's 2 full turns out right now, but nothing changes when I mess with it either way.

Thanks for any help.
 

Attachments

  • log.2011.01.28-02-fixed-isc.elg
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Your global is set to 521 cc at 43 psi. Get that to match your injectors and fuel pressure you are running. Your TPS is set wrong as you are reading 0.27v off the throttle. You want that number to be 0.43v off throttle. Also your BISS is adjusted improperly as well since your ICSposition is showing a value of 81 and that should be 30. That may change when it's doing a longer idle however.

Capture battery voltage as well. Also, your timing as WAY high showing 45* advance during the time it's on.

It's also better to data capture as much stuff as you can. Right now, I don't even know if your idle switch even works or not. Radiator Fan is also a helpful one to capture too once you have it running as when the fan is on it will alter your air readings.
 
Your global is set to 521 cc at 43 psi. Get that to match your injectors and fuel pressure you are running. Your TPS is set wrong as you are reading 0.27v off the throttle. You want that number to be 0.63v off throttle.
Fixed. :thumb: ...and his global fuel settings are -19.9% in the log, which is correct for a 560cc injector.

Your timing at idle is off because you need to adjust your CAS using a timing light and set base timing to 5*, use this write-up if you aren't sure how to do it correctly. ---> How To Set Base Timing

Since you've got ECMLink its very easy to do it, just go to the Misc. tab and select the "ground timing connector" box, just like the write-up mentions. Scott is correct, the more values you capture the better, especially when your trying to get some help. You don't need to display EVERYTHING, but you can capture it so we can see it if we have to.

Setting base timing correctly will more than likely fix the idle issues the car has. :ninja:

:dsm:
 
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Thanks Corey :thumb: for some reason I always mark that down wrong.
 
Glancing at the log again I noticed that even when your revving the engine up to keep it on, your TPSVolts never moves from 0.27v and your ThrottlePos stays at 0%. Pop the hood and make sure you've got everything plugged into the CORRECT connector, or plugged in period.

:dsm:
 
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The ISC was tested with an OHM meter and it checked out fine. The BISS screw has been adjusted quite a few ways with no difference really. The posted log has the BISS 2 full turns out.

I can capture voltage later today, but the battery is brand new. It cranks strong and everything electrically works just fine.

The radiator fans haven't worked since day one, I have a slim fan wired to the battery with a fuse and switch in the center console, its been like that for almost 4 years now with no issue.

Your timing at idle is off because you need to adjust your CAS using a timing light and set base timing to 5*, use this write-up if you aren't sure how to do it correctly. ---> How To Set Base Timing

Since you've got ECMLink its very easy to do it, just go to the Misc. tab and select the "ground timing connector" box, just like the write-up mentions. Scott is correct, the more values you capture the better, especially when your trying to get some help. You don't need to display EVERYTHING, but you can capture it so we can see it if we have to.

Setting base timing correctly will more than likely fix the idle issues the car has. :ninja:

:dsm:
How does one set the ignition timing on a cold engine that won't idle for longer than 2-3 seconds at a time? I have the CAS adjusted pretty much to the middle, but I have moved it around a bit with no difference. I know it's blindly set and not correct, just waiting for it to hold some kind of an idle so I can set it properly with my gun.

I noticed that even when your revving the engine up to keep it on, your TPSVolts never moves from 0.27v and your ThrottlePos stays at 0%
I never touched the throttle during both starts in the log. I can push the pedal with my right foot when the RPMs begin to fall and keep it alive at like 4k, but something about that doesn't sit right with me. Too much time and money invested.
 
Basically it starts, revs up to 2500-3000, then just dies about 2-3 seconds in.

Fuel delivery?

Can you log fuel pressure or watch an underhood gauge?

I'm sure these other guys will get you on track, just my gut reaction.
 
How does one set the ignition timing on a cold engine that won't idle for longer than 2-3 seconds at a time? I have the CAS adjusted pretty much to the middle, but I have moved it around a bit with no difference. I know it's blindly set and not correct, just waiting for it to hold some kind of an idle so I can set it properly with my gun.


I never touched the throttle during both starts in the log. I can push the pedal with my right foot when the RPMs begin to fall and keep it alive at like 4k, but something about that doesn't sit right with me. Too much time and money invested.
With the timing pin grounded your timing is locked at 5*, regardless of RPM, even if the engine is cranking.

It looked like you were revving the engine up in your logs, I thought it was odd the TPSVolt/ThrottlePos wasn't moving so now it makes sense. Get it set to 0.63v without anything touching the pedal, you don't need the car started to do this either.

