What should I be doing with $5000?

[I DSM KILLA I]

Hello All,

I am of course new to this so I've got a lot of questions. Well it is pretty simple actually...

I have a 99 GSX with 110,000 original miles that has a cracked trans as of November. Well I have decided to let my local technical school have it as a project for next year but we obviously want to tune it.

So here it is:

What would you suggest I do for the $5000 I can dump into it and get me as close to 400HP as possible?

I know all new intake and exhaust pipes and manifolds, FMIC, bigger turbo, new axles for the power increase but as far as internals, I'm a little slow.

Any suggestions would be appreciated!!

Thanks in advance!!!

I am also aware of the engine basics as far as rebuilding the engine, new belts, new water pump, etc.

Thanks!!!

 

[SpawnedX]

I understand your frustration but this is a project for kids to learn the process. I am buying all the parts myself, and $5000 is what I have now. The car is going in to their school in September and will probably be in there until Spring.

After the car is redone, it will only be used for the occasional weekend drive or to shows to get more projects for the school. Up until now, it has been working on old early 90's cars and 60's muscle cars.

And I know I can buy most of the stuff for $5000 and if I need to put a little more, I am fine with that.

Must I quote the rules:

No insults, smart ass replies, or elitist attitudes. Do not act like a moderator and remind others of our rules, or nitpick when a member makes a grammatical mistake or asks a repetitive question. Report the post and move on.

How ironic.

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

Great, then build this car for 250 HP before you worry about 400 HP. This question has become quite annoying and stupid, it pops up 10 times a week and 95% of you never do it. Someone who wants 400 HP asks how to get 400 HP, not what to do with 5,000.00 to get 400 HP. Sounds to me an awful lot like "I don' really have a ton of money, so I probably really can't afford a 400 HP AWD car and the insane upkeep it requires."

And isn't part of the question on what to do with the $5000 asking how to get 400HP? Isn't that implied?

 

[98GSXtacy]

Must I quote the rules:

No insults, smart ass replies, or elitist attitudes. Do not act like a moderator and remind others of our rules, or nitpick when a member makes a grammatical mistake or asks a repetitive question. Report the post and move on.

Ahhhhh hell, busting out the rulebook on Meat...this won't end well

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

How ironic.

Yes it is but I am asking for advice and I'm not expecting to be lectured by another member who is frustrated by a post. Simply don't say anything if it is negative.

Thank you.

Ahhhhh hell, busting out the rulebook on Meat...this won't end well

I don't get why members have to lecture "newbies" because they are asking questions. All I'm asking is what you would suggest to get for the car to get up to near 400hp. Hell if it's easier to achieve 300-350HP I'll go that route.

 

[SpawnedX]

Here's the facts:

1. You have a stock car.
2. You can't figure out how to get to 400 HP on a site full of people doing the same thing with build lists everywhere and a wonderful search option.
3. You are letting children being taught how to do oil changes and brake jobs build a performance DSM.
4. You have a price goal rather than just a HP goal.
5. You want help to figure out where you need to be, fine, I'll give you help. Since you feel like you are just one of those advanced newbs who can just jump right in to 400 HP...

TurboByGarrett.com - Turbo Tech103

Fuel Injectors FLow Calculator - Fuelinjectorclinic

 

[xyexz]

I'm pretty pleased with my Punishment Racing FMIC and it seems like very decent build quality to answer your FMIC question.
Punishment Racing FMIC Kit: 90-94 Eclipse/Talon

For my new engine I went wiseco and eagle h beam rods seem to be the standard rods that most go with. Don't worry about touching your crank as stock they are plenty strong, I've put mine through it's paces and hasn't failed me when things blew up

Definitely make sure you research tuning, it's the most important part of the build after doing your regular maintenance/replacements and without it you won't make 400HP.

There are a lot of different kinds of solutions on the tuning front, and really the cheapest used to be (from my research), SAFC + MAFT and a logger but honestly you can and should think about picking up ECMLink v3 (they have a lite version)... this may be referred to as DSM Link elsewhere as that's what the project started out being called before the complete re-build in the code base etc. The v3 lite version is currently $375 and has direct support for the GM MAF (research this if you don't know what I'm talking about), the direct support means no MAF-T needed which saves you ~$100-150 used or $200+tax new.
The production site is there: http://www.ecmtuning.com/product_info.php?cPath=25&products_id=44
Of course if you choose the ECMLink route then you'll need to either send in your ECU for socketing or purchase one already done from them if you don't have an EEPROM ECU.

