oil catch can [Merge]

[Rice Burner]

I just ordered my intake and K & N filter from Dejon and now I'm looking for a Catch Can. Does anyone know where I can get one of these? I have looked on some web sites with no luck, with the exception of (i think) Machv for $99.

Any help would be appreciated.

Also does anyone know if any one sells the rubber window trim that goes on the door for the window. You know the one at the top of the main part of the door on the outside. The black coating has pealed off and looks pretty bad.

Thanks in advance!

 

[oldman]

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/instructions/catchcaninstructions.htm

1. They do recommend the setup for track only car, There is a huge difference between taking a couple of runs down the track vs. a dd. Most of the danger of a disabled pcv, assuming a fairly healthy motor, comes from idling at a light after hard runs.

2. I have read the RRE article many times in the past and have adressed it many times in other threads, I respefully disagree with RRE's claim that venting both the pcv and breather will yield twice the ventilation capacity. There is a difference between pressure relief and ventilation, twice the pressure relief capacity yes, ventilation no (ventilation as in removing blow by from the crankcase to prevent fuel settlement in your oil). We all know the best way to ventilate a smoky room is to open two windows and stick a fan in one of them. Opening two windows without a fan on a calm/windless day will do little to clear smoke out of the room.

You can also verify this yourself by opening your oil cap right after a hard run, take a good smell and observe the amount of vapor/smoke present in the crankcase. Now reinstall the pcv and repeat test, the results will speak for itself.

The only thing I'm trying to say here is, no meter how much your A/F would change, you can adjust it with fuel control device....
I agree there has to be a change, and this change can be fixed...95% of people here has a boost leak(most of us dont know that we even have it) , which i believe is more hurting than this issue with PCV route...

Again you continue to adress the smallest part of a pcv system (a/f ratio) and ignore the more important parts (see above).

 

[mirkoelek]

1. They do recommend the setup for track only car, There is a huge difference between taking a couple of runs down the track vs. a dd. Most of the danger of a disabled pcv, assuming a fairly healthy motor, comes from idling at a light after hard runs.

2. I have read the RRE article many times in the past and have adressed it many times in other threads, I respefully disagree with RRE's claim that venting both the pcv and breather will yield twice the ventilation capacity. There is a difference between pressure relief and ventilation, twice the pressure relief capacity yes, ventilation no (ventilation as in removing blow by from the crankcase to prevent fuel settlement in your oil). We all know the best way to ventilate a smoky room is to open two windows and stick a fan in one of them. Opening two windows without a fan on a calm/windless day will do little to clear smoke out of the room.

You can also verify this yourself by opening your oil cap right after a hard run, take a good smell and observe the amount of vapor/smoke present in the crankcase. Now reinstall the pcv and repeat test, the results will speak for itself.


Again you continue to adress the smallest part of a pcv system (a/f ratio) and ignore the more important parts (see above).

Does it really affect oil that much if there is no venting under valve cover, how bad it could be, what if you change oil every 2000 miles.... Do you have any proves about this...another thing you are saying, we wont smell fuel under the hood and that is other adventage?! - no biggie about this to me ...What happens under the boost?!!You and me both know that under boost PCV is closed, and that is the time when we have the most pressure under the valve cover, the only left realese is the breather valve. Now, if you make PCV valve to flow both ways, and hook that into the catch can, you get better release of pressure under the valve cover... I really dont know how much that dirty air can effect the oil (if i dont know , I dont wanna talk and BS about it ) ... Last thing here is i dont wanna make the wiseman mad...just gave my opinion, it looks i should be quiet before i check on this one... happy boosting

 

[Stanford]

Why don't you take a quick read and learn about the true functions of the pcv system before you make a generalized/ignorant statement. The question the original poster asked was will it affect a/f ratio and the factual answer is yes no matter how minute the effects may be. A/F effects however, is not the main reason why one should not remove vacuum from the pcv system, venting the breather I understand (actually not since the solution is as simple as an inline filter/catch can like the one defiant posted) but the pcv should not be removed unless replaced with a vacuum pump of some sort because ventilation (not pressure relief but the swapping of blow by with fresh air) of the crankcase depends greatly on a vacuum source (pcv) and supply of fresh air (breather). A vented catch can setup with the pcv disabled will be enough to relief pressure if the motor is in good condition but will do very little to ventilate dirty air out of your crankcase once the pressure is equalized and most of the fuel mixture will end up in your oul. Ever wonder why your catch can smokes after hard runs? Ever wonder why your oil smells like gas all the time?

