need help on choosing a set up for road course

[snowborder714]

Run straight water with a bottle or two of Water Wetter, and no coolant.
Don't get an FMIC unless absolutely necessary.
Get some better flowing fans if you want, with a fan controller.
Consider getting a vented hood, or put a hood vent (RRE/Carbontrix sells a popular one) in.


I'm not sure if I can recommend tires based on ambient temperature, but more just of how the tires perform. I really like my Dunlop Direzza Star Specs.

 

[greenwitenvy98]

Run straight water with a bottle or two of Water Wetter, and no coolant.
Don't get an FMIC unless absolutely necessary.
Get some better flowing fans if you want, with a fan controller.
Consider getting a vented hood, or put a hood vent (RRE/Carbontrix sells a popular one) in.


I'm not sure if I can recommend tires based on ambient temperature, but more just of how the tires perform. I really like my Dunlop Direzza Star Specs.

How come no FMIC isnt it supost to help out with cooling? And is it bad to run one when road racing?

As far as "better flowing fans" i was thinking in Mishimoto or Flex-a-lite

 

[snowborder714]

The one or two people I know who road race in the southeast run sidemounts. You want all the air possible going through your radiator, and an FMIC will take away a good bit of that. And what air does get through will be hotter because of cooling the charge air.

Removing the A/C condenser (right in front of the radiator) will also help with cooling if you don't want/use the A/C.


Either of those fans would do well. Just check the flow rating before buying.

 

[greenwitenvy98]

The one or two people I know who road race in the southeast run sidemounts. You want all the air possible going through your radiator, and an FMIC will take away a good bit of that. And what air does get through will be hotter because of cooling the charge air.

Removing the A/C condenser (right in front of the radiator) will also help with cooling if you don't want/use the A/C.


Either of those fans would do well. Just check the flow rating before buying.

Oh okay. i dont know about removing the A/C after all it is Miami a/c is a must

Would it be bad to DD the car if in the future you have all the suspention mod's done to it?

 

[snowborder714]

Ya, I don't blame you!!

Nope, it wouldn't be bad at all. The only "bad" thing might be stiff spring rates that don't provide a soft and cushy ride. All depends on what you're looking for in your ride.

 

[greenwitenvy98]

Ya, I don't blame you!!

Nope, it wouldn't be bad at all. The only "bad" thing might be stiff spring rates that don't provide a soft and cushy ride. All depends on what you're looking for in your ride.

I actually like stiff suspensionso i guess i wont have any problem's then

snowborder714 i see that your a gs-t being FWD wont affect you at the track against all the other AWD out there?

 

[snowborder714]

Not that I'm aware of since FWD and AWD are usually in different classes. However, I'm not into competitive/wheel-to-wheel racing yet, so it doesn't matter either way. I'm just out there to learn and have fun.

 

[greenwitenvy98]

Not that I'm aware of since FWD and AWD are usually in different classes. However, I'm not into competitive/wheel-to-wheel racing yet, so it doesn't matter either way. I'm just out there to learn and have fun.

Yea to me its all about having fun i ask cause i see alot of AWD posting on the road course and very few FWD

 

[D's GS-T]

Some of the best road race DSMs over these past few years have been FWD.

 

[greenwitenvy98]

Some of the best road race DSMs over these past few years have been FWD.

Wow thats something i did not know. I'd always thought that the AWD would be on top in the road racing. I guess we learn something new everyday

 

[snowborder714]

Start reading
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/road-course-autocross/325313-time-attack-build-blog.html

 

[greenwitenvy98]

Start reading
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/road-course-autocross/325313-time-attack-build-blog.html

Thats impresive just reading the first blog entry.

That just makes me want to get more into road racing.

 

[DG-FNR]

True but the DGs the best but are mostly out of the typical dsmers budget and over kill for a dd / some track time dsm in my opinion.

If you cannot afford a set of Koni shocks - which are the cheapest real shocks you can find - then you cannot afford to race. Find a new hobby.

DG

 

[UofACATS]

The great thing about building a suspension for your car is you can piece it together. Start with the research, plan the entire suspension, then buy the Konis first. Add the rest as you can afford it.

The AWD dsms are significantly heavier than the FWD, and compete against STi's and Evo's in most cases, assuming the classification is drivetrain. The classification on the track I play on is power-to-weight so in that case I'll take the AWD.

 

[D's GS-T]

AWD DSMs also take a weight penalty if you race in NASA. I don't know if that rule is still in effect or not but, but if it is then it's something you would have to think about if you decided to actually race competively and switched to AWD. Sometimes I think for road racing I'd rather just rock and FWD, but I think either car would be very competitive with the proper set up and the right driver.