I would advise you take a look at the dyno challenge section and look at the cars parts/mods list running the hp you're looking to make:
DSM Dyno Challenge - Highest Horsepower

This should give you a pretty good idea of parts and what is done usually to the cars that can currently support n whp.

One last resource that's great for various information is vfaq: http://www.vfaq.com/index-main.html

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

Here's the facts:

1. You have a stock car.
2. You can't figure out how to get to 400 HP on a site full of people doing the same thing with build lists everywhere and a wonderful search option.
3. You are letting children being taught how to do oil changes and brake jobs build a performance DSM.
4. You have a price goal rather than just a HP goal.
5. You want help to figure out where you need to be, fine, I'll give you help. Since you feel like you are just one of those advanced newbs who can just jump right in to 400 HP...

TurboByGarrett.com - Turbo Tech103

Fuel Injectors FLow Calculator - Fuelinjectorclinic

I understand what you are saying but there's no need to be angry.

I understand its stock, I understand that letting kids work on it is very risky, I understand that you get frustrated very easily...

But its a project that the teacher is going to show the kids. He will be doing most if not all the car so I am not too worried.

I don't want to just jump into 400HP which is why I am on this forum.

So please tell me, what I can do to difuse this situation?

I'm pretty pleased with my Punishment Racing FMIC and it seems like very decent build quality to answer your FMIC question.
Punishment Racing FMIC Kit: 90-94 Eclipse/Talon

For my new engine I went wiseco and eagle h beam rods seem to be the standard rods that most go with. Don't worry about touching your crank as stock they are plenty strong, I've put mine through it's paces and hasn't failed me when things blew up

Definitely make sure you research tuning, it's the most important part of the build after doing your regular maintenance/replacements and without it you won't make 400HP.

There are a lot of different kinds of solutions on the tuning front, and really the cheapest used to be (from my research), SAFC + MAFT and a logger but honestly you can and should think about picking up ECMLink v3 (they have a lite version)... this may be referred to as DSM Link elsewhere as that's what the project started out being called before the complete re-build in the code base etc. The v3 lite version is currently $375 and has direct support for the GM MAF (research this if you don't know what I'm talking about), the direct support means no MAF-T needed which saves you ~$100-150 used or $200+tax new.
The production site is there: ECMTuning, Inc.
Of course if you choose the ECMLink route then you'll need to either send in your ECU for socketing or purchase one already done from them if you don't have an EEPROM ECU.

I would advise you take a look at the dyno challenge section and look at the cars parts/mods list running the hp you're looking to make:
DSM Dyno Challenge - Highest Horsepower

This should give you a pretty good idea of parts and what is done usually to the cars that can currently support n whp.

One last resource that's great for various information is vfaq: Visual Frequently Answered Questions - Home Page

Thank you for the advice. At least some people are nice around here...

 

[richard33]

I understand what you are saying but there's no need to be angry.

I understand its stock, I understand that letting kids work on it is very risky, I understand that you get frustrated very easily...

But its a project that the teacher is going to show the kids. He will be doing most if not all the car so I am not too worried.

I don't want to just jump into 400HP which is why I am on this forum.

So please tell me, what I can do to difuse this situation?



Thank you for the advice. At least some people are nice around here...

The problem is this question has been answered about 50 times this week. The website has an upgrade path with exactly what to do to get to the power level. Your situation is no different then all these people before you who posted the same thing. You want 400hp, cool. Search the forums and see what people are doing to get 400.

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

I would advise you take a look at the dyno challenge section and look at the cars parts/mods list running the hp you're looking to make:
DSM Dyno Challenge - Highest Horsepower

I took a look and looks like a lot of cars have the 2.3L stroker in the 350-450HP range with a year close to mine.

The problem is this question has been answered about 50 times this week. The website has an upgrade path with exactly what to do to get to the power level. Your situation is no different then all these people before you who posted the same thing. You want 400hp, cool. Search the forums and see what people are doing to get 400.

My apologies.