There are many threads specifically discussing ways to keep your intake tract clean while maintaining the integrity of the pcv system, creating other problems in attampt to solve another (ie venting both pcv and brather to a catch can) is no solution if you ask me.

Alright that link did provide a little insight and I do understand what it's saying/claiming.

In short your main beef was this if I am understanding you correctly.

Do some hard pulls, blow by is created.
Get off throttle and the PCV gets opened by vacuum.
This sucks out the blow by smoke/fumes if any, which also contain some airborne oil "gunk".
This keeps the oil a little cleaner.

Am I correct?

 

[Xplicit93AWD]

Ok now I have been reading this thread as it goes along and I have a quick qyestion. To clarify the correct way to have a catch can installed for a D/D is as shown

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Sorry for the messy diagram I did the best I can.
I dont kno why it came out so small here is a link maybe it shows better.
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f317/xplicit93awd/untitled.jpg

 

[staticbrainwash]

Still way way small.

But all in all, the best set-up is VC breather vent--->catch can---->intake. And leave the PVC as is, oem PVC---->IM.

 

[Xplicit93AWD]

Thats is what I am not understanding lets say you dont have a nipple coming from your intake pipe since I have a 3" intake pipe only w/ my BOV tube what do i do with the other side of the catch can?

 

[oldman]

Am I correct?

No, I'm well aware that you can change your oil more often, play with afc to combat possible a/f changes, wipe down the engine bay every so often and most importantly, checking and emptying catch can/fuel filter to prevent clogging. My main beef is that most seems to be going the venting route because everyone else is doing it wihtout understanding why and why not. I have done my best in this thread to state "why" one should recirculate and I have yet to get one good reason as to "why not" besides "dirty intake tract" which can easily be addressed by inline filtration. All I got so far are bunch of posts explaining how these possible harmful side effects (each carries more merrit than "keeping your intake manifold clean" BTW) that need not be there in the first place can be compensated for or the usual "it won't make much of a difference". At least with a vented BOV you gain the "cool" sound but in this case you gain nothing. My main problem with a vented pcv setup really isn't in the details, not that they're not important, rather is the wisdom of doing it in the first place. You need to show me what I'll gain before I consider whether the side effects are worth putting up with.

 

[Stanford]

Well I did it honestly for a couple reasons.

First - I have read it allows more pressure relief at higher RPM's, which I don't see how it couldn't.

Second- I don't have hot oily air being sucked into my intake manifold at idle.

Third- I do like the non-dirty intake system. I know, I know a filter but I just like simple and two short hoses going into a can are simpler than running hoses to and from things and cluttering up my engine bay.

Fourth- I had never heard of any ill effects of running it my way, so I didn't see a problem.

I am all for learning and doing things the right way, trust me.

I will look more into this but it's looking like I may put the PCV back but have it filtered.

 

[Xplicit93AWD]

Ok well maybe my question got over looked but its ok. I just wanted some clarification on this. I am not understanding lets say you dont have a nipple coming from your intake pipe since I have a 3" intake pipe only w/ my BOV tube what do I do with the other side of the catch can? As of now I guess I have the incorrect way hooking it up to the PVC valve and blocking off the hole on the IM. But I always see some smoke coming out of the breather on top of my catch can so im trying to fix that but I dont know how or what is the cause of it. Maybe it's jusked hooked up wrong so can someone point me the correct direction with my setup.

 

[staticbrainwash]

Like i said before, to run it the way oldman mentioned you need to drill and tap the intake and put in a new nipple.

 

[staticbrainwash]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OIL-...6QQihZ005QQcategoryZ46098QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

If i got a catch can like that how do you drain it when it needs to be drained. It doesn't look like it has a plug on the bottom, but you can't really see the bottom. I just like this one because it's black kinda matches my engine motif. Too much polished isn't my bag.

