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Street Car Acceleration Build?

Posted by fmars62, Mar 6, 2014

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  1. DogWhistle

    DogWhistle Proven Member

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    Joined Sep 13, 2012
    St. Paul, Minnesota
    Well if you don't daily the car, then by all means strip down the luxury items and keep everything simple. Especially from a wiring standpoint!!! Take your time and run all the wires correctly and make sure each and every nook and crany is painted and clean. If you want to stay 2.0 for RPM purposes I assume, then I would still look at the FP turbos and especially the black or something with a modest A/R or aspect ratio of turbo, yet flows a large volume. I think 500 is plenty until you start doing serious drivetrain upgrades with better differentials so you can actually use it along with nicer suspension.

    I never thought I'd take my daily this far but if you are weekend warrior-ing, then e sure to keep it simple.
     

    Drag Race Build 796  3

    1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM

    2K  6

    1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder N/T
    fwd · automatic · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1991 Mitsubishi Mighty Max
    manual · 4G63t Swapped

    3K  6

    1996 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    385 whp · 378 lb/ft · 2G DSM
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  2. njreclipse

    njreclipse Probationary Member

    7
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    Joined Aug 26, 2012
    kansas city, Missouri
    i plan on going hx35 since its cheap setup and can make 400whp easily
     
  3. iBoostDSM

    iBoostDSM Proven Member

    488
    4
    Joined Sep 4, 2010
    Kalamazoo, Michigan
    Hx35, t3 or t3 twin scroll, e85, stock block, cams and you'll be very close to 500whp if not over. That along with some fuel mods and DSMlink and you'll be set.
     

    1K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    406 whp · 365.4 lb/ft · 1G DSM
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  4. boost97gst

    boost97gst Proven Member

    2,803
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    Joined Apr 2, 2012
    st jacob, Illinois
    The hy35 is an option too. But if you're going TS then an hx35 TS T3 would be a very fast spooling, high hp turbo.When you go TS you tend to get the best of both worlds. It just costs a whole helluva lot more.
     
  5. donniekak

    donniekak DSM Wiseman

    4,686
    900
    Joined Mar 23, 2008
    Surprise, Arizona
    A gt40r car accelerates much harder than a 16g car. It's all about operating the engine in the correct rev range.
     

    Street Build 4K  0

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  6. fmars62

    fmars62 Proven Member

    236
    1
    Joined May 30, 2011
    Middletown, New York
    i really dont want anything with a lot of lag obviously or a big torque hit, so i guess i am forced to go twin scroll?
     
  7. DSMReviver

    DSMReviver Proven Member

    816
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    Joined Mar 4, 2008
    Little Rock, Arkansas
    ...Good mechanical center diff or rally art high viscousity center disc.
     
    DSMReviver

    1K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM

    Showcar Build 896  0

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 2G DSM
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  8. fmars62

    fmars62 Proven Member

    236
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    Joined May 30, 2011
    Middletown, New York
    alright guys, bringing this thread back. i decided i want a fast accelerating car, something that has great throttle response. goal is 450-500 at the wheels

    here is my build so far:
    9:1 compression built block
    7 bolt head gsc s2 cams
    kiggly behives
    evo 3 intake manifold
    1g throttle body
    e85

    now i have been thinking about the forced performance 68hta but everyone says it falls off pretty fast (from what i have read)
     
  9. rvaughn

    rvaughn Proven Member

    164
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    Joined Apr 29, 2008
    Portland, Oregon
    Looks good, you going stroker? The 68hta would be a good fit imo as long as you don't mind tapping out around ~475. Gofer has done quiet a bit of work with his 68hta, Id try talking to him about it if you are serious about the turbo. Keep us up to date on things, Im excited to see it come together.
     
  10. fmars62

    fmars62 Proven Member

    236
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    Joined May 30, 2011
    Middletown, New York
    rvaughn i stayed 2.0l

    also just got my tranny back, full evo3 gearset with double syncros.

    thinking about starting a build thread since i am fully restoring my gsx.
     
  11. gofer

    gofer Moderator

    5,484
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    Joined Feb 18, 2006
    South Gilbert, Arizona
    Skimmed through the thread and it looks like you're looking for 450-500awhp, lofty goal to reach with a HTA68 hanging off the motor. If you're trying to stay bolt-on I'd recommend a FP Green and if you've got money to spend a HTA3076.

    What specifically do you want to know about the HTA68?
     

