Starting issues - No / Doesn't / Won't Start - MERGED

[prodsm]

All "my car won't start" discussion threads are merged HERE. We've basically made it easier for those who insist upon not searching by grouping together all threads from those with similar issues so you can just scroll through and see some possible solutions. To search for info within this thread, use the "Search This Thread" feature in the black bar about 3" above what you're reading right now.

Could be anything from a loose battery terminal to internal engine damage, and literally everything in between which may involve the electrical, fuel, and ignition system...possibly even something that you screwed up while working on the car yourself. While it's unlikely we're going to diagnose and solve your problem over the internet, feel free to discuss any possible solutions.



I live in Canada and right now its not very warm out, about -30c
my car does not have a block heater too keep it warm.

I tryed to start my car this morning and it wouldent start, ive had this problem before but this time, the car doesnt crank at all it just makes a sound that sounds like an electric drill.

Whats wrong.

Thanks

 

[92gsxbafaro]

i just got a new one haven't even started it yet what wiring should i have looking at?

i had just gotten a new ecu is there any grounds that could be off if so where would they be? im tottally lost here i dont know why they wont pulse. i heard somewhere that there is a failsafe that will cause it to not fire could that be the problem?

 

[yeahitsfast]

I have the same problem also. I pulled out my cam angle sensor and turned it by hand and i could hear the injectors pulse. when i reinstalled it and cranked it, they didnt fire. i tried wiggling the wires to see if there is a ground or power issue through to the cas but no go.

 

[u2slow]

I had this problem in my `90 Laser. I swaped in a `91 ECU and got rid of the `90 ECU. No problem since.

There`s a thread here on tuners about the swap.

 

[95eclipseguy]

This may help you.

http://www.vfaq.com/mods/ecu-harness-1G.html

 

[92gsxbafaro]

what should i look for that would be causing this? the grounds?

 

[92AWDHX40]

Do you have any pics to show us.

 

[95eclipseguy]

Have you checked or do you have a way to make sure that you are getting voltage to your injectors?

If you don't have voltage to them, then you either have an ECU or a wiring issue. Again, if you don't have voltage, check the pins on the ECU (see the link I posted above)to see if it's sending voltage. If it is, it's a wiring problem. If it's not, borrow/buy a known ecu and try it.

If you do have voltage, the resistor pack may be the culprit. It's located on the firewall right behind the throttlebody. It's silver in color with 4 white wires coming out of it.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=120569&d=1300589475

You can test it too. Do a quick search and I'm sure you will find it quick enough.

If you don't have a meter to test with, google how to make a test light for 12v. Borrow/buy one. You will need it sooner or later.

Short of driving over there this is the best I can do.

 

[triggerx]

I have a 1g 90 talon tsi awd, and its been running good for the most part. Today I noticed what almost seems like a knocking noise near the timing belt. The noise gets progressively louder if you hold it around 1500-2000 rpms. Btw there's no cel light on.

Unfortunately when I came to a stop light I thought I had stalled out. I tried to start the car but it refused to start.

After getting it home Ive removed the upper timing cover, and the timing belt looks good. Ive drained the oil(no metal shavings from what I can see)(However there was only like 2 quarts in there.
I looked at the harmonic balancer and it too looks ok.

I have had the timing belt and water pump recently done( probably like 6months) by aamco, but I wouldn't be surprised if they fudged something up. Replaced everything, pullies and water pump.
About a year and a half ago I replaced the harmonic balancer with

A Dorman unit as well, not sure if this has anything do with it.
Hopefully tonight I get a chance to pull that cover off. But the noise just seems to high up to be coming from that point


Right now the car doesnt even turn the motor, i marked the timing with a sharpie but even after turning the key the mark doesnt move at all.

some pics
ImageShack Album - 14 images
Any ideas?

 

[cliffkemp]

I have a 1g 90 talon tsi awd, and its been running good for the most part. Today I noticed what almost seems like a knocking noise near the timing belt. I don't know if its engine knock ### it seems like the sound is focused near the timing belt cover. The noise gets progressively louder if you hold it around 1500-2000 rpms. Btw there's no cel light on.

