Welded Center Diff as a Daily Driver?

[GeosTalon]

I think I originally voted for welded center diff. I'm recinding it and saying "No" on a street car. I thought it was good at first, but I live in a community where the streets are narrow and my neighbor parks across the street in line with my driveway. I need to make a VERY tight turn to get in and out. The rear u-joint broke yesterday, and the driveshaft smashed the crossmember something fierce. I'll have another driveshaft in two days, but I'm now going to be on the lookout for a stock CD as welded does not work for me.

 

[Maglin]

so you have been making this very tight turn in your car for the past few months with a welded center diff???

That wasn't the brightest move. I also removed my P/S and it actually helps me not to load up the driveline to much. It's very hard to turn past about 20* and requires two hands. On any parking lots I definitly do a 3 point turn. half the time it's cause I have something in my other hand. But it's also cause I don't want to place to much stress on my driveline and cause one of the Lambro joints to fail or just end up twisting my driveshaft in general. I've been driving my car with a center diff spool for a little over a year now. Last 4 months the car has been down for a engine build and newer bigger turbo install. In the city of Las Vegas it still isn't that big an issue. Once in a while their is that parking spot I have to pass up cause the turn it just to much and the road to narrow to get in their in a decent amount of time. But it's still a moot point. Take care of the car and you will be ok. It's not CV Joints that are going to see the most abuse. it's going to be the TCase, driveline, and front and rear diff's that see the most abuse from this. Also a very good idea to ensure proper tire inflaction as per your door sticker. Not 30-32 all the way around. That way with the weight and what not all 4 tires should have the same rolling diamiter.

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

I'd like to update this as well.

Since my last post, I have not broken one thing. However, I do baby the car around any type of sharp bend, take my time, etc etc.

I will be removing it soon, though, in favor of a stock unit because I've came to the conclusion that the car rarely gets launched, and I honestly don't need the hassle a welded center diff brings with it. Maybe I'll pick up a 4-spider down the road, but for now, the stocker and soft launches will be much better for me.

-Jesse

 

[GeosTalon]

so you have been making this very tight turn in your car for the past few months with a welded center diff???

That wasn't the brightest move. But it's still a moot point. Take care of the car and you will be ok. It's not CV Joints that are going to see the most abuse. it's going to be the TCase, driveline, and front and rear diff's that see the most abuse from this. Also a very good idea to ensure proper tire inflaction as per your door sticker. Not 30-32 all the way around. That way with the weight and what not all 4 tires should have the same rolling diamiter.

While I really appreciate being basically called stupid, I need to mention a couple of things:

1. I didn't have the CD welded, the car was sold to me like this. I've driven it for a cumulative total of two weeks.

2. I'd love to take care of the car more, but I had no control over the previous owners. Essentially I bought a headache. But I'm dealing with it.

3. I know all about driving a car with a spool. Had a Camaro two cars ago with a 12 bolt rear.

4. The previous owner didn't know that the center diff being welded and wide tires would be a bad combo. I know that it is, and am trying to fix it.

While a welded center works for you and others, it doesn't work for me. I live on a narrow street that necessitates me turning the wheel to lock. I've launched the car hard once since I've owned it. Bottom line is that it's not for me.

 

[Maglin]

While I really appreciate being basically called stupid, I need to mention a couple of things:

1. I didn't have the CD welded, the car was sold to me like this. I've driven it for a cumulative total of two weeks.

2. I'd love to take care of the car more, but I had no control over the previous owners. Essentially I bought a headache. But I'm dealing with it.

3. I know all about driving a car with a spool. Had a Camaro two cars ago with a 12 bolt rear.

4. The previous owner didn't know that the center diff being welded and wide tires would be a bad combo. I know that it is, and am trying to fix it.

While a welded center works for you and others, it doesn't work for me. I live on a narrow street that necessitates me turning the wheel to lock. I've launched the car hard once since I've owned it. Bottom line is that it's not for me.

Wasn't poking at you sorry. Was having a bad day and I get disgruntaled. But yet if you do have a spool/welded center diff you shoudln't turn the wheel to lock if at all possible. You have to. The 4 spider diff is a good item. Still have thrust bearing issues possible and they do break as well just not near as much.

Totally sorry to hear you bought someone elses headache. Hope you got a good deal on it. I'm a mechanic so I prefer to get cars with some running issues as they are generally very easy and cheap to fix. Can shave a few K off the price of the car.

 

[GRNDSM]

You know what is really stupid? It is when people rely on such polls to make-up their minds about modifications.

If any of you guys never saw a poll that points you in a wrong direction, this is IT!!!

