New clutch installed, won't disengage now. ???

[TajMan]

The car is a '90 Talon Tsi AWD.

Ok, well I didn't JUST install a new clutch, I've been through an incredible ammount of problems with this car. I bought it already disassembeled, just a shortblock in the car. I've been through 2 engines, 4 times dropping the tranny, 4 starter motors, etc. So now I finally have it running. The last time I put the engine/tranny in the car, it was with a new clutch disk, new pressure plate, new throw out bearing, and a re-ground flywheel.

Well its all together now, and the problem its having is the clutch won't release. The system has been bled, no air in the lines, and the slave and master clyinders AREN'T leaking. I don't know what the problem is. The pedal just seems extra hard and you can't feel the clutch "releasing" when you press it.

I used to have a '90 GSX and I had to do a clutch job and I had the same problem! I had to drop the tranny on that car like 5 times before I got it working! Drop it once, grind more off the flywheel, re-install, drop again, grind more off the flywheel, etc. Finally to fix that one I installed a washer behind the "pivot" bolt for the shift fork and it moved things close enough so the throw out bearing pushed the fins in far enough when you depressed the pedal. (I know now I most likely had a bent shift fork that time.)

Its just so weird I'd have the same problem doing clutch jobs on two different cars of the same model. Is there some common issue I don't know about. What does everyone think is wrong this time? I'm not ready to drop the tranny any more on this car I just might have to sell it with its problem for less money.

 

[TajMan]

I thought of two things to try.

#1 adjust the adjuster on the clutch pedal all the way out so its pushing as far as it can

and

#2 put some bb's in the little indented area on the shift fork so that the rod on the slave cylinder pushes it that much farther. I might JB weld some bb's in.

 

[TajMan]

BUMP

Any other ideas?

 

[NOMIEZVR4]

how much is the slavecylinder rod moving out..
also i had the same problem and i had gotten the extended slave rod..same exact siatuion you were in and it ended up being the clutch assembly

 

[TajMan]

It ended up being the clutch assembly? What exactly was wrong with your clutch assembly?

When I had this problem 4 years ago, I took the tranny off and got the flywheel reground like 3 times. I also tried different clutch disk/pressure plate assemblies too. The shop grinding my flywheel wouldn't grind it any more because they thought it was going to get out of spec and they thought the clutch wouldn't HOLD (when I was still having the problem of the clutch not RELEASING). -- finally installing the washer behind the shift fork pivot jimmy-riged the problem and got it barely working (engaged when the pedal was right on the floor).

This time, a shop has had my car (originally to fix a different problem), and they have just told me the clutch wouldn't release. They have bled the clutch many times, and the slave and master cylinders AREN'T leaking. Thats all I know. When I get the car back tomorrow I'm going to adjust the master clyinder rod by the pedal, hoping for the best.

 

[NOMIEZVR4]

First make sure that the flywheel is machined correctly. A wrong step height will not allow the clutch to disengage.

Since you have determined that the hydraulic system of the clutch is good, the next step is to ensure that the adjustment point is well...adjusted. Have you adjusted the rod underneath the dashboard yet? That could be the cause of your problems. Do that and get back to us.

Nomie

 

[DsMWookie]

Ok where do I start I've dropped my transmission far more than you and it ended up killing my motor (shitty clutch)


1) What clutch are you using in the car?

2) DO NOT put bb's in ## clutch fork that is just wrong, do it right and never look back.

3) Check the pedal assembly for any play if you let the clutch pedal up and it will raise another inch or two by hand then you have accessive play in your pedal assembly. (ill find the link a little later to show you how to fix it)

4) Your clutch fork is pretty much either gonna break or work its a cast metal and isn't very maleable. It wouldn't hurt to replace it with a SS one or a new one from the factory but I don't see it helping.

5) Flywheel, wow where to start you need to have someone machine it correctly .0608-.0612 I believe is factory spec this is all off the cuff right now. My old roomate was a machinist so I had him put it on the CNC and do it perfectly. I know not everyone has access to this so either find a local shop who can actually resurface it to those specs or mail it off to a competent DSM shop.

6) Shimming the pivot ball is not a bad idea but it is a last resort if its a factory clutch you shouldn't need it.

7) If you have a heavy clutch just be careful because you may run the risk of crank walking your motor (reguardless of 6 or 7bolt). Not saying all heavy clutchs will do this but it happened to me I used a pro clutch 3000lb pressure plate and well I crank walked a 6bolt.


Please let me know if you have any questions I will help all that I can being that I went through all of this and dropped my transmission countless times. Also remember my feedback for this useful information.

dsmwookie

 

[TajMan]

Ok where do I start I've dropped my transmission far more than you and it ended up killing my motor (shitty clutch)
1) What clutch are you using in the car?
2) DO NOT put bb's in ## clutch fork that is just wrong, do it right and never look back.
3) Check the pedal assembly for any play if you let the clutch pedal up and it will raise another inch or two by hand then you have accessive play in your pedal assembly. (ill find the link a little later to show you how to fix it)
4) Your clutch fork is pretty much either gonna break or work its a cast metal and isn't very maleable. It wouldn't hurt to replace it with a SS one or a new one from the factory but I don't see it helping.
5) Flywheel, wow where to start you need to have someone machine it correctly .0608-.0612 I believe is factory spec this is all off the cuff right now. My old roomate was a machinist so I had him put it on the CNC and do it perfectly. I know not everyone has access to this so either find a local shop who can actually resurface it to those specs or mail it off to a competent DSM shop.
6) Shimming the pivot ball is not a bad idea but it is a last resort if its a factory clutch you shouldn't need it.
7) If you have a heavy clutch just be careful because you may run the risk of crank walking your motor (reguardless of 6 or 7bolt). Not saying all heavy clutchs will do this but it happened to me I used a pro clutch 3000lb pressure plate and well I crank walked a 6bolt.
Please let me know if you have any questions I will help all that I can being that I went through all of this and dropped my transmission countless times. Also remember my feedback for this useful information.
dsmwookie

Lol how many times have you dropped it? I've done it like 10 times on an AWD DSM, and many times on other cars too.
1 - its a stock replacement clutch from autozone
3 - There is no play in the pedal. A very good shop has had the car and they can't figure it out.

 

[DsMWookie]

Sounds as if the flywheel might be the problem child. Do you know what specifications the took it too?

 

[TajMan]

Well I got the car back from the shop. The problem was definitely not as bad as the shop made it out to be. Even when I drove the car home the first time, the clutch released a little when the pedal was right on the floor. I adjusted the master cylinder rod out and it woks fine now! 2nd gear grinds but obviously thats a bad syncro.

The pedal seems much harder than normal to press (and it was a stock clutch purchased at autozone). I don't know whats going on with that, but it does work.

 

[DsMWookie]

Your clutch still isn't disengaging properly and the grinding could be because of the disengagment problem.

You need to find out the problem the peda pressuer should be close to stock. It sounds like the clutch isn't collapsing all the way and meeting the point where it unclamps all the way relieve the pressure.

 

[2GeNTSi]

Yeah I was going to suggest adjusting the master cylinder. This problem occured on my brothers 3S VR-4 when we threw in a RPS MAXX Disc and Pressure Plate, resurfaced the flywheel, and put in a new TOB. This was during an engine rebuild my dad on it and once everything was finished, it started, but it grinded going into any gear. Not wanting to remove all that crap all over again, my dad just adjusted the master cylinder and it worked fine.

Now it spun a rod bearing...can't wait till it's up and running again, though that won't be for a while since he hasn't begun working on it yet.