 

[oldman]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OIL-...6QQihZ005QQcategoryZ46098QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

If i got a catch can like that how do you drain it when it needs to be drained. It doesn't look like it has a plug on the bottom, but you can't really see the bottom. I just like this one because it's black kinda matches my engine motif. Too much polished isn't my bag.

I don't see a drain valve but you can easily drill and tap (your favorite) for one on the bottom of the can. In addition, this type of catch cans doesn't come with an inter fitler like the one I have, you can stuff a couple of them kitchen metal wire scrapper to promote oil settlement and minimize the amount of oil passing through an empty can. I must say, if the catch can is as good as it looks, $10 is a great deal.

 

[Xplicit93AWD]

Ok I guess I will look for a big enough nipple to drill and tap a hole in the intake and also would you guys recommend me to put something in my catch can I have a RRE catch can.

 

[oldman]

Ok I guess I will look for a big enough nipple to drill and tap a hole in the intake and also would you guys recommend me to put something in my catch can I have a RRE catch can.

The RRE one is the same design as the ebay one ($80 ), metal wire will promote oil to stick to it and drips down to the bottom of the can.

 

[staticbrainwash]

I'll pick up the 10 buck one then and just drill a hole for a bolt. Actually, the filtered type that you have old man, where did you get it? And is the filter replaceable?

Also, what would you suggest using for a drain plug? I would think just a small bolt with an o-ring or crush washer.

 

[oldman]

Also, what would you suggest using for a drain plug? I would think just a small bolt with an o-ring or crush washer.

A bolt with just o-ring or you can get fancy and do this.

I got mine from ebay 2 years ago, last time I searched I couldn't find it anymore. It's hard to expain what it's made of, it's like harded sponge. I rinse it with hot water once in a while and blow dry it before reintstall.

 

[Stanford]

I just checked mine this weekend and their is indeed a slight oily film on the firewall behind the breather filter. That does not sit well with me, I like a clean engine bay.

 

[RedTurboEclipse]

Does vented VC really affect vaccuum/fuel trims? I don't get that much blow by, but I hate just seeing this hose dangling. My intake pipe does not have a fitting for the hose, but if it will make the car run "better" I am up for installing one.

Which leads me to my question, im assuming the correct fitting can be purchased at home depot? For those who put it in themselves, what was the size bit you used, tools, etc.

 

[daren_p]

JM Fabrications makes a really nice catch can & in a couple different sizes. I got the small one, can be seen here:

http://www.jmfabrications.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/22/products_id/37

They can be ordered as a sealed can without the breather filter for the same price. Abit more expensive then the ebay cans but excellent quality & customer service.

As to how much a vented catch can will effect your fuel trims, this I don't know as I've always done it properly and not vented it. I can say there is a noticeable difference in your g/rev at idle with the crank case vented so chances are it will effect your trims...

 

[staticbrainwash]

For anyone who was following this, And for Oldman as well. The ebay catch can i got (black one for around 20 bucks shipped) looks incredible. Has a drain in the bottom and is made from a nice thick material.

I can take pics if anyone wants to see it. It also came with wounting hardware, clamps, hose, and a couple extra fittings. For 20 bucks, it's a really nice piece.

 

[Dream On]

I say keep the pvc the way it is and run a filter for the valve cover breather. If you want a clean intake manifold, get water injection. Oh, and Staticbrainwash, post some pics up if you don't mind.

 

[DGajre777]

Staticbrainwash - Post some pics please.

 

[staticbrainwash]

Alright, here's some pics. I apologize for the floor, cats went crazy today and were wrestling. It looks pretty good for what it is and needs to be. Paint might be a little iffy over time, but hell, it was 20 bucks. This is going in as soon as i build my new leak tester (since everything is coming out anyway).

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[PieEyedPiper]

Nice product for sure, but, I'm just not seeing the value of this over an inline filter off of the valve cover breather port and then a line going back to the intake.

 

[Dream On]

You'd have to replace an inline filter eventually probably. I hear some people change theirs at every oil change... After awhile, I'd think it'd just be better to do a catch can instead.