 

[GeosTalon]

Wasn't poking at you sorry. Was having a bad day and I get disgruntaled. But yet if you do have a spool/welded center diff you shoudln't turn the wheel to lock if at all possible. You have to. The 4 spider diff is a good item. Still have thrust bearing issues possible and they do break as well just not near as much.

Totally sorry to hear you bought someone elses headache. Hope you got a good deal on it. I'm a mechanic so I prefer to get cars with some running issues as they are generally very easy and cheap to fix. Can shave a few K off the price of the car.

Ah, it's cool man. I was feeling the same way yesterday, some eDirectory sync issues and my day took a dive something fierce.

I paid $1600 for the car. Paid $375 to have it towed the last 150 miles to my house when both front CV axles checked out on me. It had some issues, but I didn't do my due diligence in inspecting the car. I just wanted something cheaper on gas, which it is since I never drive it. Still love the car though. If not for my neighbor parking RIGHT at the end of my driveway, I'd be fine. I still am looking to dump the welded CD, it's not for me.

The one thing I've got to say is, you would never drive your 4x4 truck on the dry streets with the 4WD engaged. Causes excessive stress on the drivetrain. Why should your DSM be any different?

If anyone has an idea on the easiest (read: cheapest and quickest) way for me to dump the welded center differential, I'm all ears.

 

[GRNDSM]

The one thing I've got to say is, you would never drive your 4x4 truck on the dry streets with the 4WD engaged. Causes excessive stress on the drivetrain. Why should your DSM be any different?

You forgot fuel economy as another reason why people do not do it on their trucks . But DSM are different, they are WORSE! Cars have stickier tires than trucks, so they see even MORE stress on the drivetrain than trucks!

If anyone has an idea on the easiest (read: cheapest and quickest) way for me to dump the welded center differential, I'm all ears.

First, make sure that it actually a welded center diff and not just a VCE (in which case you will just need a viscous coupling ~$25 used and ~30 min to swap). Otherwise, you will need a used center diff ($100-$200) and the swap can be done in ~2 hours (less if you have done it before) with tranny still on the car.

So ether way, you are not looking at a major project here.

Then, you can sell your welded center diff for around $100 to offset the cost of this job.

 

[GeosTalon]

I'll look into the trans over the weekend. I can't wait to be back to normal. I wouldn't be surprised if the differential was just broken. Either way, I'll get it fixed.

Thank you for the info!

 

[MyBlack94GST]

Leon,

You mentioned getting a used VC in your last post - is there a test you can run on it off the car to make sure that it's OK?

 

[pneumo]

I can test it for you easily.

And for those of you who don't live two blocks away, just jack up one front wheel so it's off the ground. Make sure the other 3 wheels are firmly planted on the ground. Put blocks under the wheels so the car won't roll off the jack, then try to spin the wheel. If it spins easily the VC is blown. If the wheel is hard to spin the VC is good.

 

[GRNDSM]

One time, as I was staring at a box of 4-5 VCs and had to pick a “good one”. So I took an outer center diff cover, put in a wise and slipped the VC onto it. This way, I was able to grab the VC with my hands and twist it back and forth. They all took considerable effort to twist, but I was able to pick one that offered the highest resistance to twisting.

If I had to guess, it takes around 20ft*lbs of torque to make them slip at low speed.

I had this grand idea of welding a bad socket to a bad center diff cover, so that I can actually test this with a beam style torque wrench, but I never got around it.

Such tool should be able to spot a bad VC. I have seen some which I could spin with my fingers!!! But I was always afraid of picking a VC which was bad, but not quite to a point of twisting with your fingers.

 

[MyBlack94GST]

So either a VC is good or it's not? No middle ground? My car was run for a while with two different size pairs of tires front/back (yeah yeah, wasn't me) and exhibits all the signs of a locked/blown/piled/whatever center diff. I'm going to throw the Mitsu center diff rebuild kit at it for now, but need to know FOR SURE if the VC is re-usable.

Car's coming along Dave... slowly but surely haha

 

[Maglin]

If I remember correctly it shoudl take like 30 seconds to do a full 360* @ 40 ft/lbs might be 60 ft/lbs. That is how to tell if it's good or not. A bad one can still have resistance but not up to spec. IF you have a crappy tranny just us an old or bad input shaft. Cut it up and put a socket on it to use a torque wrench. Got that info from TRE when I had them do my tranny. I wasn't to sure about my VC and asked how you could test them.

 

[jtmcinder]

To measure a VC, spin one side at 100 rpm and mreasure the transmitted torque at the other end. I doubt that it's an all-or-nothing (i.e., catastrophic) failure function, but who knows.

- Jtoby

 

[MyBlack94GST]

Awesome, but what output torque am I looking for?