    Street Build 16K  12  61

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.634 @ 126.050 · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 2G DSM
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  12. fmars62

    fmars62 Proven Member

    236
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    Joined May 30, 2011
    Middletown, New York
    my goal is 450-500 at the wheels but i want the fastest spooling turbo for that option.
    i love the instant throttle response and having that kind of power on tap when i want it. and reading around people said the 68hta spools pretty darn quick, im just worried about it falling off.

    i would like to see full boost by 3500 rpm's

    i am going higher compression and e85
     
  13. OHM_Racer

    OHM_Racer Supporting Vendor

    92
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    Joined Jul 4, 2014
    Austin, Texas
    I recommend FP Red, 1400cc and some Kelford 272s, enough power with good response.
     
  14. fmars62

    fmars62 Proven Member

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    Joined May 30, 2011
    Middletown, New York
    see i dont want good, i want the best LOL.

    if u read before i already told you my engine setup
     
  15. OHM_Racer

    OHM_Racer Supporting Vendor

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    Austin, Texas
    Well man go for the HTA68 you are gonna love it, but you wont reach 500whp.
     
  16. gofer

    gofer Moderator

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    South Gilbert, Arizona
    The saying, "you can't have your cake and eat it too" applies here.

    You're not going to find a turbo that hits 30psi+ @ 3.5k and gets you to 450-500whp, not a chance. I'm hitting 30psi @ 4.3k on the HTA68 with a stock 7-bolt bottom end, with an IR BCS boost only tapers to 28psi by 7.5k and I'm seeing airflow numbers ~51lbs/min. You might be able to get a Evo III 16g to spool to 30psi by 3.8k but you won't be seeing over 45lbs/min. An HX35 will give you similar results so if you're trying to save a few bucks I'd go the Holset route...

    If you want the fastest spooling setup possible for the street you should have done a high comp (10:1) stroker build or just built a 2.4l.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2014

    Street Build 16K  12  61

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.634 @ 126.050 · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 2G DSM
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  17. Fullthrottle7

    Fullthrottle7 Proven Member

    171
    42
    Joined May 21, 2004
    Lake Tapps, Washington
    Having selected that big of a cam and a top end biased intake manifold on a 2.0l, you may as well pick a 50 trim/HX35/30R variant and max that thing out! The E85 will let you pull 500whp out of any of those three turbos and they are all humming along pretty close to full boost just after 4k rpm. I haven't used an HTA68 yet so if the powerband feels the same then I guess thats an option too, but you'd have to look at some dyno plots to see if the area under the curve stays the same as the larger compressors up to its max. My guess is that even though it can force enough air out to make good power, it may not do it as efficiently though FP works miracles so that could be a very poor assumption on my part. 300rpm difference in spool isn't too noticeable and if you drive like you sound, I doubt you'll be disappointed in the weekend warrior status the car will have with any of those options. Ultimate bet in my mind is the HTA3076 since it has a very efficient wheel which is easier to turn, while still offering up a well matched turbine. The whole assembly is proven and will be sure to meet your expectations!

    A stroked, high compression 1g head w/cyclone mani would have really been the ultimate in acceleration so now that you're in the middle ground I say either enjoy that or go for top end LOL!
     

    Street Build 1K  0

    1995 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 2G DSM

    1K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  18. rvaughn

    rvaughn Proven Member

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    Joined Apr 29, 2008
    Portland, Oregon
    I linked my thread before but here you go. The money is no object game netted me this with the 2.3, T/S, HTA3076. I admit I could probably push it a little further with a cyclone intake but Ill take the spool it has, no problem, im done spending big bucks on power mods, I need handling! This thing is almost an EXACT copy of my Evo 3 16g power band -20 hp from 2500 to 3500 rpm, after that the thing goes STUPID :D.

    I am glad Gofer and others have chimmed in, the knowledge here is great!
     

    Attached Files:

  19. coupe_nasty

    coupe_nasty Proven Member

    234
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    Joined Oct 15, 2011
    Easton, Maryland
    Im running a ball bearing Fp Green Hta on 93 pump gas making 350whp on a gsx. It is fun on the street. This is with stock internals and stock cams. After some gsc s1's im hoping to be close to 400whp. If u ran a similar setup as me on e85, u are looking ay one super awesome street car probably making around 450-475whp.
     

