Post your experiences with Emissions laws in your state

[Ludachris]

I keep seeing smog discussions pop up here and there. It would be nice to build a thread where everyone who has had difficulty passing their state emissions test can post their experiences. Let's assume that all of your emissions equipment, if hooked up, was in good working order. We don't want to hear "my EGR valve was bad". That's a given. We're more interested in hearing what visual mods under your hood drew a red flag for your smog official, or what mods you have done that prevented you from passing the actual sniffer test (like cams, etc). If you haven't had a bad experience, and your car is heavily modded, let us know too (unless you know a buddy who passes your car - then we don't care).

This thread should serve two purposes:

1. To help those of us that want to know how far we can take our cars and still be able to pass the sniffer test, even if we can't necessarily pass the visual test in our state.

2. What visual mods prevented your car from being tested. We all know that CA has some of the most strict smog laws, and many shops will not even test your car if they see parts under your hood that do not look factory-installed.

Let's hear it guys. For those in Canada, post about Canadian emissions laws here:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=165531

 

[Whitetal]

I just smogged my 1g Talon. It failed again. It failed last February. $40 each time. This sucks. I changed the cat. The newer cat helped it to pass one section of the smog but it fail another section of the smog which it fail last time and it got worser. Can anyone help? Everything is ok now except for the Nox. What the hell is that? is that Nitrous Oxide? On the actual printout it shows it as NO and measured in PPM what ever that is. Pounds Per Milie. Parts Per Mile. Per Minute. The tech writes in the notes why I fail as NOX. It is a gas or is it knock like the knock sensor? The results show 2660 for my NO at 15 mph. The max amount of NO is 779 and a gross poluter is 1973. So my car is a gross polluter. Last time the NO was 2000. Damn what is it? Should I use 110 octane.

 

[1LE]

I just smogged my 1g Talon. It failed again. It failed last February. $40 each time. This sucks. I changed the cat. The newer cat helped it to pass one section of the smog but it fail another section of the smog which it fail last time and it got worser. Can anyone help? Everything is ok now except for the Nox. What the hell is that? is that Nitrous Oxide? On the actual printout it shows it as NO and measured in PPM what ever that is. Pounds Per Milie. Parts Per Mile. Per Minute. The tech writes in the notes why I fail as NOX. It is a gas or is it knock like the knock sensor? The results show 2660 for my NO at 15 mph. The max amount of NO is 779 and a gross poluter is 1973. So my car is a gross polluter. Last time the NO was 2000. Damn what is it? Should I use 110 octane.

Step 1, check EGR for proper function.
Step 2, check BISS (the right way!) and fuel mixture
Step 3, check (or just replace) the O2 sensor
Step 4, make sure you have a "3-way" cat

 

[Whitetal]

Is that what effects NOX? Is it just overall stuff that effects NOX? Well I think the o2 might be pretty old. I'm pretty sure red hot glowing manifold temperatures can kill an o2.

 

[sciroccosven]

Yeah I see what your saying, but it's a little different here. They don't write the mileage on the back of the sticker, just the name of the person or shop that inspected it. That's if the person or shop decides to write it on it. We have a sheet of paper that is documented when the car is inspected that's given to us and were suppose to, and that's a big suppose to keep the proof of inspection in our glove box. But... not everyone always keeps up with it over a years time. I guess it's in the computer by way of vin# Plus every year the inspection sticker is a different color where I live. We have two different color of stickers, one for the 95 and older, and one color for the ones that have to pass obd2. I guess here where I live they don't care as much. Anyone could unhook the speedometer cable and rehook it back if that were the case to cheat on mileage, so I don't see how they would ever know. Plus...theres tons of old beaters around here that the odometer doesn't work or hasn't worked in years. Then you have people that can buy used gauge cluster's, or instrament panels from boneyards as well, so theres another factor to consider. All they are concerned with here is the vin# tag# ect. It's very difficult if not impossible to tamper with the odometer on newer vehicals, unless you unhook the speedometer cable. They may go by the current mileage that you had by your vin# but alot can happen within a years time if you have had to do some repairs. Example: My car has 83,000 miles on it but I have an extra gauge cluster that has 71,000 on it. All I would have to do is swap back and forth. Anyways... that's cool, your lucky, I wished they did that here where I live. Here's a pic of my inspection sticker. http://sep8.imghost.us/lemtge.jpg