 

[MrBoxx]

Mr Costa is just venting some frustrations he has with answering frequently asked/answered questions that do pop up on here occasionally. The 400hp goal is a common one and a lot of people are trying to reach it. You can imagine how many times we see the question on a site full of enthusiasts.

While I saw the Evo3 16g turbo suggested above, you'll find that getting 400hp out of it will really be pushing the limits of the turbo and your other supporting modifications. A 50-trim turbo (FP Green, PTE 50-trim, etc.) or a Holset turbo will get you there faster and easier, with much more room to upgrade in the future. ECMLink will be a huge benefit for tuning beyond that magic number as well.

What will ultimately be the deciding factor on what route you take is going to be whether you decide to continue with the stock 7-bolt engine and build it for as high a horsepower as you can get, or whether you decide to do a 6-bolt conversion and build for maximum power. Not saying that a 7-bolt can't get 400 or 500 or even 600hp, but it's been the trend that if you want to go for those high numbers, you switch to the 6-bolt engine and associated parts. There's a huge cost involved in that, so it may eat up the budget that you would otherwise use on supporting modifications for the 7-bolt.

If I could give one piece of advice, without giving you specific parts or brands to buy, it would be to not go cheap on your build. Buy quality parts, from reputable DSM vendors, and stay away from knock-off parts from ebay and other sites. DSM vendors do more than just sell you parts for your car: in many cases they're responsible for creating those parts in the first place. They can also help you get the right combination of parts to help you achieve your goal, and when you make relationships with them, they can probably get you good deals on those parts.

 

[richard33]

I took a look and looks like a lot of cars have the 2.3L stroker in the 350-450HP range with a year close to mine.



My apologies.

check the dyno section and click on some 400hp cars. IF you like their setup, go with it. Use extremepsi or MAP to buy new parts or the classifieds to buy used. Just be careful buying used parts obviously. The 16g/e85 route would be a great way to go. That would be a fun little street car there.

 

[98GSXtacy]

And Eric saves the day and calms everyone down, I praise you kind sir. Sorry if you took it that way, but like Eric just said, it can get frustrating having the same threads constantly and sometimes it gets taken out on people. No harm meant by it or anything and have a good time with the build and welcome to the site.

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

Thanks for the advice!! I'm not looking to go past the initial power that I am going to try to achieve, and if so, it will be much later when I have kids and they grow up (at least 18 years from now). I want it to be a fun driving car if I want to go to a local car show or get the occasional "rice burner" in the mirror behind me.

I need to get my part list made and I will post that in this forum for everyones approval hopefully by the end of the week.

And Eric saves the day and calms everyone down, I praise you kind sir. Sorry if you took it that way, but like Eric just said, it can get frustrating having the same threads constantly and sometimes it gets taken out on people. No harm meant by it or anything and have a good time with the build and welcome to the site.

I am definitely looking forward to doing this build (4 years in the making)!!

 

[MrBoxx]

I need to get my part list made and I will post that in this forum for everyones approval hopefully by the end of the week.

Once you get your list made, if you're up to listening to possible criticisms, we can offer small suggestions or changes based on our experiences with those parts or combinations of parts.

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

Once you get your list made, if you're up to listening to possible criticisms, we can offer small suggestions or changes based on our experiences with those parts or combinations of parts.

I am counting on it!

The teacher of the class suggested:

Apexi-USA - Power FC

 

[GsXdSmKingGsX]

I would suggest you save your money. If your headed to school, money will be hard to come by.


And do you really feel like spending 1/5 of your funds on a freaking tuning device? Just go with link man.

 

[AZEclipse07]

Check out Ecmlink's website and the FAQs. Don't spend your money on that other stuff.

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

I would suggest you save your money. If your headed to school, money will be hard to come by.


And do you really feel like spending 1/5 of your funds on a freaking tuning device? Just go with link man.

No I'm not in school. I am thinking the same thing since its 1/2 the price of this.

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

What would be a good turbo option for this build? Any kits that are low priced that I can use?

Thanks again!

 

[AZEclipse07]

There are some good suggestions in the previous responses. The least expensive set up would be the evo16g. The others will probably need an external wastegate setup that will be more costly but with turbos that will get you to your goal much easier. Do a little research and we can help with any specific turbo questions.

 

[AK Maniak]

What would be a good turbo option for this build? Any kits that are low priced that I can use?

Thanks again!