:dsm:
 
Get a log of that happening.
I did this very first yesterday, before touching anything on the car.
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The laptop died on me last night and the car is a few miles away in storage. I hope to have more logs tonight or tomorrow. I was able to adjust the TPS, confirm the throttle switch sensor is working correctly, rewired a questionable section of the fuel pump rewire, and even swapped out the ecu for a stock one, the way I had it exactly before dsmlink. Nothing changed.

The fuel setup right now is a stock rewired pump with the stock fpr. There's no gauge. I can activate the pump with dsmlink and fuel is for certain getting to the rail.

When I ground the timing and activate the pump before starting, the car still dies on it its own after a few seconds.

I appreciate all the help.
 
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The Enable TPS Adjustments box is unchecked. The TPSvolts is still showing 0.29v

I cleared everything except:
FuelFlow
AFRatioEst
RPM

Because I noticed these showing very irregular numbers. Right clicking on these values show injector settings for 1250cc and 950 deadtime with 37 base fuel pressure. The incorrect values disregarded, the fuelflow does not coincide with the RPMs, and the AFRatioEst is shooting from 3:1 to 45:1

Can you swap the stock MAF back in?


edit: I also didn't see the Activate Fuel Pump selected, did you de-select it after trying without success?
 
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Did you set yur TPS volts at 0.63 using the TPS adjust feature?

This is just a hunch :aha: ...but have you tried enabling idle switch simulation through TPS? maybe it'll help. idk
 
I cleared everything except:
FuelFlow
AFRatioEst
RPM

Because I noticed these showing very irregular numbers. Right clicking on these values show injector settings for 1250cc and 950 deadtime with 37 base fuel pressure. The incorrect values disregarded, the fuelflow does not coincide with the RPMs, and the AFRatioEst is shooting from 3:1 to 45:1

Can you swap the stock MAF back in?


edit: I also didn't see the Activate Fuel Pump selected, did you de-select it after trying without success?
I see what you're saying now. I had FIC Bluemax 1250s in a few days ago, those are the injectors I'd like to ultimately run. Reading on the link forums suggested -64 and ~400 deadtime was the norm for those, but the car was giving me these idle problems so I swapped in the 560s. It's weird to me that you can right click on the values and it still shows that, yet I cleared the fuel maps and set the global to -19 and zero deadtime in the fuel tab. Obviously I'm doing something completely wrong with that.

I should add that the car did stay alive once at like 3-4000 rpm with the 1250s, but at a deadtime of 995 WTF. Otherwise it behaved exactly the same as it does with the 560s.

Cycling the fuel pump and grounding the timing did not change a thing. The laptop died so unfortunately I don't have a log of this along with my adjusted TPS. I'll try my best to get that later tonight.

The 1g maf plug is long gone, so I cannot plug the stock mas in.

This is just a hunch :aha: ...but have you tried enabling idle switch simulation through TPS? maybe it'll help. idk

Thanks I'll try this tonight.
 
I still didn't see anywhere that you mentioned checking your base timing using a timing light? You don't need the car on to check it, just cranking, which it does.
  1. Call a friend and tell them to come over for 5 minutes.
  2. When they get there connect with link and ground the timing connector (in the Misc tab).
  3. Loosen the CAS enough so you can rotate it.
  4. Hook up your adjustable timing light, positive/negative on the battery and onto spark plug wire 1, then adjust it to 5* advance.
  5. Tell your friend to crank the car over as you aim the light at your cam gears, then adjust the CAS until they line up like the video below. (If you can't tell, use white out on the marks to make them easier to spot with the timing light)
  6. Tighten up the CAS and now see if the car will start.
  7. Un-select the "ground timing connector" option.
DSCF3306.mp4 video by 92awdlaser - Photobucket

Whats showing in the log, as far as AFREst is concerned, is only as accurate as the information thats been submitted for that displayed value. If you change your fuel injector settings (global/deadtime) in the Fuel tab the logged AFREst won't be changed as well, you must go in there and manually change injector settings and fuel pressure. :ninja:

:dsm:
 
I'll work on dialing in the ignition timing this weekend.

Here's with the BISS half turn out.
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Here's with the BISS 3-4 full turns out.
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Here's with the BISS about 1.5 turns out, fuel pump activated, and timing grounded.
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Redid the throttle body gaskets, injector seals to the head, bov flange, and added a gallon of 100oct. Car runs great now. Thanks for the help.
 
So, this fixed a large boost (vacuum) leak correct? The car was just running too lean to idle, which took 2 seconds to achieve. thanks
 
Yes.

Here's a new log. I'm very happy with the car so far. Just need to wire up the radiator fan then I can finally start modding this thing.

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