Interesting. I do find it hard to believe that the insurance companies and state govts. do not require that state inspections keep consistent numbers on vehicle mileage. Obviously if you switched odometers and edned up with less mileage then wouldnt give you an exemption. My post was just give those who dont drive their cars much a way out. As long as you have someone willing to look the other way on your state inspection then you are good to go. I havent seen this confirmed but its said there is a set amout of $600 spent on corrective measure that will automatically pass you but like I said. I have never seen or heard of that being confirmed. Its more than likely that your local performance shop will be a good place to ask questions.

 

[Whitetal]

This is what I found out from smogcheck.ca.gov. It answered my question about NO.

NO (PPM): Oxides of nitrogen (more commonly called NOx) are odorless gases that help form smog, and give smog its characteristic brown color. NO is produced when temperatures in the combustion chambers exceed 2500 degrees Fahrenheit. Excessive engine temperatures could be caused by a lean fuel mixture, by retarded timing, by carbon buildup inside the combustion chamber, or by a malfunctioning engine cooling system. The function of the EGR System is to reduce NO. Unhealthy levels of NO emissions result in a vehicle failing its Smog Check. NO is measured in parts per million (PPM).

I'd should check on my EGR. I don't think it's working correctly either. Do you guys from out of CA have an EGR? I heard that the EGR is only on vehicles made for CA.

 

[Whitetal]

How much do you guys think the ecu will effect emissions? I realized that I've been using the incorrect ECU for my DSM. Since I live in CA I bought a CA ECU. My DSM says on the hood that it's a Federal vehicle. Would it be better to use a Federal ECU to match the emissions on the car? Doesn't CA use stricter values on emissions than Federal smog? That's would be wrong because my DSM is a Federal vehicle and it's being smogged with CA emissions. I don't know.

 

[Defiant]

Federal ECUs don't have EGR controls. No, you probably won't be able to pass smog with one, although I don't know for a fact that the EGR check is any more than looking to see that it's there, and hooking up the Mityvac to open it (or prying it open with a screwdriver). I'm not sure the test program has enough brains to actually try to manipulate it during a test and look for results.

 

[1LE]

Federal ECUs don't have EGR controls. No, you probably won't be able to pass smog with one, although I don't know for a fact that the EGR check is any more than looking to see that it's there, and hooking up the Mityvac to open it (or prying it open with a screwdriver). I'm not sure the test program has enough brains to actually try to manipulate it during a test and look for results.

Federal 1g's do have EGR controls. What's missing is really the EGR temp sensor. No on-board diagnostic to verify operation... Can't think of any other differences I've run across in other areas, but EGR is really the only part of it I know much about on DSM's (lots of time invested in getting a 6-bolt / '95 emissions setup working exactly right!).

 

[Defiant]

Federal 1g's do have EGR controls. What's missing is really the EGR temp sensor. No on-board diagnostic to verify operation... Can't think of any other differences I've run across in other areas, but EGR is really the only part of it I know much about on DSM's (lots of time invested in getting a 6-bolt / '95 emissions setup working exactly right!).

He's on a '91.

 

[Ludachris]

I'm unsticky-ing this thread, but you can quickly find it in the FAQ Forum.