    5K  25

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    350.0 whp · 315.0 lb/ft · 2G DSM
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  20. fmars62

    fmars62 Proven Member

    236
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    Joined May 30, 2011
    Middletown, New York
    do cams affect spool time? like to 272 cams make the turbo lag a bit more or no? also wouldnt the strokers kill my tranny?
     
  21. Fullthrottle7

    Fullthrottle7 Proven Member

    171
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    Joined May 21, 2004
    Lake Tapps, Washington
    Typically, yes a larger cam will hinder spool a slight amount although the gains up top for the most part are an easy trade off to justify. In the big cam test that AMS did on EvoM, the BC 272's that everyone hates on were the only cam that I remember which actually gained torque through the low end during and just after spool, but they were significantly overshadowed up top. Being a GSC fan I would ask the guys there if their S1 grind acts in a similar fashion! Again though, 2-300rpm difference in spool between a lot of these setups isn't going to be very noticeable. If you have 25psi on any of the turbos discussed by 4200rpm you're going to have a smile on your face!

    Also, torque seems to kill 3rd and 4th gears pretty often which is why I'm really considering selling the 6 bolt 100mm crank I bought and just sticking with a 2.0l with the cyclone mani to help the bottom end. The power band these 2.3 and 2.4's are creating is just crazy and winding out our trans to 9k with a twin disc seems to keep them alive better than pounding on them with 500ft/lbs by 5k rpm LOL. I think a Green/50trim/30R on a stroker would be below the level of guaranteed destruction though. If you're too concerned and want the power just go slushbox!
     

    Street Build 1K  0

    1995 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 2G DSM

    1K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  22. livedsm4g63

    livedsm4g63 Proven Member

    1,025
    148
    Joined Mar 1, 2008
    Auburn Hills, Michigan
    I have logged 45-46 lbs/min on my old setup. Again, I had a lot of money into it. Ecmlink said over 525 horse. Take it for what its worth however, normally 1 lbs/min=10 h/p. Must have been due to the weight of the vehicle. I took a few things out.

    Now this wasnt a normal evo3 16g you would buy. Austin built this for me. So it had his love worked into it.
     

    1K  0

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    11.495 @ 124.750 · 1G DSM
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  23. OHM_Racer

    OHM_Racer Supporting Vendor

    92
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    Joined Jul 4, 2014
    Austin, Texas
    Livedsm4g63 Go check it on a Dyno, i bet there is not even 400hp going to the wheels, OP is asking for at least a 500whp turbo so i don't see this as relative.
     
  24. gofer

    gofer Moderator

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    South Gilbert, Arizona
    Yea, unfortunately the 1lbs/min airflow = 10whp estimate is just that, an estimate, especially when using ECMLinks airflow readings. I'm not saying this is the case for your DSM livdsm4g63 but more often than not, most airflow readings aren't dead nuts accurate especially if you're running Speed Density.

    My car for example, was logging 48lbs/min on the dyno and my boostest and the logged MAP sensor lined up from 5.5k-6k so airflow wasn't inflated yet my car put down 437awhp. Granted, that's still ~9.1lbs/m airflow = 10whp but that's without inflated airflow readings so assuming the same for your logged airflow your car's putting down just over 400awhp which falls short of the OP's goals and you're still probably not hitting 26psi+ until at least 4k.


    FWIW, I installed a BEP 8cm2 hotside on my HTA68, a bigger wastegate spring and setup the ECMLink controlled boost control solenoid and was able to see over 51lbs/m and maintain 28psi to 7.5k. That's putting a lot into what's essentially a td05 frame turbo when a lot less can be done just bolting up a FP Green and getting the same if not better results. I have yet to actually dyno the car with these recent changes but my past HP/TQ numbers wouldn't be a fair comparison seeing is how it would be on a different dyno...
     

    Street Build 16K  12  61

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.634 @ 126.050 · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 2G DSM
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  25. donniekak

    donniekak DSM Wiseman

    4,686
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    Joined Mar 23, 2008
    Surprise, Arizona
    On my car, I swapped the 8cm fp housing on my fp red, for a heavily ported 7cm housing and gained a solid 500 Rpms of spool. I did lose a couple of lbs/min after 7000 Rpms, but I'm still seeing upper 50's at around 30 psi, with fp 2 cams.

    The car is a built 2.0, and is reasonably responsive for the power it makes. I get full boost before 4700 Rpms in the upper gears, and the transient response is great.
     

    Street Build 4K  0

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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