Valvetrain for Cams. Need help

[AWDtalonPt2]

Alright, I'm getting close to starting my build. My choice of cams will be either kelford 272's or FP2's. My question is about springs and retainers. What would be a good combo for either cam choice? I'll be running a 68HTA on link v3 with all supporting mods. If you need more info, just ask. Thanks.

 

[paultheninja]

Kigglys for sure

 

[Talipse96]

It deplends on your budget. The EVO springs and retainers are a good choice. They are a little better than stock and can handle those cams. They aren't expensive either if you can find them.
Your current springs might be able to handle those cams but it all depends on how many miles are on your car/springs.

 

[AWDtalonPt2]

It deplends on your budget. The EVO springs and retainers are a good choice. They are a little better than stock and can handle those cams. They aren't expensive either if you can find them.
Your current springs might be able to handle those cams but it all depends on how many miles are on your car/springs.

I've actually looked in this direction. 75k on my car. 178 to 180 across the board on my last compression check. Lets just say if I could buy valve springs and retainers just once, what should I go for?

 

[hurricanecris24]

Get the kigglys then you'll never have to upgrade again

 

[AWDtalonPt2]

Get the kigglys then you'll never have to upgrade again

Good call. Thanks. Anyone else? Pro's Con's?

 

[donniekak]

It deplends on your budget. The EVO springs and retainers are a good choice. They are a little better than stock and can handle those cams. They aren't expensive either if you can find them.
Your current springs might be able to handle those cams but it all depends on how many miles are on your car/springs.

I just tested 32 evo valvesprings at the machine shop last weekend. They are a joke. All but 4 of them were around 50lbs at standard installed height 1.575". The worst part is they were only 145lbs at 10mm lift. Brand new stock replacement springs were stronger.

 

[GsXdSmKingGsX]

Kiggly man. I've heard bad things about people that tried Evo Springs and Kelfords..

Just do the mod that requires no more. Kiggly FTW

 

[Talipse96]

I would say do a lot of research and try to match the valve springs to the cams as best as you can. Decide what cam you would like to run and then pick the best spring for them. Look at the lift on the cams and the compression of the springs. "I" would get something that would be just a little better than stock for that size of cam. That way your valvetrain isn't working harder than it has to.

Do you plan on going with a bigger cam in the future or do you plan on staying in the 272 range? If you plan on changing cams, then of course buy springs once and be done, but if these are the cams that you plan on sticking with then get something a little better than stock.

 

[GsXdSmKingGsX]

I would say do a lot of research and try to match the valve springs to the cams as best as you can. Decide what cam you would like to run and then pick the best spring for them. Look at the lift on the cams and the compression of the springs. "I" would get something that would be just a little better than stock for that size of cam. That way your valvetrain isn't working harder than it has to.

Do you plan on going with a bigger cam in the future or do you plan on staying in the 272 range? If you plan on changing cams, then of course buy springs once and be done, but if these are the cams that you plan on sticking with then get something a little better than stock.

You must have forgotten that Kelford 272's are like most other companies 280's. Evo springs will not work man. If you go with Kelfords, you should be good for most setups you can imagine.

 

[AWDtalonPt2]

Alright. Good Info. So aside from valvetrain, how bout the cams? FP2's or Kelford 272's?

 

[Talipse96]

You must have forgotten that Kelford 272's are like most other companies 280's. Evo springs will not work man. If you go with Kelfords, you should be good for most setups you can imagine.

I don't know if I just never paid attention the the brand, but when I was researching and looking for cams and springs for my car I didn't read much on Kelford.

So with the information provided above with the EVO springs being weak and the cam being on the bigger side. I guess the EVO springs are out of the question. Maybe I should go and update myself again on vavle springs and newer cams...

 

[dsmornothing]

Ive heard good about the manley springs. I in fact run them.

 

[GsXdSmKingGsX]

Alright. Good Info. So aside from valvetrain, how bout the cams? FP2's or Kelford 272's?

They are both solid cams. I know more people that have ran Kelfords than FP2's so I wont offer my opinion on the other. But I cant think of anyone that has been let down by their Kelford 272's. Major power gains.

 

[Talipse96]

I'll be running a 68HTA on link v3 with all supporting mods.

If the Kelfords are closer to a 280 wouldn't they be a little big for the 68HTA?

From extremepsi...
FPCam2: -Compatible with stock springs. Similar to HKS 272 camshaft, but with a greater emphasis on top end power. Gives up a little bottom end torque to the HKS 272 cam and gains power higher in the RPM band.

I'm trying to help and get educated at the same time.