 

[mmmmbst]

I work at one in Ohio, and here it's not to fussy. First they go through an inspection for leaky fluids and overheating. Then if your cars a 95 or older you get the asm2525 test where we roll the car on the dynamometer. If your car is a 96 or newer you get the OBDII test. Bad part about that though is if your Check Engine light is on you have a 99% chance of failure but at least it will through out a code saying whats wrong. That other 1% is if the test gets downgraded then were roll it on the dine. If your check engine light is one and you need your car tested and your positive your car will pass on the dine, then just disconnect the battery for like 5 minutes, it will erase all the codes we need for the OBDII and your car will be downgraded. If your car is 95 or older and has AWD or had 4x4 or traction control that doesn't disengage we do a forced idle test, which means no dine but still collecting exhaust gasses while we idle your car at 2500rpm. BUT the best part is if you can collect over $5000 in receipts in modifications the state will give you an exemption from the testing which means you don't need your car to be tested ever again and you DO NOT need a cat, plus you get collector plates.

 

[Defiant]

We appreciate the gloating from those who don't have to deal with it, but the topic is " Post your experiences with Emissions laws in your state".

If you don't have any, then there's none to have experiences with, are there? And please go to hell very much, thank you .

 

[omegis13]

Is registering the car in a different state and running an out of state plate not a universal solution to emissions? I have a friend from here in Oklahoma that goes to school in an emissions controlled part of Texas, but he doesn't get run as his car is registered to Oklahoma and has an Oklahoma plate. Also, Oklahoma has no inspections whatsoever, both for emissions and safety .

Greg Heineken

 

[Omega]

Is registering the car in a different state and running an out of state plate not a universal solution to emissions? I have a friend from here in Oklahoma that goes to school in an emissions controlled part of Texas, but he doesn't get run as his car is registered to Oklahoma and has an Oklahoma plate. Also, Oklahoma has no inspections whatsoever, both for emissions and safety .

Greg Heineken

Yeah, because THAT'S legal.

 

[omegis13]

Yeah, because THAT'S legal.

Before Oklahoma got rid of emissions, alot of people who bought new cars would set up a PO box in Texas and register the vehicles and get the plates there. It is perfectly legal to drive and own a vehicle with out of state registration in your home state. From what I understand, all that is required to keep out of state plates in another state is 2 of 3 things)

an out of state license

out of state registration

out of state insurance

The top two can easily be taken care of if your parents don't live in the same state as you; just plan on an annual visit to get your vehicle registered and getting a new license once every four years. So anyway, I don't think that doing this is illegal. Shady, maybe, but not illegal.....

Greg Heineken

 

[Defiant]

Not recommended in this Give-Us-That-Money state:
http://www.chp.ca.gov/prog/cheaters.cgi
Now, then. TOPIC.

 

[laserspeeddemon]

In VA, The Northern Region near DC requiers emissions testing. Fortunately I am REALLY from VA Beach and there are no emissions testing there.

I took my car to get emissions tested orginally in Fairfax, I failed. They mechanic told me to put on my stock items, I did. And STILL failed. Then he wanted me to pay him over $600 to repair the car. I gave him the finger. I think he was trying to rip me off or was just biased to imports. Red neck @#$&^#@%&$.

 

[pepsi21463]

weird. i have a bad o2 sensor and i went in there and i cleared the code before they did the test. when i got my car back i pulled out of the parking lot and the light came back on. but i passed.

sounds similar to my car. i cleared the code for my car then when i pulled out the light popped back on. but i still failed because the car was barely too rich.

 

[TopStreetTurbo]

i live in Waukesha,Wisconsin and there pretty strick up here, but i just registered it up north in prairie Du Chen and only had emissions done when i first bought the car

 

[Bigglesworth87]

I cant seem to get my car to pass a smog test. It passes the visual and sniffer test but when they hook up to my OBDII port It wont pass. The monitors are not set and so I have taken it to Mitsu. They called me today and tell me they cannot get the monitors to set. So, I guess I have to go to the state ref. Thats where I am confused. What happens now? If mitsu cannot fix it, what is the ref going to do? Will I just not have to do that part of the test or what? Anyone ever get screwed this bad?