 

[greenwitenvy98]

The great thing about building a suspension for your car is you can piece it together. Start with the research, plan the entire suspension, then buy the Konis first. Add the rest as you can afford it.

The AWD dsms are significantly heavier than the FWD, and compete against STi's and Evo's in most cases, assuming the classification is drivetrain. The classification on the track I play on is power-to-weight so in that case I'll take the AWD.

I'll keep that in mind when i start on the actual build. Just do my suspention from scratch.

 

[schemauer]

Just viewing this thread for the first time. We need to back up here and start from scratch. First off, do not take advice from anyone who does not have extensive experience personally with these cars on a road course. There is a lot of misinformation already in prior posts. (Suspension advice, swapping out rear calipers?)

First off, exactly what type of track events are you planning on running? Do you have any experience on road courses? If it is just club-sponsored track days your best investment initially will be a good helmet and track time. Do not get a cheap "motorcycle helmet". Most will not have the proper Snell rating to even get you on the track. Get out to at least a couple of events with an instructor in your car and see how things go. For these first events install a set of fresh rotors (stock) on the front of the car with a good set of pads. Bleed the brakes, fresh fluids in the car, proper tire pressures. Porterfield R4-S might be a good choice for pads that would hold up well on the track and are also useable on the street.

Once you have done this, only then will you want to start the modifications. Keeping in mind that a reliable car with close to stock power levels and reasonable handling will always be more fun and probably faster than a heabily modded car. Nothing ruins the fun more than losing track time to chase down mechanical issues.

 

[Scott McIntyre]

Porterfield R4-S might be a good choice for pads that would hold up well on the track and are also useable on the street.

Here's what my Porterfield R4-S pads looked like after a day at on the road course. YMMV...

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[snowborder714]

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You still recommending the Carbotech's, Scott?

 

[Scott McIntyre]

You still recommending the Carbotech's, Scott?

I've been very happy with my Carbotech brake pads. I run AX6 on the street / autox and XP16 & XP12 on the road course. However, I don't have stock brakes anymore. I have a TCE 13" track kit and EVO8 rears.

Back when I ran stock brakes, I could not find a dual purpose street/track pad that could hold up to the road course; and I tried many of them. It wasn't until I swapped to a real race pad (i.e Hawk Blues) that I found consistent brake performance. But the heat & abrasion was murder on my front rotors, so I ultimately got a big brake kit.

I'm told that my local road course is especially hard on brakes, so that could be a factor. But my experience has taught me that the way to go is to get a set of dedicated race pads for running on the road course.

 

[schemauer]

Good info, Scott, but I think that for a person's first track day the R4-S is still a good compromise pad. You're generally not going to see the speed necessary to ruin a pad in your first day out. You are correct that once you bring your speed up a bit you'll need dedicated track pads (Porterfield R-4 or Hawk) and proper cooling ducts.

I also think that proper braking technique is crucial to any pad holding up well at the track. Way too many drivers are nowhere close the threshold braking; where the brakes are applied almost to the point of lockup for the shortest time possible in each braking zone. Dragging the brakes will overheat them quickly.

 

[snowborder714]

You are correct that once you bring your speed up a bit you'll need dedicated track pads (Porterfield R-4 or Hawk) and proper cooling ducts.

Do you happen to have any info or knowledge around brake ducting for these cars? I figured maybe since you brought it up you might. This is something that I've never really seem implemented successfully on our cars because of the space constraint and lack of people actually needing it or wanting to do it.

 

[D_Eclipse9916]

Do you happen to have any info or knowledge around brake ducting for these cars? I figured maybe since you brought it up you might. This is something that I've never really seem implemented successfully on our cars because of the space constraint and lack of people actually needing it or wanting to do it.

Actually theres plenty of rooms on these cars. The stock fog light brackets will fit 3" hose direct on them for the front. Fab up some brackets that direct air into the rotor (not on the rotor) and your done. There was lots of space for routing the air ducts. Pic below of routing, was going to use silicone ducting for actual use, but ended up getting out of dsms.

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Here's what my Porterfield R4-S pads looked like after a day at on the road course. YMMV...

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​

Overheating of the pad.

Like you discovered, you cant do a mix. Its either full on race pad or full on street pad. My race pads and street pads last forever cause I put them on for their specific use.. Trying to get a compromise pad, is exactly that, a compromise on both ends.

Carbotechs are a fantastic pad, shame performance friction doesnt make pfc06s for DSMS, they wear like iron on my M3 and have insane grip once heated up.

 

[UofACATS]

the R4-S is a good compromise pad.

I agree, although I run R4-Es on the street anyway. They squeal pretty loudly. It doesn't make me want to swap them out though.

 

[SHEARER_TSI]

I am trying to decide between the r4-e and the carbotech xp16 pads. I think both are great pads and you can not go wrong.