I have had the timing belt and water pump recently done( probably like 6months) by aamco, but I wouldn't be surprised if they fudged something up.
About a year and a half ago I replaced the harmonic balancer with a Dorman unit as well, not sure if this has anything do with it.
Hopefully tonight I get a chance to pull that cover off. But the noise just seems to high up to be coming from that point


Any ideas?

It sounds like your 'new' balancer may be separating. When you take the timing cover off, you will know if it is that. It could also be, they did not bolt something down right when they did all the work to your car and something came loose.

 

[96' Eclipse GS]

Do I hear warranty, anyone? Really, there is nothing that you can say or try to trouble shoot without removing the timing cover in this case and seeing the damages...

 

[cliffkemp]

Do I hear warranty, anyone? Really, there is nothing that you can say or try to trouble shoot without removing the timing cover in this case and seeing the damages...

Let's just hope it is not too bad though...It happened to me as well. It just gouged out the cover some. I caught it, somewhat, early and, I had a fluid dampner put on to cure it once and for all.

 

[triggerx]

So the car just gave out on me, died in the middle of the street at a stop light. Now it just like cranks, but the motor won't turn over.

 

[gameover95]

I know the timing belt tensioners make those noises when they go, a very loud tapping sound, my 98 gst that I used to have, did the same thing but it was a connecting rod bearing, never made a noise during idle, just when you revv'ed it up :[

Sold her for 2g's.

 

[triggerx]

IDK I havent seen any noticeable differences with the timing belt, it doesnt look broke, and the alternator belt isnt loose or anything.
So im still at a lost because nothing looks too bad.

Will a harmonic balancer prevent the car from starting?

BTW the motor doesnt even crank over, i guess the starter is just doing its thing, but the motor doesnt crank at all.

Here some random pictures, not sure if they help at all
http://imageshack.us/g/338/imag0444tl.jpg/

 

[92gsxbafaro]

i tested the resistor pack that seemed good and i checked the mpi fuse its good and it said it was getting 12 volts to the fuse so that means that the ecu part is working right?

what is between the mpi fuse and the injectors it must be something in there right?

okay so i have power at the injectors but no pulse when i crank it i have spark.. so that must mean the wiring is fine would you think ecu at this point?

 

[96' Eclipse GS]

IDK I havent seen any noticeable differences with the timing belt, it doesnt look broke, and the alternator belt isnt loose or anything.
So im still at a lost because nothing looks too bad.

Will a harmonic balancer prevent the car from starting?

BTW the motor doesnt even crank over, i guess the starter is just doing its thing, but the motor doesnt crank at all.

Here some random pictures, not sure if they help at all
ImageShack Album - 14 images

Answer First Question: No, the Harmonic Balancer will not cause the car not to start, unless it has moved and is caught on something.

From the photos, I can see a few things I saw. Up to you, if you want to do something about it? Timing Belt looks to be fitted tight. Spark plug looks to be white tipped, so you are running lean, but it may just be the picture quality?? Your best bet, again is to remove the timing cover and see if one of your tensioners has came loose or fallen off.

 

[WIKDGSX619]

Take it back to the shop that did the work! Its also a possibility that theres a issue with your balance shafts if they havent been deleted but were installed wrong.

 

[dasander]

Hi everyone,

I've been troubleshooting a No-Start issue for quite some time and been following the excellent Tech Article on this site to help diagnose the problem:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-miscellaneous/217951-how-diagnose-no-start.html

Background:
-My 2g dsm cranks when trying to start, but I don't hear the fuel injectors clicking.
-I checked the spark plugs with a spark plug tester and everything looked good.
-I am getting fuel to the rail and the fuel pressure gauge on my fuel pressure regulator reads about 40 psi.
-I measured resistance at the injector clips and they read 2-3 ohms.
-Replaced the MFI relay and Injector Resistor Pack from my parts car(same year/model) and still no start.
-CEL comes on for 5 seconds after I turn the key to the ON position.