Look at the 20g, getting 400hp out of a 16g is pretty tough and would be much easier with a bigger turbo. As for a kit, just build your own.

 

[master jared]

umm party your a$* off and blow all of it on crap then do it again next year.

 

[Alex Bland]

GET A ECMLINK! thats going to be my FIRST mod, then injectors, e316g, 3in, fmic. If my tranny does not die before that.

then after i break stuff in my motor with that then ill build it. well thats my plan atleast

 

[aPOS]

I'm not looking to go past the initial power that I am going to try to achieve, and if so, it will be much later when I have kids and they grow up (at least 18 years from now).
I want it to be a fun driving car if I want to go to a local car show or get the occasional "rice burner" in the mirror behind me.

First of all, I'll compliment you for articulating your ideas clearly. However, I'm perplexed at why you don't just drive to ExtremePSI, since according to Google it's very near you, and have long discussions with their sales team. After all, they would be getting "paid" to talk to you, and they would have an interest in gaining you $5000 of business. Since it's going to be a "show car," built by the local vo-tech, they may offer some kind of sponsorship to save you money.


I had spent over a year as a "guest" here on DSMtuners, prior to recently joining, meaning I read, and consequently learned, a lot. I doubt I know more than you, yet my simple advice, in addition to my previous remarks, would be to call other well respected vendors on this site for comparing their offerings. Your question has been beaten to death here, but to a vendor it is a potential customer ready to buy. Even calling the specialty vendors, like ECMTuning, Forced Performance, Punishment Racing, ETS, and others could broaden you ideas. My initial judgment would be starting with DSMlink, a K&N PFIK, visiting EXtremePSI, and finding out the expense to paint/detail your GSX to become a show car.

Regarding your suspicion that this present goal will be final, more than likely when you reach around 400 hp, you will doubtlessly want more sooner than 18 years in the future.

 

[I DSM KILLA I]

Well it's been a long way coming! Car is finally 100% mine as of yesterday, as of Thursday it is at the votech, and next Thursday I'm going to Extreme PSI to talk to them about solutions.

However does anyone know of a place in NJ/PA/NY/MD/DE area that I can get a 5 speed AWD trans at a decent price and decent milage that isn't rusted? And I think I may scale back the project to reach a goal of 300+ HP instead of going for 350-400HP.

Also I know it is early and I am not going to buy these until the mantainence & modifications are done first, but I just found out yesterday I get a wicked discount on Pioneer & Infinity/JBL/Harman Kardon products so what are your opinons on products? I have listed several below however I am not a boom-boom person when it comes to radio but more of an audiophile and want a crisp, clean, high quality sound system so sub doesn't need to be powerful.

Headunit:
Pioneer AVIC-Z120BT Double DIN MSRP $1599 My price $980

AMP
KAPPA FIVE 5-Channel Class D Amp MSRP $599 My Price $301

Front Speakers
KAPPA60.9CS 6.5" 2-way Component System MSRP $279.99 My Price $141
or
KAPPA Perfect 6.1 6.5" Component System MSRP $475 My Price $226.60

Rear Speakers
KAPPA693.9I 6"x9" 3-way Loudspeaker MSRP $229 My Price $113
or
KAPPA680.9CS 6"x8" Component System MSRP $279 My Price $141

Front In-dash Speakers
(I've heard the speaker size being between 2"-4" so I listed two)
KAPPA10.9T 1" Edge-driven Tweeter MSRP $140 My Price $68
or
KAPPA32.9CF 3.5" 2-way Loudspeaker MSRP $120 My Price $55

Subwoofer
(I am debating a preloaded enclosure or making my own in the spare tire well)
REF1220SE Single 12" Preloaded Enclosure MSRP $279 My Price $165
or
REF1220DE Dual 12" Preloaded Enclosure MSRP $475 My Price $264
or
KAPPA100.9W 10" High Performance Sub MSRP $229 My Price $112
or
KAPPA Perfect 10DVQ 10" Die-Cast Sub MSRP $269 My Price $144


Let me know what you think and if its a good ideal to get rid of the spare or possibly just drop it lower than stock with new brackets welded to accomodate the sub. I am thinking about screwing the sub to the bottom of the particle board for the spare compartment and covering it with metal on top so I can still use the trunk area.


Thanks again!!!