 

[akdsmer]

I cant seem to get my car to pass a smog test. It passes the visual and sniffer test but when they hook up to my OBDII port It wont pass. The monitors are not set and so I have taken it to Mitsu. They called me today and tell me they cannot get the monitors to set. So, I guess I have to go to the state ref. Thats where I am confused. What happens now? If mitsu cannot fix it, what is the ref going to do? Will I just not have to do that part of the test or what? Anyone ever get screwed this bad?

This was 1 page back in the same thread.........Some smart guy posted it

How to make your car pass...

FIRST: Resetting codes or disconnecting the battery erases the monitors, except for misfire, comprehensive components and fuel. All other start over with each reset/power loss. Fix the reason for the code, and then drive the drivecycles after looking at the following:


OBDII DSM's (1996 and newer. People have a hard time setting these. I have set 3 or 4 doing the following:

1) Verify that the coolant temperature is correct.
2) Verify that the idle switch pid reads OFF when you apply the throttle.
3) Make sure ALL loads are off (including A/C which doesn't matter here

UNDERSTAND:

That the monitor test will have to run twice to set to "complete".

Any voltage drop under 10.0V, especially under cranking conditions will reset the monitors.
These voltage drops can happen for 20mS upon initial cranking, called "counter electromotive force". I have many waveforms of this problem. I will find a way to post these here.. You will not see this with a digital meter. I use one of my labscopes, I'm not sure how to accurately test this without one. Maybe record mode on a higher end meter may catch the lowest voltage. This can be because of weak batteries (sounded fine to me) that dropped while cranking, because of bad starters (One Talon pulled 600 Amps for 40mS dropping the voltage to 8.9V (very good battery ) Sometimes you don't see this at the battery, but find it at the keep-alive power to the PCM. Voltage drops through the system drops the voltage when cranking and will be low enough at the PCM. I do all my tests at the PCM.

What happens is that you start the car and reset the monitors. You drive the car and set the pending monitors. You turn the car off and restart to rerun the monitors and you once again reset the PCM. Can you see the pattern?

A quick tip: use a jump box while performing the restarts on your car while doing the drivecycle. If you have a weak battery/bad starter/voltage drop or whatever, the additional capacity will usually work to get the monitors set (although you look kinda stupid with your hood up jumping your car ).

This post can go on forever. The Load/Speed relationship is very tricky and almost requires a scan tool if you do not have very flat ground. I find myself using the brake to keep speed/load within range.

Your not getting screwed. Fix your car.

 

[Generation X]

I run HKS 264/272 cams and I usually get a cel for cylinder mis-fire. I use my logger to erase the code everytime, and I pass with no problems at all. We just have obd2 testing here where I live. I even passed the test without a cat converter. It can be done.

 

[nate91]

in the techguide, stage 0, most modifications say whether they're smog-legal or not. However hacking your aircan, airbox, or aircanister; whatever you want to call it, is illegal in CA. Just wanted to give the heads up before you go scrapyard hunting like I did.

 

[crunchymilk]

wow guys, reading this thread is quite the horror story for me, it really pisses me off what the gov't does to us tuners. Think about how much smog a 16wheeler lets off every time he accelerates?

Let me explain my average inspection

1. Give keys
2. Watch the guy start the car.
3. He will leave it running while he has a co-worker make sure the brake light and the signal lights work.
4. Put it in 1st and drive 5 feet to make sure the brake pedal works.
5. Pay $12.50

This is in San Antonio, TX, by the way. This is how it's been on all my cars. I run a 3" no cat by the way.

 

[02BLUR]

Washington State:
My 90 Talon Tsi AWD has a big 16G, CAT only, all emissions removed, visibly hacked up air can, upper IC pipe. They don't ever pop the hood. Passes easily.

But I think its 2010 they are updating the requirements.

Then in 2015 my Talon will be "too old to test"


Oh and one more thing. If its AWD, they don't even have 4 wheel rollers, so you just do a REV test. So its not really even loading the motor...

Only FWD do they get in a drive it on the rollers...