Here you can see the specs of the Kelfords
EXTREME PSI : Your #1 Source for In Stock Performance Parts

gofer runs the FP2's with the 68HTA. You should ask him about his setup. He runs on corn E85 but he should still be able to tell you how the perform. He also runs the EVO IX springs.

 

[JacksonAuto]

Stock springs are for stock cams. Evo springs are a bit better than those of earlier engines but only because they are a smidge lighter. They still lack the proper amount of spring pressure to operate properly with larger, more aggressive cams.

The Manley single springs are also a replacement spring. Not really an upgrade with around 60 lbs seat pressure.

You want to get a set of PAC alloy beehives and titanium retainers to work with the cams you mentioned.

 

[AWDtalonPt2]

Thanks everybody. So I'm guessing kiggley's or PAC. As far as the cams go, It seems the Kelfords would be stretching the 68HTA. FP2's seem to be better suited for this turbo. What about a 264 272 combo with the Kelfords? With the research I've done, I'm leaning more towards the kelfords however if the 272's can't be maximized with the 68HTA I'm back to the FP2's unless the 264 272 combo on the Kelfords would be sufficient. Again, Thanks everyone.

 

[GsXdSmKingGsX]

Question. Why did you choose the 68HTA?

 

[standard235]

I'm gonna say Kelford 272 and their beehives or GSC S2's and their beehives.

 

[JacksonAuto]

Kiggley = PAC = GSC = Ferrea and probably others. There are only a few actual spring manufacturers. The rest are just repacking and putting their sticker on it.

 

[AWDtalonPt2]

I went with the 68HTA because I was going to go with a E316G. I liked the extra up top of the HTA. Also I got it when FP was having their Christmas sale. I actually returned an Evo3 for it because they added two days after the sale. I'm building a street car, not a daily but a street car none the less. I'm curious to see where the HTA68 falls off. My power goals along with efficiency would put the Evo3 at it's limits.

JacksonAuto> thanks, I didn't know that.

So how about 264 and 272 Kelfords?

 

[Carlz0r]

Rather than make a new thread I may as well ask here. What sort of rev range are the kiggly/pac/etc. springs good for? I'm looking for a good valvetrain setup that'll handle up to or more than 9000rpm (its nice to have a little extra headroom).

 

[JacksonAuto]

It will be dependent on several factors including how much boost and the weight of the valves. I've heard of guys taking them to 10k and know personally of guys that turn them to 9500 with mild, low boost setups.

 

[AWDtalonPt2]

Ok, I'll give a bit more info on my build. I'll try to be short but descriptive as possible.
*engine
-Stock 7 bolt bottom end w/ BSE and decked
-stock head, resurfaced, arp's and cometic
-valvetrain and cams are still to be decided
*trans and diffs
-rebuilt, evo3 gears, 4 spider center, front lsd, and evo3 rear guts
-new oem transfer case or rebuilt(still deciding)
-South bend SS p.p. and TZ kevlar disc
-new oem- clutch fork, fulcrum ball, TOB/clip, slave and master w/ full ss line
-resurfaced flywheel or ACT chromoly
*Fuel
-STM -6an tank to rail and return w/ fuel lab fpr and filter
-walbro or FP 255(I have both, still deciding)
-STM rewire kit
-1000cc or better injectors( I know they are not needed but I may go to E85 if not satisfied with 93)
*Turbo
-FP 68HTA (I dig it. MHI mixed with some FP love. I already like what it's been doing so far)
-FP race manifold
-Internal wastegate
-PR 02 housing rercirced dump
*Tuning
-AEM uego
-AEM tru boost
-Hallman BC
-Link V3 or AEM v2 (I would like some opinions)

That's about it. I'm shooting for around 380 to 390 on 93 while being as mild mannered as possible. If I do decide to try E85 my goal will be at least 425. What cams would be best suited for this set up? I like the Kelford 272's but am hearing they would not be fully utilized with the 68HTA. My second choice would be HKS 272's or FP2's. I'll choose my valvetrain according to cam choice. The car will mainly see highway(I like to take her on trips), long back road twisties, drag strip(maybe 3 runs twice a year), VERY spirited winter driving (I love NEPA), and maybe an autox. What cams do you think would be best suited to my build and usage. I've also been looking at a Kelford 264 272 combo or equal. I'm kind of at a loss here. As always, Thanks ahead of time.

C'mon people. The quicker I figure this out the better. I only have a few things left to get aside from some hardware and gaskets. Which cams would be best suited for my build?

 

[AWDtalonPt2]

See above post. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^