What's interesting is that I do have some fuel spraying from the injectors when I pull the fuel rail off, though it seems rather weak and is not a powerful spray; more of a squirt. In addition, I checked the voltage on the harness side of the injector terminal with a Noid light set from autozone and it did not flash indicating that there is no voltage going to the injector terminals.
My question is, is it possible for the injectors to spray without getting voltage to the terminals? Do noid lights work for checking voltage at the injector terminals for dsm's?

Any other suggestions as to what might be causing my No-Start issue would also be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

 

[triggerx]

Answer First Question: No, the Harmonic Balancer will not cause the car not to start, unless it has moved and is caught on something.

From the photos, I can see a few things I saw. Up to you, if you want to do something about it? Timing Belt looks to be fitted tight. Spark plug looks to be white tipped, so you are running lean, but it may just be the picture quality?? Your best bet, again is to remove the timing cover and see if one of your tensioners has came loose or fallen off.

I think it may have been but Im going to take it to the shop since there is still a warranty on it, check this out,

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Looks like the ridges have separated from the belt.
By the way, is there suppose to be grease within the cover?

As for the plugs, you think that could be due to the timing being off?

 

[triggerx]

Answer First Question: No, the Harmonic Balancer will not cause the car not to start, unless it has moved and is caught on something.

From the photos, I can see a few things I saw. Up to you, if you want to do something about it? Timing Belt looks to be fitted tight. Spark plug looks to be white tipped, so you are running lean, but it may just be the picture quality?? Your best bet, again is to remove the timing cover and see if one of your tensioners has came loose or fallen off.

I think it may have been but Im going to take it to the shop since there is still a warranty on it, check this out,

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Looks like the ridges have separated from the belt.
By the way, is there suppose to be grease within the cover?

As for the plugs, you think that could be due to the timing being off, because the spark plugs are fairly new honestly?

 

[92gsxbafaro]

If the ECU does not detect a ignition pulse (pin109) it will shut down the injectors and then the fuel pump (via MPI).

how to i get it to detect an ignition pulse

 

[92gsxbafaro]

okay so i have power at the injectors but no pulse when i crank it i have spark.. so that must mean the wiring is fine would you think ecu at this point?

 

[shanebro]

Get the CEL figured out and go from there, but first i'd take a look at the starter and grounds.

 

[u2slow]

Pin 109 is the white wire from the ignition output transistor. It supplies the tach signal.

When I had this problem, the ECU was seeing the CAS signal but not supplying an output to the injectors. Since I dislike the `90 electronics, it was easy for me to make the decision to upgrade to `91. This upgrade included changing the output transistor to a `91.

Looking back, my problem may have been due to a bad ignition transistor, not the ECU. Even though I was getting a spark.

Try changing the output transistor for a known good one.

 

[dasander]

First, thanks for the reply and suggestion! From what I read on this forum however, when the CEL light comes on for the first 5 seconds after you turn the key to the ON position and then the CEL goes off; this verifies that the ECU is working properly.
Quote from Tech article http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-miscellaneous/217951-how-diagnose-no-start.html:
[VERIFY ECU OPERATION
Turn the key to the "ON" position and watch for the CEL to illuminate, it should come on for approximately 5 seconds and then go off. In addition to watching the CEL, also watch the stock boost gauge, the needle should move halfway up the gauge.
It NEVER lights up: The ECU might have a blown sensor ground or the 20A MOTOR fuse, in the fusebox under the hood, is blown or missing (my friends like taking mine). The 2g ECU sensor ground is Pin 92 (2g ECU Pinout) and can be visually checked by pulling the casing off the ECU and looking at the solder run. Below is a picture of a REPAIRED sensor ground that was blown, thanks ECMLink! You can check continuity with a multimeter between pin 92 and the solder point where the red arrows pointing.
It DOESN'T go off: The ECU has a DTC stored on it and you'll want to hook up a scanner to see what it is.]